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    Your Elvenar Team

To build them all or not to build. Ancient Wonders

faeriesoul

New Member
I've been searching for over an hour for the answer to this. I am wondering if anyone has dedicated their whole city to owning every one of the (available to them), Ancient Wonders. Also curious if the developers have actually created the ideal city would be based on attaining all of them. I am considering doing just that but don't want to do the research and publish just to get feedback, post build, that it was an idiotic thing to do. LOL
I have done a ton of searching on which one to build next, or not to build.


Edit: Member since 2017. My three cities, (One begun in 2020), are halfway through the same level, XVI Embassies.
 
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iamthouth

Tetris Master
@faeriesoul I have a fellow who has levelled all the ones built to max lvl, but they say they wouldn't build all, as the others are not useful.

I have another player who has built all, but not yet levelled them all to max.

I have focused on only a few core wonders, levelling them as high as possible. I assess all my wonders on a per tile per hour production value compared to other buildings.

I don't know what the optimal strategy is sorry. Build the ones that suit your playstyle. I see you have three cities, so maybe an opportunity to try different strategies?
 
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faeriesoul

New Member
@faeriesoul I have a fellow who has levelled all the ones built to max lvl, but they say they wouldn't built, as they others are not useful.

I have another player who has built all, but not yet levelled them all to max.

I have focused on only a few core wonders, levelling them as high as possible. I assess all my wonders on a per tile per hour production value compared to other buildings.

I don't know what the optimal strategy is sorry. Build the ones that suit your playstyle. I see you have three cities, so maybe an opportunity to try different strategies?
iamthouth Thank you for your reply. I will check out your links.
I was considering "sacrificing" one of my cities to this endeavor. However, I would also be sacrificing my fellow players to my mistakes as well. If I can find a good reason to do this, I might consider changing to another FS where it would not bother them or requesting a forbearance in the city where I had the least rank.
I do prefer to find a senior level player who has this experience and garner their opinion. Maybe several. One of the moderators would be exceptional advice.
 

free-spirit

Well-Known Member
I have most of the AWs. I opted not to build the Maze, Enars, Lighthouse of Good Neighborhood and a few of the last chapter AWs because they didn't provide benefits that I needed. A lot of players don't like to build lots of Wonders because wonder levels are included in the tournament cost calculation. My tournament is very expensive now, but with good planning I am still able to finish in the top 20 weekly.

Most of the AWs are good for ranking, so you'll see a lot of the top ranked cities have most of them, and most are fully or almost fully leveled.
 

Moho

Chef
I have done a ton of searching on which one to build next, or not to build.
Very good, because you should. There are definitely AWs that can improve your play, but which particular AWs can do this depends on your playstyle.

For example, many players love AWs that increase their population and allow them to use fewer residential buildings because their cities don't enjoy an unlimited number of expansions. Another AW may add more culture every time players level it up, which could enable them to use fewer culture buildings because, again, space is of high value in this game.

Players who focus on catering when they solve encounters in the Tournament or the Spire will be happy to plant AWs that boost their goods production. Similarly, players who prefer to solve these encounters by fighting will build AWs that help them produce troops, or increase their strength and health.
 

Yavimaya

Scroll-Keeper
I've been searching for over an hour for the answer to this. I am wondering if anyone has dedicated their whole city to owning every one of the (available to them), Ancient Wonders. Also curious if the developers have actually created the ideal city would be based on attaining all of them. I am considering doing just that but don't want to do the research and publish just to get feedback, post build, that it was an idiotic thing to do. LOL
I have done a ton of searching on which one to build next, or not to build.


Edit: Member since 2017. My three cities, (One begun in 2020), are halfway through the same level, XVI Embassies.
You will find that space for what you need for your playstyle will always be a challenge with this game (you probably already noticed). I highly suggest look at the sorcerers scrolls of knowledge section on here under the AW scrolls. It explains everything each one will do. I highly suggest only building the ones that will benefit your needs and playstyle and goals. If you really are curious about getting every single AW I personally would create a whole entire seperate city to experiment with it. These are just my personal thoughts though.
 

maeter75

Well-Known Member
Depends a bit on play style. I have seen some top 20 players with almost every AW built and a good 300K in AW ranking points. I built most of them minus enar, maze and some ones that only give you ranking points. Tournaments are expensive but some of the AW strengths more then make for it for me.
 

StarLoad

Well-Known Member
I have only built some and a few that I have built I have since deleted, like the Tome, Maze, EE, and Bee. I am now releveling the Bee. Hey we all can make mistakes. Mine are for and to support fighting through the tourney and spire.

Ed
 

FairyInBellbottoms

Shroom Aficionado
I've been searching for over an hour for the answer to this. I am wondering if anyone has dedicated their whole city to owning every one of the (available to them), Ancient Wonders. Also curious if the developers have actually created the ideal city would be based on attaining all of them. I am considering doing just that but don't want to do the research and publish just to get feedback, post build, that it was an idiotic thing to do. LOL
I have done a ton of searching on which one to build next, or not to build.


Edit: Member since 2017. My three cities, (One begun in 2020), are halfway through the same level, XVI Embassies.
:) Are you in a fellowship? If so ask your Archmage. I'm a newbie and mine has been so helpful. Or you can send a message asking all the players how they feel about it. As an aside: I have chose not to build all of them.

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FairyInBellbottoms

Shroom Aficionado
I have only built some and a few that I have built I have since deleted, like the Tome, Maze, EE, and Bee. I am now releveling the Bee. Hey we all can make mistakes. Mine are for and to support fighting through the tourney and spire.

Ed
Good info Ed. I feel better now knowing I am smart to build the ones that help with fighting. Thanks
000000000peace-.jpg
 

The Fairy

Scroll-Keeper, Buddy Fan Club Member
Also curious if the developers have actually created the ideal city would be based on attaining all of them.
There are so many ways to play, so I think it is hard to tell what the ideal city is - or if there is only one ideal city? But if you want the most efficient city, then I suggest that you are picky about which wonders you build. Think of it this way: Each wonder requires space to build, so if you build them all you will need a lot of space, and space is precious. But KP is limited too, so if you build them all then they will be on a lower level than if you only build some of them. And I think it is better to have fewer higher level wonders than many low level wonders, so I would pick those wonders that help you most based on how you play.

There can be reasons to build them all, I can think of a few:
  • If you don't care (too much) about building an efficient city, but want to play with them all or collect them all.
  • If you have accumulated lots of KP/runes so you can level many of your wonders to a high level. Some players that care about ranking have most/all wonders leveled to max. (If you want to go this way but don't have lots of KP/runes yet then I still suggest you start out with fewer wonders and level them up and then add more wonders later when you have the KP/runes to do so.)
 

Mykan

Oh Wise One
Trouble with an ideal town from devs is the devs have changed over time and so has the design of the game. I suspect originally they were open to you having all wonders but now they certainly are not, as shown with penalties and they have stated so. Things the first group of devs said would never happen have since happened with a change to the team. So generally I would not be too bothered by what the devs might think as who knows if/when things will change again.

As mentioned many of the top ranked players have most (some have had all) and at a max level. If your style and approach is to build them all or almost all of them then go for it. If your motivation is ranking then probably build them all, if not there might be one or 2 to consider not building. A player in my fellowship has them all (last I checked) but they don't recommend enars, just so hard to justify.

If you are building them all some things to be aware of:
  • If you have a couple premium expansions (thank you spire) space should not be an issue, if it is look at your event buildings that aren't needed
  • Your culture need is likely 100% taken care of with 3-4 wonders, lots of space saving
  • Your tournament score is unlikely to be #1 (or event top 100 depending on sever) but a 6-10K score every week is quite achievable
  • You will have a lot of flexibility in the game due to all the bonuses
  • Seeds, unurium and likely mana will not be an issue for you. Wonders will cover unurium and seeds need, mana depends on a couple things, mana huts are just beautiful for mana, culture bonus etc in late chapters with crazy mana costs.
  • Sentients have a lot of options to cover as multiple wonders help these in numerous ways. You could end up with 1 factory of each and crazy sentient goods or no sentient factories and still 1mil plus of each. Lots of options to pick from.
  • Levelling them all to max is very difficult and time consuming. From memory level 21 is about 50% of the kp required to max (maybe level 30) but is more than 50% of the bonus. So consider getting most if not all to level 21 first. Prioritise key ones to level 30 before brining less helpful wonders up. Similarly with level 35, certain wonders bonuses are better from 31 to 35 so work on those first, that priority is possibly different to the priority of 21 to 30.
  • KP providing wonders can be handy to level early due to needing lots of KP
  • If you are not building all but most consider which ones you don't need or will work on last. From my experience (ignoring beauty)
    • Enars is last, massive with just minimal benefit. Broken shards are pointless if doing tournaments so only mana per scout
    • Vortex of storage will depend on other design choices and volume/reliance on PP instants. With no sentient factories and truckloads of instants this is hard to justify
    • Dragon ark and Oracle will depend on your supply of sentients and CC spells and need for RR's. As wonders cover your culture need you may find your stockpiling RR's. For me I have them but they are less beneficial to me than other options.
    • Thrones and tournament arena, if you want rank chase these. Thrones takes time before the culture bonus starts to be good, probably wait until 600+ wonder levels before placing it. You could math it out but certainly wait to place until you feel culture will meet your needs
Have fun with it, you will gain an appreciation and a different perspective on the wonders by having them all. Can give you insights into different strategies or combinations that you might find of interest for your other towns. Building them all is not a bad thing for your town (unless you want to be #1 in tournaments). Plan out which wonders first and levels and have some fun :)
 
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crackie

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, Buddy's #1 Fan
I was considering "sacrificing" one of my cities to this endeavor. However, I would also be sacrificing my fellow players to my mistakes as well. If I can find a good reason to do this, I might consider changing to another FS where it would not bother them or requesting a forbearance in the city where I had the least rank.
Don't think of it as "sacrifice" and just go for it! Do whatever amuses you, I say!
We have someone in our midst building a strange concept city. Someone else might have planted that idea into her head *whistles*, but at the end of the day, we knew no archmage of a competitive fellowship is going to want us doing an experimental projects in the middle of their fellowship. The obvious solution was, no problem...we'll just go create our own competitive fellowship AND still do fun science experiments! You can make your city however odd and strange you want if you have the archmage tag, annnnnnd...nobody can kick you out or object. :)
 

Ashrem

Oh Wise One
Also, be prepared for some disappointments along the way. If you build the golden Abyss for population, be aware that at level thirty it suddenly stops increasing population and only adds gold (and not enough gold to be worth the effort) so the last five levels become the tainted with the bitter taste of bait-and-switch.
 

maeter75

Well-Known Member
I concur, some AW's max out with their man stat and only one stat increases. The golden Abyss stops giving population but increases in coins (which is near useless) at high levels.
 

Mykan

Oh Wise One
I concur, some AW's max out with their man stat and only one stat increases. The golden Abyss stops giving population but increases in coins (which is near useless) at high levels.

While it is true about stats changing at level 30+, there are a lot of wonders and to get them all to level 30 is a lot of time and effort that most people wont get to if trying to level all (or almost all). While some might be more obvious to max to level 35 there are other things to consider for a person building most wonders.

A lot of wonders have synergies with each other. A very selective person may not always factor those in but if you build them all there are a a number of other things to consider and playstyle will be huge. Far too many aspects to cover but some things for consideration with a level all approach:
  • Every wonder increases points for rank
  • Every wonder increases seed production from trader
  • Every wonder increases culture benefit of thrones of high men (plus score) and thermal springs of youth
  • A higher sunset towers is more seeds per chest but with a scouts tavern that's more chests thus more seeds. Lighthouse/bellspire plays into this also
  • A higher watchtower means more culture from NH which when combined with longer help (lighthouse/bellspire), EE spells (LoGN) could mean the a higher culture bonus which then helps GA, PT, EE
Some wonders like heroes forge and pyramid of purification while having less wonder synergies can combine with cauldron effects to give you even more sentient goods

All wonders only give a small increase per level yet if that increase furthers your specific strategy it is always worth it. People only building a few wonders focus in on certain aspects o the game. A person building all (almost all) opens up a lot more possibilities but it comes with a price of time, patience, and cost (tourny/spire), if they are willing to pay that price then go for it.
 

Kadhrin

Well-Known Member
I've been searching for over an hour for the answer to this. I am wondering if anyone has dedicated their whole city to owning every one of the (available to them), Ancient Wonders.
Yes, it's been done, on W. The player has retired from the game, but he had them all -- including Enar's -- and many of them built up to fairly high levels.
His comments about it were somewhat self-deprecating, and he definitely had some regrets he'd done the experiment. They were at least partly due to the fact that different AWs support different play styles, and building all of them led to a lot of "if only" thoughts, because his city felt mediocre to good at everything but very good at nothing. (At least, that's what I remember as the gist of a very late-night conversation.)
 

Moho

Chef
because his city felt mediocre to good at everything but very good at nothing.
Indeed, this is what one expects but the fact that there are players who have actually tested what it's like to plant all the AW's and the results of this "playstyle" is helpful for all the others to make the right decision.
 
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