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    Your Elvenar Team

An instant token for an extra guess on convincing the spire ...

Lelanya

Scroll-Keeper, Keys to the Gems
I'm with Alram. I'd rather have 20 unrestricted diamonds than a limited-use token worth 25. Eventually, unless they're very rare, they'd just pile up like all the other instant thingies.

If some sort of token became an event prize, then meh. Maybe that would be more appealing than it sounds now, but at least it wouldn't hurt anything. But I wouldn't want it to replace diamonds that are already in a spire chest. Diamonds are one of the best prizes the spire offers - I don't want to reduce that flow, even for a technical gain in value.
Ah but the tokens are temporary in FoE, they expire ^^ lol.
And we know Nino loves to bring over FoE features...
 

The Fairy

Scroll-Keeper, Buddy Fan Club Member
I only fight in the spire (at least in my big city, my smaller cities are working towards that), so the token would not have any value for me. That doesn't mean I am against it, if it replaces other rewards, e.g. in events, which don't have a big value either. But if it replaces diamonds then I am against!
 

ajqtrz

Chef - loquacious Old Dog
At first, I liked the idea, I'm not so sure now. Here's some of my reasons for the uncertainty.

First, flexibility in the use of resources is better than inflexibility (or less flexibility). Being able to use the 20 diamonds in multiple situations may, to many, be a better fit to their playing style than a token they can only use in one place. This is, I think, Alram's point.

Second, if you don't cater the spire what do you do with the pile of tokens you will eventually get for doing the spire? They are pretty much worthless to you, even if they do help people like me who never fight and always cater the spire from top to bottom?

Third, overall I don't break even on the Spire and lose about 50-100 diamonds a week. (My fs does silver). Since I craft and get a 500 diamonds every few weeks my diamond supply doesn't fluctuate much. In fact, it's up by 1,000 since the last FA, so with crafting and the Spire I'm pretty much set to never need to buy diamonds. It's true the token would save me about 2 guesses a week -- 50 diamonds, but since I already get 40 from the two times I win 20 diamonds, the net gain of 10 diamonds, to me, isn't worth asking the devs to add this to the game. I'd rather see them use the time for some other idea.

AJ
 

Darielle

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, and Buddy Fan Club Member
At first, I liked the idea, I'm not so sure now. Here's some of my reasons for the uncertainty.

First, flexibility in the use of resources is better than inflexibility (or less flexibility). Being able to use the 20 diamonds in multiple situations may, to many, be a better fit to their playing style than a token they can only use in one place. This is, I think, Alram's point.

Second, if you don't cater the spire what do you do with the pile of tokens you will eventually get for doing the spire? They are pretty much worthless to you, even if they do help people like me who never fight and always cater the spire from top to bottom?

Third, overall I don't break even on the Spire and lose about 50-100 diamonds a week. (My fs does silver). Since I craft and get a 500 diamonds every few weeks my diamond supply doesn't fluctuate much. In fact, it's up by 1,000 since the last FA, so with crafting and the Spire I'm pretty much set to never need to buy diamonds. It's true the token would save me about 2 guesses a week -- 50 diamonds, but since I already get 40 from the two times I win 20 diamonds, the net gain of 10 diamonds, to me, isn't worth asking the devs to add this to the game. I'd rather see them use the time for some other idea.

AJ
As far as a fighter never using the tokens, what fighter wouldn't want to save his resources if he has a bunch of tokens? He could guarantee himself a win without using troops by just using up those tokens. Troops are important resources. It seems to me that even fighters would want to save their crew.

If you don't break even on the spire ... actually, if you don't make diamonds on the spire every week by negotiating, then something is wrong. I negotiate at least 80 percent of the spire every week. I virtually always go to the top, and I neve lose more diamonds in a week than I've gained. If you're not using strategic withdrawals, then that may be your problem. If you get a bad hand the first try, the worst thing you can do is take that second and third try. Instead, withdraw. You should be able to learn the strategy to negotiate well. Remember that a "good" hand on the first try does not usually mean green check marks. You need to reduce the number of goods, not the number of spirits.

I can't remember a time when I haven't gained at least 200 diamonds a week, and usually more. My team makes gold nearly every week. Of course, I never throw 25 diamonds at extra guesses except on door guys, and then only if I'm certain to win. (And sometimes not even then, if I have enough goods to absorb losses.) I save the 25 diamonds for the big boss at the top. He's the toughie. The rest are pretty easy to negotiate.

Good luck to you.
 

ajqtrz

Chef - loquacious Old Dog
As far as a fighter never using the tokens, what fighter wouldn't want to save his resources if he has a bunch of tokens? He could guarantee himself a win without using troops by just using up those tokens. Troops are important resources. It seems to me that even fighters would want to save their crew.

If you don't break even on the spire ... actually, if you don't make diamonds on the spire every week by negotiating, then something is wrong. I negotiate at least 80 percent of the spire every week. I virtually always go to the top, and I neve lose more diamonds in a week than I've gained. If you're not using strategic withdrawals, then that may be your problem. If you get a bad hand the first try, the worst thing you can do is take that second and third try. Instead, withdraw. You should be able to learn the strategy to negotiate well. Remember that a "good" hand on the first try does not usually mean green check marks. You need to reduce the number of goods, not the number of spirits.

I can't remember a time when I haven't gained at least 200 diamonds a week, and usually more. My team makes gold nearly every week. Of course, I never throw 25 diamonds at extra guesses except on door guys, and then only if I'm certain to win. (And sometimes not even then, if I have enough goods to absorb losses.) I save the 25 diamonds for the big boss at the top. He's the toughie. The rest are pretty easy to negotiate.

Good luck to you.

I'm not sure a fighter would switch to using goods since to use the tokens you would have to guess 3 times AND get it wrong so the "pay diamonds?" box comes up. My understanding is that the OP wanted a token for the extra guesses, not the first 3. If I'm wrong about that, then your right with what you say.

As for losing diamonds, I only read an earlier post of your method a couple weeks ago (when you made the post). I am learning to do that so I expect that I'll stop losing diamonds one of these days. But, on the other hand, I've got over 15,000 diamonds and no place I want to use them....so are the goods I'd use with the "bad throws" worth more than the diamonds to me since I make up for them with crafting? They might be, even though I'm no where near running out of anything.

AJ
 

Darielle

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, and Buddy Fan Club Member
I'm not sure a fighter would switch to using goods since to use the tokens you would have to guess 3 times AND get it wrong so the "pay diamonds?" box comes up. My understanding is that the OP wanted a token for the extra guesses, not the first 3. If I'm wrong about that, then your right with what you say.

As for losing diamonds, I only read an earlier post of your method a couple weeks ago (when you made the post). I am learning to do that so I expect that I'll stop losing diamonds one of these days. But, on the other hand, I've got over 15,000 diamonds and no place I want to use them....so are the goods I'd use with the "bad throws" worth more than the diamonds to me since I make up for them with crafting? They might be, even though I'm no where near running out of anything.

AJ
You understood the extra guesses part. I guess it may be true that fighters wouldn't want to even start negotiating. For me, negotiating and figuring out the strategy is so much fun that you can't help but enjoy it more, but I forget not everyone feels as I do. Different strokes.

Whatever works for you is good. If you value the goods more, then by all means, that's your choice. I have a lot of manufactories, so I don't mind spending goods. I'm cheap with diamonds though, lol. Then again, I only have about 3K now because I bought some magic buildings with the spire diamonds. I'm happy though. All of my workshops are magic ones, so that helps tremendously.
 

The Fairy

Scroll-Keeper, Buddy Fan Club Member
I don't mind so much loosing the standard goods in spire when I am in the lower chapters, but once I start needing orcs, mana, seeds and especially sentient goods to cater the spire then I find it way too expensive and prefer to fight. Then I will rather cater part of the tourney as that only require mana and orcs sometimes, but never seeds and sentient goods.
 

StrongJean

Active Member
I enjoy the spire very much and love to cater as well became quite good at it :) At Elcy, we have a policy that allows 0 trades during a push which helps a lot to get to the top. And yes Darielle, it's fun to figure out the strategy I rarely miss now.
 

StrongJean

Active Member
Himalayan Warriors in Elcy are looking for 3 enthusiastic spire player that like to go to the top with us and win the gold :) one great benefit during spire push, we have a policy that allows for 0 trades during that event! You will not find that in any other FS lots of high level players! Come and join us to get the gold :)
 

Alram

Flippers just flip
Himalayan Warriors in Elcy are looking for 3 enthusiastic spire player that like to go to the top with us and win the gold :) one great benefit during spire push, we have a policy that allows for 0 trades during that event! You will not find that in any other FS lots of high level players! Come and join us to get the gold :)
This is a great post and you should definitely post it in the elcy fellowship seeking members thread.
 
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