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    Your Elvenar Team

Fellowship Adventures 2022

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Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
Presumably, the "bad thing" is that a Main Hall upgrade consumes culture and population that can never be gotten back, and they're running their city with such a tight population/culture budget that the costs the Main Hall upgrade imposes would unacceptably degrade the performance of their city.

Considering in later chapters there are researches and/or upgrades that cannot be completed unless your main hall is high enough level to hold the coins needed, that is a very poor habit to get into. Of all the buildings in the game, the main hall is the one that is most important to keep at max level for your chapter.
 

Zoof

Well-Known Member
Considering in later chapters there are researches and/or upgrades that cannot be completed unless your main hall is high enough level to hold the coins needed, that is a very poor habit to get into. Of all the buildings in the game, the main hall is the one that is most important to keep at max level for your chapter.
I would agree that it is a poor habit to get into, assuming that the player in question is actually interested in researching and chapter progression. If Main Hall levels is being used as a point of optimization, there's probably little (if any) interest in research to begin with. Perpetual chapter 3 city, anyone?

In my case, I got over myself because I wanted to see other numbers get bigger.
 
Considering in later chapters there are researches and/or upgrades that cannot be completed unless your main hall is high enough level to hold the coins needed, that is a very poor habit to get into. Of all the buildings in the game, the main hall is the one that is most important to keep at max level for your chapter.
You need to play the chapter you are in, not future chapters.

In early chapters, there is a significant population crunch. Mindlessly upgrading the main hall can back you into a corner that you can't get out of quickly, and significantly limits the number of factories and workshops you can place and upgrade. The research for main hall levels 10-15 is at the end of chapter 3. The next main hall upgrade isn't until dwarves. If a player mindlessly upgrades the main hall all the way to 15 while in chapter 4, they will be seriously handicapped.

Once you get to guest races it is more important to keep the main hall close to fully upgraded, but the opposite is true in early chapters. Upgrade only if you are struggling for coins.
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
You need to play the chapter you are in, not future chapters.

In early chapters, there is a significant population crunch. Mindlessly upgrading the main hall can back you into a corner that you can't get out of quickly, and significantly limits the number of factories and workshops you can place and upgrade. The research for main hall levels 10-15 is at the end of chapter 3. The next main hall upgrade isn't until dwarves. If a player mindlessly upgrades the main hall all the way to 15 while in chapter 4, they will be seriously handicapped.

Once you get to guest races it is more important to keep the main hall close to fully upgraded, but the opposite is true in early chapters. Upgrade only if you are struggling for coins.

If you have problems like that, then you don't have enough residences. 20 minimum through chapter 8.
 
If you have problems like that, then you don't have enough residences. 20 minimum through chapter 8.
Right. But space is constant. So if I place another residence, it means I have to delete something else. So comparing 2 cities in chapter 5 with the same amount of space, the one with the main hall at level 15 will have more residences and fewer factories and workshops than the one with the main hall at level 9. The only benefit of the main hall is coins (and to a smaller extent, supplies). If you have adequate coins, upgrading the main hall will only hurt you.
 

MaidenFair

Chef - Head Philologist
I would agree that it is a poor habit to get into, assuming that the player in question is actually interested in researching and chapter progression. If Main Hall levels is being used as a point of optimization, there's probably little (if any) interest in research to begin with.
Ahem. ;) As someone who has already planned out her guest race space for the next 2 chapters, is less than 2 weeks away from entering S&D, and just upgraded her Main Hall into Fairies in the last 2-ish weeks, I object. I like to have that population free until it's actually needed. I just make sure to look ahead at the upcoming research to be sure that my MH will hold the requisite number of coins or supplies. I ran up through chapter 9 just fine on a level 13-15 MH, and only upgraded it the last 4 levels because I saw I would need more supplies than I could hold to get into chapter 10. BUT, I held off actually doing the upgrades until I was close to finishing 9.
If you have problems like that, then you don't have enough residences. 20 minimum through chapter 8.
...I've never had more than 8 residences. Granted, I started winning Magic Residences early on in the Spire, but still. There's more than one way to ...I just spent about 5 minutes trying to think of a less disturbing alternative to "skin a cat" and couldn't come up with one. Anyway, multiple methods work. :cool:
 

Smooper

Well-Known Member
You need to play the chapter you are in, not future chapters.

In early chapters, there is a significant population crunch. Mindlessly upgrading the main hall can back you into a corner that you can't get out of quickly, and significantly limits the number of factories and workshops you can place and upgrade. The research for main hall levels 10-15 is at the end of chapter 3. The next main hall upgrade isn't until dwarves. If a player mindlessly upgrades the main hall all the way to 15 while in chapter 4, they will be seriously handicapped.

Once you get to guest races it is more important to keep the main hall close to fully upgraded, but the opposite is true in early chapters. Upgrade only if you are struggling for coins.
also never a problem for me. I have kept up with upgrades for every chapter and it is usually the least of my troubles for these chapters. I have purchased a few premium expansions but not many so space is an issue for me right now as I struggle through chapter 10
 
Just curious, how many cc's and enchantments can you have stacked up in the ma? I usually only load up a full production and collect because the badges didn't stack, but this time I'm going through the menu to access the production queue to reload without collecting. I just don't want my efforts to disappear into the ether.



I just wanted to bring this Q&A into this thread.
What's up with the Bags of Coins in the FA??????????
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
Right. But space is constant. So if I place another residence, it means I have to delete something else. So comparing 2 cities in chapter 5 with the same amount of space, the one with the main hall at level 15 will have more residences and fewer factories and workshops than the one with the main hall at level 9. The only benefit of the main hall is coins (and to a smaller extent, supplies). If you have adequate coins, upgrading the main hall will only hurt you.

I have a city on Beta, with the new research tree, and have had 20 residences, 10 workshops, and 3 of each boosted goods factory from about chapter 3 into now chapter 7, while keeping the main hall maxed out, plus 4 maxed armories, an almost maxed barracks, and a training grounds, with space to spare for all the Dwarf buildings I needed in chapter 6. And it was not because of premium expansions either, as I only just had the spare diamonds after chapter 6 to buy two of them.
 

Lady Dastardly

Well-Known Member
Considering in later chapters there are researches and/or upgrades that cannot be completed unless your main hall is high enough level to hold the coins needed, that is a very poor habit to get into. Of all the buildings in the game, the main hall is the one that is most important to keep at max level for your chapter.
@BrinDarby is parked in either Ch. 3 or 4 in all their cities, so this isn't an issue for them.
 
I have a city on Beta, with the new research tree, and have had 20 residences, 10 workshops, and 3 of each boosted goods factory from about chapter 3 into now chapter 7, while keeping the main hall maxed out, plus 4 maxed armories, an almost maxed barracks, and a training grounds, with space to spare for all the Dwarf buildings I needed in chapter 6. And it was not because of premium expansions either, as I only just had the spare diamonds after chapter 6 to buy two of them.
Like @MaidenFair said, there are multiple methods that work. I like to have 8 T1, 6 T2, and 3 T3.* Which is possible with a lower level main hall.

*Once Forbidden Ruins came out, I was able to get rid of all my T3s.
 

Mirai

Active Member
Something like this

edited to add a blue and green one as well per the colored paths on the FA map

Orange /yellow
View attachment 13181


Blue
View attachment 13179


Green
View attachment 13180


Click the link below to get to my help post on hooking up avatars and signatures with pictures to help you.
I love this. I'm only going to use it if we do survive / finish our Green Path Only medium-small FS trek Through Nature Itself. (Might there be a similar badge should we *not* survive, as may be the case?
 

Sir Squirrel

Artist EXTRAORDINAIRE and Buddy Fan Club member
I love this. I'm only going to use it if we do survive / finish our Green Path Only medium-small FS trek Through Nature Itself. (Might there be a similar badge should we *not* survive, as may be the case?

It is more meant to mean that finish it or not, that we dealt with it and come out the other end stronger as players, Fellowships and as gamers in general. Even if you don't finish it (as I don't think my med size FS will) we prevailed, but all we got was this Signature to show for it. lol. I thought I would at least give something for the trouble as we are not sure if INNO will.
 

Darielle

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, and Buddy Fan Club Member
Like @MaidenFair said, there are multiple methods that work. I like to have 8 T1, 6 T2, and 3 T3.* Which is possible with a lower level main hall.
When I was in lower chapters on Darielle (Fairies and lower) I had 12t1, 6t2 and 6t3 and I always upgraded my main hall to the max every chapter. I honestly don't understand the problem. I have another ID in Halflings right now and the MH is maxed out. I've currently got 8 t1, 4t2 and 3t3 and 5 armories in there, and I can't think of why anyone would want to keep their MH lower. I have 5K excess pop or more and 6 magic workshops. I suppose I save space with mostly magic residences, but I get those free from spire; anyone can do that. Seems to me playing the spire for magic buildings is a lot better strategy than keeping a MH low, particularly if you visit neighbors. Why get so few coins and supplies each night when you could have more?

I think my key strategy in that one is using portal profits instead of creating huge guest races. Maybe that's the difference? I won't be able to do that forever, but I'll do it for quite a while yet, and I will never regret my MH upgrades.

If someone could explain this more fully, and tell me why they can't make do with what I've got in my halflings city, I'd appreciate it.
 

Sir Squirrel

Artist EXTRAORDINAIRE and Buddy Fan Club member
@Darielle , I always upgrade mine as well, but some players like to have there city be as as efficient as possible and like doing the math of what is the least they need to get through the chapter, it is fun and satisfying for them to do it that way. Different strokes for different folks.
 

Darielle

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, and Buddy Fan Club Member
@Darielle , I always upgrade mine as well, but some players like to have there city be as as efficient as possible and like doing the math of what is the least they need to get through the chapter, it is fun and satisfying for them to do it that way. Different strokes for different folks.
Thanks, Sir Squirrel. Yeah, I think it's a matter of personal preference more than anything else. But then, most things in this game are that, including wonders, event buildings, etc.
 
When I was in lower chapters on Darielle (Fairies and lower) I had 12t1, 6t2 and 6t3 and I always upgraded my main hall to the max every chapter. I honestly don't understand the problem. I have another ID in Halflings right now and the MH is maxed out. I've currently got 8 t1, 4t2 and 3t3 and 5 armories in there, and I can't think of why anyone would want to keep their MH lower. I have 5K excess pop or more and 6 magic workshops. I suppose I save space with mostly magic residences, but I get those free from spire; anyone can do that. Seems to me playing the spire for magic buildings is a lot better strategy than keeping a MH low, particularly if you visit neighbors. Why get so few coins and supplies each night when you could have more?

I think my key strategy in that one is using portal profits instead of creating huge guest races. Maybe that's the difference? I won't be able to do that forever, but I'll do it for quite a while yet, and I will never regret my MH upgrades.

If someone could explain this more fully, and tell me why they can't make do with what I've got in my halflings city, I'd appreciate it.
I don't know how to explain it. All I know is that when I was in chapter 2 and 3, I was really struggling to fit everything I thought I needed into the space available. I didn't have enough residences/population while still having the space to upgrade all my factories. And then I realized that I didn't need to upgrade my main hall, and things got easier when I stopped upgrading. And when I started more cities, I used that knowledge, only upgraded when I was starting to need coins, and things went much more smoothly. Once I got to the guest races, I did fully upgrade each chapter, but I am now rethinking that strategy for my newer cities.

I honestly don't understand why people are harping on coins. Other than this FA, I have never had a problem with coins. Is there some other benefit to the main hall that I am missing?
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
If you want to keep placing expansions gotten from research, you will need to keep upgrading your main hall and can only stay so far behind. For a random example, the max level hall at the end of chapter 5 is level 15, which holds 4.4 million coins. The final research expansion gotten in chapter 7 will cost 4.5 million coins to place.
 
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