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    Your Elvenar Team

Cater or fight

nativedeer

Active Member
So in my game I cater the spire then fight T unless I come across one that I will lose too many troops . About done with orcs, someone suggested I should turn to catering T n fight the spire because sediment goods will be in spire n not in the T,said it would be easier.Fighting the spire seems hard because of the waves. So how many of yous do it this way?Right now it seems to work great in my favor thanks.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
Do whatever works for you, but from everything I've witnessed fighters have an easier time with the spire and tournament late game.

There is some debate as to whether pure builds or hybrids are best, and for me it comes down to the new(ish) spire& tournament formula.
Every single wonder level and expansion increase both the cost of catering and the number of troops you face.

This means that if you have half of your wonder levels and space helping you make goods and the other half for troops you are facing 100% cost all the time while only bringing 50% of your production to each encounter.
That's why I think focussing on either catering or fighting is superior to a true hybrid.

So, IMO which is better?
The reason why a "pure fighter" is better than a "pure caterer" is that pure fighters don't actually exist.
They still have factories and mana producers etc that they use for tech advancement so if they get stuck they can buy their way out. Pure caterers can't suddenly raise an army nor a bunch of wonder levels etc

As for the actual difficulty in fighting the spire, the single most important thing you need in order to be successful is the 5-day buildings craftable in the MA. If you place them late in the week you can use them for the end of the tournament and 2 spires.

I strongly recommend crafting every 5-day building you see from now on if you haven't already since you should have a solid stockpile before you start fighting in case of MA dry spells. Also, a stash of pet food for the firebird, another "must have".

Then comes wonders which is a whole separate thread.

Edit note: I'm sure lazy and autofight everything. While I love the idea of catering the tournament since it's 80% fewer clicks, the idea of convincing the whole spire for an hour instead of crushing it out in 15 minutes doesn't interest me.
 
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Enevhar Aldarion

Well-Known Member
Be aware of one thing, as soon as you are officially in chapter 9, orcs will show up in both tournament and Spire for catering. So do not get caught with a low supply.
 

nativedeer

Active Member
Be aware of one thing, as soon as you are officially in chapter 9, orcs will show up in both tournament and Spire for catering. So do not get caught with a low supply.
Thanks have been in orcs it’s seems like awhile from teleporting my orc stuff for FA ‘s. This seems to be in my favor, have a stash of them built up. Thanks good thing to know. Only have 2 armories n a few orc nest working on armory #3. Might stay for a bit more here in chapter 8 :p no rush for me.
 

nativedeer

Active Member
Do whatever works for you, but from everything I've witnessed fighters have an easier time with the spire and tournament late game.

There is some debate as to whether pure builds or hybrids are best, and for me it comes down to the new(ish) spire& tournament formula.
Every single wonder level and expansion increase both the cost of catering and the number of troops you face.

This means that if you have half of your wonder levels and space helping you make goods and the other half for troops you are facing 100% cost all the time while only bringing 50% of your production to each encounter.
That's why I think focussing on either catering or fighting is superior to a true hybrid.

So, IMO which is better?
The reason why a "pure fighter" is better than a "pure caterer" is that pure fighters don't actually exist.
They still have factories and mana producers etc that they use for tech advancement so if they get stuck they can buy their way out. Pure caterers can't suddenly raise an army nor a bunch of wonder levels etc

As for the actual difficulty in fighting the spire, the single most important thing you need in order to be successful is the 5-day buildings craftable in the MA. If you place them late in the week you can use them for the end of the tournament and 2 spires.

I strongly recommend crafting every 5-day building you see from now on if you haven't already since you should have a solid stockpile before you start fighting in case of MA dry spells. Also, a stash of pet food for the firebird, another "must have".

Then comes wonders which is a whole separate thread.

Edit note: I'm sure lazy and autofight everything. While I love the idea of catering the tournament since it's 80% fewer clicks, the idea of convincing the whole spire for an hour instead of crushing it out in 15 minutes doesn't interest me.
So I guess I will remain to play the way I do. Cater n fight both so if I believe I can’t win in the fight n lose a bunch of troop can take the other route n give em my goods. And what you said bout the cost going up with upgrades n expansions (read bout it in different thread) so I guess keep producing my troops n goods n see how it goes. When I read what u wrote u must be mostly a fighter? Thanks for answer :)
 

Dew Spinner

Well-Known Member
So I guess I will remain to play the way I do. Cater n fight both so if I believe I can’t win in the fight n lose a bunch of troop can take the other route n give em my goods. And what you said bout the cost going up with upgrades n expansions (read bout it in different thread) so I guess keep producing my troops n goods n see how it goes. When I read what u wrote u must be mostly a fighter? Thanks for answer :)
Hybrid cities can be highly effective, I have one from the start of playing. I produce tons of troops and goods. I top the Spire every week and just broke 6K tourney score, all because of the flexibilty my hybrid city affords me. The one thing about a hybrid city is that it is FUNCTION over FORM! If you want a "pretty" city a hybrid city isn't going to work. A hybrid city only pumps out goods and troops, no room for "pretty" things! INNO has been changing things a lot and the pure fighting or pure catering cities are a thing of the past, you have to be good at both. Feel free to check out my stats on elvenstas.com and visit my city to see what I have to help you build a powerful Hybrid City.
 
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SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
I specifically said I'm a lazy autofighter and catering the spire was unacceptable to me. I even added some "IMO" and "there is some debate" to clearly indicate that I'm aware that my opinions aren't the only ones.
And if you bothered to actually read my post I clearly laid out that there is no such thing as a pure fighter (the implication being that it's a hybrid by default)
 
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Dew Spinner

Well-Known Member
I specifically said I'm a lazy autofighter and catering the spire was unacceptable to me. And if you bothered to actually read my post I clearly laid out that there is no such thing as a pure fighter (the implication being that it's a hybrid by default)
I'm Sorry, I just feel advice is best given from someone that has experienced it...Hybrid Cities are very effective because I Have Experienced That!. You have not, not trying to pick a fight.
 
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SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
I'm Sorry, I just feel advice is best given from someone that has experienced it.... You have not
Wrong. I have. I played pure catering cities, "pure" fighting and everything in-between. You're basing your assumption on nothing.

Another fine example of your gate-keeping. No one's opinion, experience, math, or information is valid except yours. Forget that I played this game for years before you even knew it existed. Ignore the logic and common sense I put in my post. It's impossible that someone could know something that you don't despite all evidence to the contrary.
 
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Dew Spinner

Well-Known Member
Wrong. I have. I played pure catering cities, "pure" fighting and everything in-between. You're basing your assumption on nothing.
That is why you shouldn't be saying that Hybrid Cities aren't very effective because they are and I am proof of that!
 

crackie

Well-Known Member
*sprays thread with Lysol to clear the air*

I have a fighting city in that I have mostly military wonders and I fight tourneys, but I still cater Gateway and High Halls of Spire. The logic is easy enough that I can solve them on the first or second try so it doesn't cost that much in goods. Upgrades on buildings only happen once in a blue moon when I unlock those certain techs so goods are piling up unspent anyway. I only have orcs, mana, and seeds to contend with, but haven't found it to be an issue. I've also studied minmax's Spire progression charts and formulas. My conclusion is it's not worth spending my troops in Gateway and High Halls, even if I can win there, esp when the logic is still so easy to cater. They will stretch further in tourney. I'm doing between 6k-9k depending on the tourney so I have massive troop needs for tourney.

With the Lab, the numbers flip. It becomes expensive to cater bc the logic is not in your favor as it's much harder to solve on the first or second try. Therefore, it's not as economical to cater the Lab so I switch to fighting and be done with in one round. I don't know if you're using buffs, whether in the form of expiring buildings from MA or Fire Phoenix, but you will need some buffing to fight the Spire. It's not wise to try bare knuckling it with no buffs. For a lot of us, we're dropping buffs and feeding Fire Phoenix anyway to handle tourney so it's not an added expense for the week. As Soggy says, if you time when you drop the buff buildings, you can use them for 2 weeks worth of Spire. For me, it also works out that by the time Tues rolls around with a new tourney, I'm about to enter the Lab in the Spire so I sync to clearing the Lab with when I'm feeding my Fire Phoenix.
 

Dew Spinner

Well-Known Member
I didn't. Go look.
You're statement is below and it is against Hybrid Cities. The game has changed a lot since you started playing and new strategies that weren't so good before are now VERY good.

This means that if you have half of your wonder levels and space helping you make goods and the other half for troops you are facing 100% cost all the time while only bringing 50% of your production to each encounter.
That's why I think focussing on either catering or fighting is superior to a true hybrid.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
You're statement is below and it is against Hybrid Cities.
Right, hybrid can be effective, but I also clearly laid out why I think focusing on one is even more effective.
Have you tried a "pure" fighter in the late-to-end game to prove it's less effective?

If not then by your own rule:
"I just feel advice is best given from someone that has experienced it... " - Dewwy

You have no right to talk about it, correct? Your opinion is totally invalid, right?
 

Dew Spinner

Well-Known Member
*sprays thread with Lysol to clear the air*

I have a fighting city in that I have mostly military wonders and I fight tourneys, but I still cater Gateway and High Halls of Spire. The logic is easy enough that I can solve them on the first or second try so it doesn't cost that much in goods. Upgrades on buildings only happen once in a blue moon when I unlock those certain techs so goods are piling up unspent anyway. I only have orcs, mana, and seeds to contend with, but haven't found it to be an issue. I've also studied minmax's Spire progression charts and formulas. My conclusion is it's not worth spending my troops in Gateway and High Halls, even if I can win there, esp when the logic is still so easy to cater. They will stretch further in tourney. I'm doing between 6k-9k depending on the tourney so I have massive troop needs for tourney.

With the Lab, the numbers flip. It becomes expensive to cater bc the logic is not in your favor as it's much harder to solve on the first or second try. Therefore, it's not as economical to cater the Lab so I switch to fighting and be done with in one round. I don't know if you're using buffs, whether in the form of expiring buildings from MA or Fire Phoenix, but you will need some buffing to fight the Spire. It's not wise to try bare knuckling it with no buffs. For a lot of us, we're dropping buffs and feeding Fire Phoenix anyway to handle tourney so it's not an added expense for the week. As Soggy says, if you time when you drop the buff buildings, you can use them for 2 weeks worth of Spire. For me, it also works out that by the time Tues rolls around with a new tourney, I'm about to enter the Lab in the Spire so I sync to clearing the Lab with when I'm feeding my Fire Phoenix.
Good Example of how a Hybrid gives a player maximum flexibilty to do WHAT'S needed, WHEN it's needed. Switching between catering and fighting, depending on what you are doing, is invaluable to save you troops and goods!
 

Henroo

Well-Known Member
I fight almost everything. My cities are pretty much focused on fighting: I've got all the military AWs except Hero's Forge. Stage 10 Fire Phoenix. And I drop a set of 5 day buff buildings every week to help with my tournament and spire. I only cater every now and then when a really bad enemy troop line-up appears. I do think that when I cater I am paying more than a cater focused city of my same level would be paying. Simply cause I have so many military AW levels raising my cater costs. Also, fighting everything was impossible when my city was lower level. I started off as a hybrid city. But as I advanced in the game and got more troop promotions and more military AWs, combat became easier and more efficient. I really started to notice a difference somewhere around Woodelves and began fighting more and catering less. By Halflings I was pretty much combat only and have stayed that way since.

I do think a cater based city would be possible even at higher levels. But it would be an entirely different design from what I have. All the space I have devoted to military AWs, armories, high level Barracks, Training Grounds, and Mercenary Camp would be instead devoted to making extra goods and other cater resources like orcs, seeds, and mana.
 

nativedeer

Active Member
Hybrid cities can be highly effective, I have one from the start of playing. I produce tons of troops and goods. I top the Spire every week and just broke 6K tourney score, all because of the flexibilty my hybrid city affords me. The one thing about a hybrid city is that it is FUNCTION over FORM! If you want a "pretty" city a hybrid city isn't going to work. A hybrid city only pumps out goods and troops, no room for "pretty" things! INNO has been changing things a lot and the pure fighting or pure catering cities are a thing of the past, you have to be good at both. Feel free to check out my stats on elvenstas.com and visit my city to see what I have to help you build a powerful Hybrid City.
Will look u up thanks
 

nativedeer

Active Member
I specifically said I'm a lazy autofighter and catering the spire was unacceptable to me. I even added some "IMO" and "there is some debate" to clearly indicate that I'm aware that my opinions aren't the only ones.
And if you bothered to actually read my post I clearly laid out that there is no such thing as a pure fighter (the implication being that it's a hybrid by default)
My bad should of read it better thanks for taking the time to answer me
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
Just saying, how could I see it before you when it was YOUR comment...LOL!
God, learn to read.
"I edited that out myself but you saw it before I did" <-- the "I did" is referring to the main clause which is me editing it. As in
"you saw it before I edited it out"