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    Your Elvenar Team

News from Beta - May Contain Spoilers!

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Deleted User - 4565442

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Kinda sad really. I'm glad I made the choice to stop at the end of chapter 15. I saw there was nothing worth pursuing in Embassies and decided to focus on other things. I also enjoy having the extra space. I guess I'll only move forward if/when there's something worth pursuing but that may be years away. The developers need a real jolt of creativity or this is going to come to a stuttering halt.

We must take into consideration that whole chapter 17 is "corona chapter", prepared entirely in quarantine. Chapters, buildings etc are planned up to chapter 20, but details as tech tree, balancing etc can change in the matter of 24h.
 

SoulsSilhouette

Buddy Fan Club member
What they need to do is have hidden and random prizes throughout the FA. So a FS would have to do all the points to ensure they have all the trinkets.

They could award prizes at every waypoint. Perhaps time instants or troop instants. Fragments of evolve spells ..... to be assembled in the MA. I'm a fan of the universal evolve artifact idea as well. Put that in the chests for the stages. Or make the chests filled with booty. An artifact, a cool build, a time instant, a coin instant, a supplies instant, a troop instant, magic spellsm and some magic academy needs... like either spell fragments or CC spells. So when you open that chest, you get a ton of stuff for all the effort. Increase or change the type of each for the next chests... then for the whirlpools, do the same ... a mix of instants.
 

Jackluyt

Platinum Leaf -FB
What they need to do is have hidden and random prizes throughout the FA. So a FS would have to do all the points to ensure they have all the trinkets.

It is difficult to ‘balance’ the FA so that it appeals to all players equally.
* Make the waypoints too easy and the strong fellowships are finished all the three stages in two days - and then have to turf things into the Pit endlessly for another four days - very boring.
* Make the waypoints too tough - and the weaker fellowships haven’t a hope of finishing all three stages.

Here is my suggestion: Have three paths of different complexity in each stage - one easy, one medium and one difficult.
  • Doing just the one easy path would give a good prize that anyone would be happy to win;
  • Doing the second path would give an additional ‘special’ prize like a package of Teleports and Royal Restoration Spells;
  • And doing all three including the difficult path would give another extra wonderful prize like universal artifact fragments with which you could craft an artifact when you have collected enough. Or perhaps a blueprint!
How about that for an idea to get more people involved and enthusiastic? - something that would appeal to everyone.
 

Pheryll

Set Designer
Here is my suggestion: Have three paths of different complexity in each stage - one easy, one medium and one difficult.
  • Doing just the one easy path would give a good prize that anyone would be happy to win;
  • Doing the second path would give an additional ‘special’ prize like a package of Teleports and Royal Restoration Spells;
  • And doing all three including the difficult path would give another extra wonderful prize like universal artifact fragments with which you could craft an artifact when you have collected enough. Or perhaps a blueprint!
How about that for an idea to get more people involved and enthusiastic? - something that would appeal to everyone.

Are you suggesting removing the switchover points?
 

SoulsSilhouette

Buddy Fan Club member
They already have the paths graded sort of like that. The harder paths have more blacksmiths, statues, necklaces, etc. I really like the Easter Egg in the waypoints idea much better. That and booty chests.

I personally like the switchover points with the FA. With careful planning and strategically switching paths, Even in my 4 strong Khel fellowship, we can do really well... Last time we didn't do that because no one had the time to really explore and plan, but we still finished two paths.
 

Darielle

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, and Buddy Fan Club Member
@Jackluyt

I would actually like more FA's. Cut down on the major events... One per season with smaller events peppered in between. More mini events to keep up the fun. The FA's could then offer the artifacts for evolving. I love the FA's. I am probably alone in that. The events have too many randoms built in, So I can't achieve my goals in them. The FA's at least don't have that degree of randomness that completely kill me.
I would love the FAs a whole lot more if the prizes didn't suck, even if you get a great score, as my fs did last time.
 

NightshadeCS

Well-Known Member
I don't know that having random prizes in the waypoints would provide much inducement. I can't see spending 40 Blacksmiths on the off chance that one waypoint might give me a 10KPAW secret prize.

I am also concerned about people filling waypoints that are not designated. It's hard enough for some FSs to keep their folks on track.

I do agree that SOMETHING should be done with the FAs, since they are not enjoyable any more, and that is saying a lot for me, since I used to have a great time doing them.

The best thing about the FA, for me, was the team work and increased communication in my FS. This only happened when we had a high goal, though, like placing in the top 20. When we shifted to doing just one path per stage and getting the prize, it just became a slog.

Perhaps better prizes for placement would help participation and enthusiasm?
 

mikeledo

Well-Known Member
I just want to change things up. New path design? What if the requirements for each step of the way are random and hidden from view. There would be no way to know the easy path or what was needed ahead of time. Every FS would a different FA but they could all be within a narrow band of difficulty so one FS can not have a great advantage over another.
 

Pheryll

Set Designer
I just want to change things up. New path design? What if the requirements for each step of the way are random and hidden from view. There would be no way to know the easy path or what was needed ahead of time. Every FS would a different FA but they could all be within a narrow band of difficulty so one FS can not have a great advantage over another.
If one wants to change the path design, then plenty of suggestions have already been made for side paths leading to interesting locations with their own rewards/benefits.
 

SoggyShorts

Mathematician par Excellence
Perhaps better prizes for placement would help participation and enthusiasm?
The issue with adding better prizes in the ranking part is that a lot of players hate competing in a game that is significantly P2W.
Many of us dislike the idea of doing X work and getting a random prize based on what other players from different fellowships do.
What if the requirements for each step of the way are random and hidden from view.
A lot of what players do like in the FA is the increased interaction and communication in fellowships. Randomness can make planning pretty hard.
How about that for an idea to get more people involved and enthusiastic? - something that would appeal to everyone
I agree that they need to add more guaranteed prizes for doing more than one path, but IMO the top prizes should still be there for simply completing one path per stage. Smaller, but still desirable prizes should be added for doing more.
You don't see it being in a top FA FS, but in other fellowships where the enthusiasm for FA varies between members, moving the goalposts would add a significant amount of FOMO and fracture fellowships that otherwise work very well together. Simply increasing prizes for full clears can't fix how appealing the FA is because the FA is often seen as disruptive to a city's progress by players. Especially for those who have not purchased significant premium expansions or are not at the end of the tech tree.
In an average fellowship, there are players at various stages and no one feels good about stalling progress to build a turd town and being tech locked instead of placing the portal and progressing.
What is wrong with rewarding those that want to excel in the FA?
The problem with rewarding just the top X fellowships is that any fellowship which isn't in the top X misses out through no fault of their own.
The FA is the only part of Elvenar where the simple system of "If I do this, I get that" is broken. It's the only PvP in an otherwise rather co-operative game. (not including tournament ranking points which have zero impact on gameplay)
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Now, I know everything I posted above is just crapping on other ideas without offering my own which is both easy and lazy(two of my favorite things). To offset that a little here's my overhaul pitch:
  • Remove the need for FS members to place a badge in order to get a prize. I would say that this is the top frustration that fellowships face, and that waiting for a player who has RL commitments to insert their one badge for this stage does not add anything positive to the game.
  • Add small prizes to every single spot. Timers, KP, coin rains, and supply instants are the simplest as they have unlimited combinations, but for more challenging spots(waypoints?) a universal artifact fragment would be great. @Jackluyt's idea I think?
  • Make every badge usable in the pit like this
  • Add significant prizes for reaching point thresholds as a FS, independent of ranking, but with a cap, past which there are more prizes but not ones that are FOMO-inducing.(similar to tournament chests 11+)
  • Add combat to the FA as originally planned years ago by introducing new badges that are awarded for solving an encounter.
  • Add a feature for mages to highlight routes or waypoints.
  • Allow overage when collecting. There is no good reason why collecting 6 toolboxes shouldn't award a blacksmith badge and 1/5 towards your next BS badge.
  • Upgrade the map interface with a mouse-over on spots, a FS total for badges, a running total of needed badges to complete paths etc. There's loads of room for improvement here to replace google sheets.
  • Add a fellowship/event chat tab. This is actually part of the much-needed chat upgrade suggestion, but relevant here.
I had more which I have forgotten, but I'll post this for now for others to crap upon :)
 
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SoggyShorts

Mathematician par Excellence
Or throw a boss battle into the map.
You have my attention. What's a boss battle? A huge unit with HP (instead of squad size) scaled to your FS somehow?
Throwing troops&goods at it reduces those HP? Or is it something where a manual fight is actually possible?
 

Pheryll

Set Designer
You have my attention. What's a boss battle? A huge unit with HP (instead of squad size) scaled to your FS somehow?
Throwing troops&goods at it reduces those HP? Or is it something where a manual fight is actually possible?

The simplistic way is a multiwave battle with negotiation possibility, basically a spire overhaul. But certainly an actual boss with huge HP could also work.

Here is an example:
First Map Boss: 2 waves, 5 different members needed to complete. 85% enemy to your unit ratio.
Second Map Boss: 3 waves, 10 different members needed to complete. 100% enemy to your unit ratio.
Third Map Boss: 3 waves, 15 different members needed to complete. 125% enemy to your unit ratio.
Pit Boss: 4 waves, 20 different members needed to complete. 150% enemy to your unit ratio.
 

Ashrem

Oh Wise One
What is wrong with rewarding those that want to excel in the FA?
I didn't say there was anything wrong with it. I said it's unreasonable to claim it would appeal to "everyone"

Some people are not going to spend money or tear down their city and/or stay awake all night to make the top scoring teams. More prizes for those teams is not going to appeal to them. At best they won't care, more likely they'll be mildly annoyed, at worst they'll rage quit over more free stuff for the teams with big cities and big money to spend.
 

Deborah M

Oh Wise One
@Ashrem Reading this conversation, I couldn't agree more. I'm having the same reaction to most of the suggestions. I'll preface this with the fact that I have been in Fellowships who have won #1 and other high rankings in the FA back in the day. Then many top ranked players in top ranked Fellowships decided that the FA is just not worth all the effort it takes to finish multiple paths and aim for the top. The reaction I have to most of the suggestions above is "Oh goody! Let's bring on the credit card wars." That really is what most top FA ranking turned into! The last minute battle for top 3 would have been amusing if it wasn't such a waste of $$ for zilch other than bragging rights. I don't think most players will fall for that again.
 

hvariidh gwendrot

Well-Known Member
same here i used to rip out chunks of city and click like a fiend and watch team mates spend crazy amounts for the #1 spot and i display mine to let folks know i got one of course, but having done all that i'm fine with doing 1 path each of the 3 stages get the whatever meager rewards given and done, and i offer the hey if you guys want to go for it we can and get a full on no thanks from the team
 

Clusseau

Active Member
The first few FA were interesting, mostly because they were new, and prizes seemed relatively Valuable.

By the third FA, the top positions became dominated by Fellowships that simply had the most end game players- and their final positions were sorted out by willingness to spend diamonds.

Now, it seems the most common reaction to another FA is "not again!". Players who will benefit most from the meager prizes are typically the least able to farm badges. Those most able to sacrifice some city and do the work, are the least interested in it.

They've effectively moved the last 1-2 Artifacts from events, (for a new, marginal-value building), to the Following FA. So, now it seems most guilds are aiming to do the minimum needed to get Artifacts for their Couple Of Players that want them.

I'm tired of FA. I'm tired of interrupting my city to put in temp buildings, and I'm tired of Click-Click babysitting their production.
"Ditto", If this has already been suggested; If Not, may I suggest Reworking the Badges similar to changes in recent event quests?

In the past, Event success would come from huge numbers of temp buildings. This has changed in the last few events, where a small number of temp buildings are helpful, but not vital, and, a Large number of temp buildings are superfluous. Could we also re-construct FA to be played with Fewer Temp buildings? I think this would better align Cost/Benefit of FA participation, and ease the Dread that some of us feel toward FA.

I think this is On-Topic here, but Apologies if this is not the best thread for my post.
 
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