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    Your Elvenar Team

Ancient Wonders

Huor

Guest
I'm chapter 7 and I decided to skip the bulwark (size 7x4) for the shrooms (size 5x4) as it looked straight out the box that the shrooms would do more for me as far as troop production size and giving me crossbowman which I use. Am I thinking about it wrong? I looked out a few evolution's for each and the shrooms is pulling away? Sounds like there is something I'm missing?
 

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Henroo

Oh Wise One
@Huor Both Dwarven Bulwark and Shine of Shrooms give you a massive increase in training time. But the way they calculate this is very different. Dwarven Bulwark's increase in training time is a percentage of your map province squad size. Everytime you upgrade DB, you get a slightly bigger percentage. And every time you unlock a squad size increase tech, what DB gives you will automatically increase.

Shrooms is calculated differently. To calculate what Shooms will give you in training time, you must add up the total number of armory levels in your city. Then you multiply this by a number which is based on the level of your Shrooms.

In my experience if you have 4 or less max level armories than DB is better than Shrooms in terms of training time. If you have 5 or more max level armories then Shrooms is better.
 

Huor

Guest
@Henroo Thank you! I use 2 max level armories and I was going to edit my post after I thought about that I have not activated any of the optional squad sizes in chapter 7 so far and if that would make a difference. Sounds like I need to think about it further, but those free crossbowman sound really nice! I only fight unless I'm forced to cater.
 
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Henroo

Oh Wise One
@Henroo Thank you! I use 2 max level armories and I was going to edit my post after I thought about that I have not activated any of the optional squad sizes in chapter 7 so far and if that would make a difference. Sounds like I need to think about it further, but those free crossbowman sound really nice! I only fight unless I'm forced to cater.
If you only have 2 armories I think you would be better off with Dwarven Bulwark. I also note you are talking about Crossbowmen. This sounds like you are human. I think Shrooms is better for Elvish players. Archers are a better light ranged unit than Crossbowmen are. Does not matter as much with Dwarven Bulwark cause both Sword Dancers and Ax Barbarians are crap.
 

Mykan

Oh Wise One
Those free crossbow are also relative to your squad size. So researching optonal SS techs will improve the bulwarks training size and all free troop wonders (shrooms and bulwark have free troops).
 
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Henroo

Oh Wise One
Those free crossbow are also relative to your squad size. So reseraching optonal SS techs will improve the bulwarks training size and all free troop wonders (shrooms and bulwark have free troops).
But free Crossbowman are not as valuable as free Archers. Archers have a higher base attack value and a better special ability. They are better in the end game phase. So when you are evaluating the "free troops" aspect of Shrooms I think it matters if you are Elvish or Human. Cause the free troop provided are better for Elvish players. This does not matter nearly as much for Dwarven Bulwark. Frankly both Sword Dancers and Axe Barbarians suck. If I need a light melee unit I am going with Cerberus.
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
In my chapter 16 cities, Bulwark outperforms Shrooms in terms of training size. I have 3 max level (level 35 currently) armories. But I've done the math and even with 4 armories Bulwark would still give me more training time than a Shrooms of equal level. It would take 5 armories for Shrooms to pull ahead.

We may be a little off-topic, but in chapter 18, four maxed armories, all three military buildings maxed, Bulwark and Shrooms level 11, all three AWs that speed up training at level 16, and that gives me a training time for five squads at around 11 1/2 hours in each building.
 

Henroo

Oh Wise One
We may be a little off-topic, but in chapter 18, four maxed armories, all three military buildings maxed, Bulwark and Shrooms level 11, all three AWs that speed up training at level 16, and that gives me a training time for five squads at around 11 1/2 hours in each building.
Actually this is perfect. Your Bulwark and your Shrooms are the same level. Everything else is maxed. How much training size does you Bulwark give? And how much training size does your Shrooms give?
 

Gladiola

Well-Known Member
@Henroo @Grid Gypsy I'm trying to combine your wisdom on the orcs nests. Maybe craft them for VV and hope I don't need them?

It sounds like Witches' Hut may hit the Spire at around the time I hit orcs, which would be convenient.

Because I keep my city tiny and progress slowly, I don't have that many buildings to upgrade. I upgrade Fire Phoenix, some pieces of Pilgrim's Manor (the parts that produce t1 goods) and some pieces of Moonstone Library (the main piece when I complete the first research, and then I upgrade the small buildings when I get event quests that call to upgrade buildings and I don't have any to upgrade and don't like the alternative). Eventually I'll want to upgrade other parts of Pilgrim's Manor and the Moonstone set to get mana, but I will worry about that in Woodelves.
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
Actually this is perfect. Your Bulwark and your Shrooms are the same level. Everything else is maxed. How much training size does you Bulwark give? And how much training size does your Shrooms give?

4617 from the Bulwark and 2880 from the Shrooms. Shrooms would be higher, but I cut down from 6 armories to 4 a couple of chapters ago.

@Gladiola every event seems to have a couple of mana-producing buildings, so when you are close to the end of chapter 8, or just completing the Advanced Scouts of chapter 9, try for as many as you can get and you should be good until you can research other sources. Also watch crafting when you get to that point and make all the chapter 9 Festival Merchants you can, as those will be mana at that point.
 

SoggyShorts

Mathematician par Excellence
Thanks for the link! My ultimate long term goal is to get rid of armories and Shrooms entirely. I want to rely on Bulwark alone for training size
It's possible... Right now if I had a level 30 needles and level 30 bulwark with zero armories and no shrooms My queue would be just over 7h.
I've gone the other direction BTW:
Level 21 speeds (needles/FA)
Level 16 shrooms&bulwark
12 armories
=
24h queue for ultimate slacking.
 

Cronopiio

New Member
It's possible... Right now if I had a level 30 needles and level 30 bulwark with zero armories and no shrooms My queue would be just over 7h.

that sounds wonderful or not?

Focusing all the power on a few wonders would make tournaments easier.

But what would be the best way to obtain orcs without armories?
 

Lelanya

Scroll-Keeper, Keys to the Gems
that sounds wonderful or not?

Focusing all the power on a few wonders would make tournaments easier.

But what would be the best way to obtain orcs without armories?
Orc Nests are craftable in the Magic Academy, just keep checking it.
This event there are two cultures, Mausoleum Wedding and Scare Carriage
 
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