2021 Misty Forest discussion

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Sure, but my level 1 evolving event building is the Queen's Fairy Retreat. Do I want to use 16 RR every chapter for that building? No.

A low level player can only have so many buildings they intend to take into the future. You have to pick and choose. And the daily prize buildings are even more worthless. I don't even bother worrying about them for the most part as RR are simply too hard to get.

That is why I listed those specific ones, while also agreeing that MOST are useless. Those 4 specific evolving buildings can be left at chapter 1 and the feeding effect will stay just as useful in every chapter.

 

[Tehya1]

That is why I listed those specific ones, while also agreeing that MOST are useless. Those 4 specific evolving buildings can be left at chapter 1 and the feeding effect will stay just as useful in every chapter.

And all four of those can be crafted as can their artifacts.

 

[Guurt The Destroyer]

@Guurt The Destroyer good points. However, it is human nature to want to win. I am really playing devil's advocate here, because I don't have my heart set on any one building in this event, and if I don't get all of the artifacts for the event building, meh. I will see if they become available again, or sell it for bear and phoenix artifacts or another moon stone library set. I would like to have all of the artifacts. I only got four in the last event in one of my cities (got two more in the fa), and I managed to get one in another city to 10, but I spent real money that I shouldn't have, and I did not finish the quest line. What sucked even more is that for all my spending and trying, I slipped from a solid silver league player to bronze in the last few hours. lol This event, I am pessimistic about finishing, refusing to spend real money, and enjoying the board when I finally do get to it, but these events overall don't make me feel great, at least not yet, and I can see how they might cause less tenacious players than me leave the game. In the other events that you finished, did you have this many kp quests? Were you trying to build your city and do the spire? Did you have to use pet food as a quest? I am in ch4 and still can't do the whole spire without negotiating, so having to spread my meager goods even farther for 25 kp points is a hardship, as is using pet food unless using it corresponds with the tourney or spire. Neither of those quests existed in the fall event that I am aware
of.

I never over scout. And I mean never. I do exactly what is needed for each chapter. Over scouting wastes valuable resources and gains you nothing. If you were to over scout 30 provinces you would gain 240 KP. That sounds like a lot of KP, but it isn't. That is 10 days worth. You jump forward 10 days but you make all the fights very hard which is just a waste or resources. I think in the end over scouting actually sets you back. So I literally never do it. I see no upside to it.

Also, I didn't use a single Pet Food until I was in chapter 6 or maybe 7. Instead, I just collected them as I knew I would need them in future, and it took a long time to get enough artifacts for my Fire Phoenix to a decent level. Buying the artifacts in the MA is costly. I have something like 45 pet food. I could have easily used the pet food in quests as I was constantly collecting it as I knew some day I would need it, but since I never over scout, as fighting/catering very hard provinces is clearly a waste of resources, I never had to use them in quests, but I could have if it was needed.

I have been a fighting city since I opened the Spire. I fight every battle in the Spire if I can. But if a match up seems pointless then I will cater. But I probably only cater every other week or so as most of the time I can fight the whole thing. I probably catered a bit more in Chapter 3 and 4, but not too much more. I had to learn how it worked and the resource cost of catering then wasn't much.

Also, I have been collecting fighting bonus buildings since day one. I make them in MA every time they come up. But I didn't use one until I was in chapter 5 or 6. You can win the battles without them in earlier chapters.

I knew I was building a fighting city so I started collecting those resources for the future. I think I have 7 or 8 Dwarven Armories, and like 30 of the other fighting bonus buildings from the MA.

You really only need the bonus buildings and the Fire Phoenix after chapter 6 or 7. You can just suffer the losses before that if you focus on your military production. I actually disenchanted my Fire Phoenix when I was in chapter 6. I didn't want to spent RR on it, so I just put it out disenchanted it and waited for a new one to come up in MA. Then I put it out. I did this once I had 6 artifacts for it.

Also, KP quests are totally fine. Spending gold on KP makes no difference long term. Right now a KP costs me 300,000 gold. It isn't a big deal. I end up burning 4 million gold with the trader every day. I spend gold on KP all the time, not just for quests. I have never cared about buying KP in events. In the beginning it seems like this is expensive. It is not. It is just gold, you will get more. A useless resource.

I only have one city. All my opinions are just based on my experience with this single city.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

And all four of those can be crafted as can their artifacts.

No, you cannot craft artifacts for the Coldfire Phoenix. You can't even start to get them until the Spire starts again on Sunday. And then 12 weeks after that, they will go into the crafting rotation. ColdFire has a unique artifact.

 

[Tehya1]

oh true. I was thinking about fire phoenix, brown bear and pola bear.

 

[Iyapo1]

Over scouting wastes valuable resources and gains you nothing.

In later chapters both mana(dragon abbey) and bonus seed production(trader) are calculated using cleared provinces as a multiplier.

 

[Guurt The Destroyer]

In later chapters both mana(dragon abbey) and bonus seed production(trader) are calculated using cleared provinces as a multiplier.

At that point perhaps it will be worth the expense of having to deal with very hard provinces. I will do the calculations when I get there. But at this point opening up more provinces has no advantage to me. It just makes things more expensive.

Currently I can get 5,000 to 6,000 points in a tournament if I want to. More than that costs quite a lot of resources. I tend to not go beyond 20 provinces in a tournament. I simply do not need more provinces open.

I still need to complete 18 provinces in my current chapter to finish the chapter.

It is just insanely easier to do Very Easy provinces for world map encounters. They are quick and easy and waste no resources at all. Even using melee units losses can be less than 100 units in chapter 8. Often less than 20 units lost using melee units. The battles are essentially free.

In Chapter 1 I over scouted a bit and it became very clear that doing very hard provinces is a complete waste of resources. So I immediately stopped doing that as it was clear that it was mathematically a mistake to over scout.

Perhaps that will change as I progress. I will evaluate when the time comes with math.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

@Guurt The Destroyer just for a view on the opposite of the people saying overscouting is not a big deal. My Beta city is at the beginning of chapter 15 and all the provinces I have available to scout are Very Easy. And they have been for almost the entire game. The last several chapters there, I have finished all the research before I can even complete all the provinces needed to open the next chapter. But I am also not moving at a glacial pace there and completed the first 14 chapters in about 16 months, so without burning time boosters on scouts, I have not been leaving enough real time before finishing all the research for completing all the provinces needed to move on. Going at this rate, my scout times are still just under 40 hours. I think when I was at that same point with my US city, my scout times were probably between 3-4 four days.

 

[Guurt The Destroyer]

@Guurt The Destroyer just for a view on the opposite of the people saying overscouting is not a big deal. My Beta city is at the beginning of chapter 15 and all the provinces I have available to scout are Very Easy. And they have been for almost the entire game. The last several chapters there, I have finished all the research before I can even complete all the provinces needed to open the next chapter. But I am also not moving at a glacial pace there and completed the first 14 chapters in about 16 months, so without burning time boosters on scouts, I have not been leaving enough real time before finishing all the research for completing all the provinces needed to move on. Going at this rate, my scout times are still just under 40 hours. I think when I was at that same point with my US city, my scout times were probably between 3-4 four days.

That is interesting. I am curious how scouting time will play out.

I am trying to go through the chapters as fast as I can, but at the same time I am trying to keep my city fairly small. My current scouting time is about 16 hours. I tend to finish all my scouting for each chapter about 1/2 of the way through the chapter. It is possible that in some amount of chapters scouting time will hold me back from getting through a chapter, but I also have over 500+ of the 5 hour time boosters, and I get like 20 more during each Spire at least. We will see. I also currently have 20 non-premium expansions I could put down.

This week for the first time since I started I had to spend standard KP on an AW because I was tech blocked. I lost 2 days to tech block. I probably should have opened 2 more expansions for mushroom farms. But I don't think putting 70 or 80 KP into an AW rather than into a tech block makes a massive difference. I had never done that before. All I ever care about is finishing the chapter before I take the grand prize from the current event. I will finish orcs before this event ends thus saving myself a few RR (assuming I decide to put down the grand prize from the event).

This is also the first event where I decided to not use scouting to resolve quests. Instead I upgrade 1 tile buildings with RR to get past those quests.

 

[Darielle]

I never over scout. And I mean never. I do exactly what is needed for each chapter. Over scouting wastes valuable resources and gains you nothing. If you were to over scout 30 provinces you would gain 240 KP. That sounds like a lot of KP, but it isn't. That is 10 days worth. You jump forward 10 days but you make all the fights very hard which is just a waste or resources. I think in the end over scouting actually sets you back. So I literally never do it. I see no upside to it.

Also, I didn't use a single Pet Food until I was in chapter 6 or maybe 7. Instead, I just collected them as I knew I would need them in future, and it took a long time to get enough artifacts for my Fire Phoenix to a decent level. Buying the artifacts in the MA is costly. I have something like 45 pet food. I could have easily used the pet food in quests as I was constantly collecting it as I knew some day I would need it, but since I never over scout, as fighting/catering very hard provinces is clearly a waste of resources, I never had to use them in quests, but I could have if it was needed.

I have been a fighting city since I opened the Spire. I fight every battle in the Spire if I can. But if a match up seems pointless then I will cater. But I probably only cater every other week or so as most of the time I can fight the whole thing. I probably catered a bit more in Chapter 3 and 4, but not too much more. I had to learn how it worked and the resource cost of catering then wasn't much.

Also, I have been collecting fighting bonus buildings since day one. I make them in MA every time they come up. But I didn't use one until I was in chapter 5 or 6. You can win the battles without them in earlier chapters.

I knew I was building a fighting city so I started collecting those resources for the future. I think I have 7 or 8 Dwarven Armories, and like 30 of the other fighting bonus buildings from the MA.

You really only need the bonus buildings and the Fire Phoenix after chapter 6 or 7. You can just suffer the losses before that if you focus on your military production. I actually disenchanted my Fire Phoenix when I was in chapter 6. I didn't want to spent RR on it, so I just put it out disenchanted it and waited for a new one to come up in MA. Then I put it out. I did this once I had 6 artifacts for it.

Also, KP quests are totally fine. Spending gold on KP makes no difference long term. Right now a KP costs me 300,000 gold. It isn't a big deal. I end up burning 4 million gold with the trader every day. I spend gold on KP all the time, not just for quests. I have never cared about buying KP in events. In the beginning it seems like this is expensive. It is not. It is just gold, you will get more. A useless resource.

I only have one city. All my opinions are just based on my experience with this single city.

You have the benefit of knowing ahead of time how to play, either by reading the forum or by having had a previous city. A lot of newbies do not know they aren't supposed to scout (especially when they get a "scout one province" quest umpteen times.) They also do not know how precious pet food will be later. They have no idea whether they want to build a fighting city or a catering city, and they are just waiting to see what's best. Hindsight, or in your pre-knowledge, is always 20/20. I really feel sorry for new players just starting out now. It's nowhere near as easy to get ahead as it was a couple years ago.

 

[Moho]

I'll start groping through the Misty Forest on Monday. So far I've been patiently gathering event currency.

I'm pretty nervous about it. I have read people's explanations and watched a YouTube video too. However, I would appreciate if someone were kind and mention what not to do as I proceed, I mean what stupid mistakes to stay away from, and what wrong moves not to make.

Thank you.

 

[Guurt The Destroyer]

You have the benefit of knowing ahead of time how to play, either by reading the forum or by having had a previous city. A lot of newbies do not know they aren't supposed to scout (especially when they get a "scout one province" quest umpteen times.) They also do not know how precious pet food will be later. They have no idea whether they want to build a fighting city or a catering city, and they are just waiting to see what's best. Hindsight, or in your pre-knowledge, is always 20/20. I really feel sorry for new players just starting out now. It's nowhere near as easy to get ahead as it was a couple years ago.

No. I only have one city. I never played before. I am a newbie. I started playing this game this year. As I said this is only the fifth event I have ever been involved in.

Did I read the wiki that the game provides? Yes. But I also always play tutorials and read game instructions. Go figure. I like to understand how games I am playing work. But I also don't believe everything someone says about a game. I test things out for myself.

I tried over scouting. It was clearly a waste of resources. I did it once. I considered the cost versus the reward and I decided it was a bad idea. In my opinion most of the people on this forum seem to promote over scouting. So far I think they are wrong. Perhaps as I get farther along I will change my opinion. As I said, I only have this one city. I don't play on Beta. I am just figuring it out as I go.

 

[Guurt The Destroyer]

I'll start groping through the Misty Forest on Monday. So far I've been patiently gathering event currency.

I'm pretty nervous about it. I have read people's explanations and watched a YouTube video too. However, I would appreciate if someone were kind and mention what not to do as I proceed, I mean what stupid mistakes to stay away from, and what wrong moves not to make.

Thank you.

I did the same. For the first time ever I gave it a shot last night. I had just been saving my resources.

As far as I can tell the most important thing is to only buy the largest pack since mathematically it provides the most item for currency. I did the math on it, and it is just the best deal in my opinion. Other than that try to use your currency in a way that maximizes the most exposed area per item use. It is pretty straight forward.

I actually loved it. Unlike other events I really feel like my choices matter. I enjoyed the puzzle. I wish this sort of puzzle was the way all events were done. Way more enjoyable then the other event mechanics I have seen so far (this is only my 5th event, so maybe there are some others that are even better?).

 

[Huor]

One thing I've learned with events that has helped me is don't activate (I do fill in the KP as I go through the chapter) the optional research items until an event quest requires you to. Makes it a lot easier as the "or" options are usually pretty steep. Be careful in the guest race chapters not to leave any behind that require guest race material!

 

[Tehya1]

That would be geat, but why not taget the quests themselves? Why not ask inno to resolve that contradiction?

 

[Dew Spinner]

That would be geat, but why not taget the quests themselves? Why not ask inno to resolve that contradiction?

Because this is a game about strategy they don't want to do the thinking for the players. that takes the strategy out of the game. That's why they put the warnings there. It's your strategy whether to follow the warnings or not. players don't need expansions above and beyond what is given in regular game play (not over scouting), Players need to strategizes about space optimization.

 

[SoggyShorts]

That would be geat, but why not taget the quests themselves? Why not ask inno to resolve that contradiction?

This I can get behind, especially if the rotating quests are still asking for clearing encounters&gaining relics (I haven't checked them in forever)

Because this is a game about strategy they don't want to do the thinking for the players. that takes the strategy out of the game. That's why they put the warnings there. It's your strategy whether to follow the warnings or not.

"Warning, this province is hard, we should wait and scout it later"
Also,
"Scout a province/fight and win/gain relics to complete this quest"
What's a new, mobile, casual player who (like 99.98% of players) doesn't visit the forum supposed to choose?

A warning that something is hard is not the same as a lengthy explanation of game mechanics telling you why it could cause complications depending on several factors. I'm on the side of those who think new players shouldn't be expected to know deep mechanics that us nerds wouldn't even know if it wasn't for even bigger nerds (we miss you @minmax!)

You are advocating for a giant warning telling players not to do something that the game will ask them to do over and over again.
Is more confusion the goal?

A single unified message across quests the map, and everywhere makes the most sense to me.

 

[Guurt The Destroyer]

Pre-tournament update the benefits of overscouting vastly outweighed the costs.
Even now it depends on playstyle. If you aren't hardcore about the spire and tournament then the formula isn't a big deal.
That just leaves costs. Waiting for advanced scouts techs reduces costs by 25%. Not waiting gets you ~4 city expansions a few months early.
Going 4 chapters ahead in scouting might double your costs, but what are those goods/troops compared to having ~16 extra expansions for a whole year?

I don't even put out all the expansions as they don't really help you get more KP which is what stops you from advancing.

It does depend on your playstyle, but I really don't think getting city expansions justifies the difference between Very Hard and Very Easy fights.

Also, as far as I understand it those expansions also make everything harder (Spire and Tournaments). If you put them all out things just get harder. Plus you can never take them back once put out. I prefer to slowly add expansions using the free diamonds I get. As far as I can tell there is no way to remove a regular expansion so you can replace it with a premium expansion.

You literally have people saying that they can not ever win a battle on the world map because they have made all their provinces Very Hard. That doesn't just mean the provinces are harder to fight, it also means they are harder to cater.

I don't think a few extra expansions is worth that extra expense.

Also, being a hybrid city saves resources. Even someone that is building a catering city is going to have some troops. You might as well use those on some easy fights. It does save you some catering resources in the end.

Everyone makes their own choices in the end. I have yet to see an argument for over scouting that I find convincing. Perhaps I will change my mind as I advance. If I do I will be sure to say I changed my mind.

 

[Dew Spinner]

That would be geat, but why not taget the quests themselves? Why not ask inno to resolve that contradiction?

Below is a link to space optimization, so you don't have to over scout in the future.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10209222641823737&set=oa.1652024521719596&type=3&theater

 

[Tehya1]

A warning that something is hard is not the same as a lengthy explanation of game mechanics telling you why it could cause complications depending on several factors.

You are advocating for a giant warning telling players not to do something that the game will ask them to do over and over again.
Is more confusion the goal?

This. Thank you.