Cities who cater / convince instead of battle

[ajqtrz]

I do wonder, and it's probably answered somewhere, but how many goods/supplies/coins does it take to do 20 x 6 tournament and top of spire if you cater only? I have about 10 million of each good, but I see @Deborah M speaking of 30 million. Does a six round of 20 provinces and topping the Spire take that much? If it took only, say 5 million I would do a complete tournament/Spire once in a while just to give myself an easier time with troop levels. So what's the (approximate) magic number here?

AJ

 

[Alram]

@ajqtrz
@ed1960 put up some interesting catering numbers in this thread.

Post in thread 'Catering / Negotiating in Tourney & Spire' https://us.forum.elvenar.com/index....egotiating-in-tourney-spire.32344/post-269184

 

[Yavimaya]

I do wonder, and it's probably answered somewhere, but how many goods/supplies/coins does it take to do 20 x 6 tournament and top of spire if you cater only? I have about 10 million of each good, but I see @Deborah M speaking of 30 million. Does a six round of 20 provinces and topping the Spire take that much? If it took only, say 5 million I would do a complete tournament/Spire once in a while just to give myself an easier time with troop levels. So what's the (approximate) magic number here?

AJ

It could vary widely depending on chapter as things get much more expensive.

 

[Yavimaya]

@ajqtrz
@ed1960 put up some interesting catering numbers in this thread.

Post in thread 'Catering / Negotiating in Tourney & Spire' https://us.forum.elvenar.com/index....egotiating-in-tourney-spire.32344/post-269184

Thanks!

 

[Iyapo]

@ajqtrz

This is not a question that can be answered by another player. Costs are too dependent upon your specific city build. Expansions, premium expansions, chapter, wonder levels. You should just take the plunge, cater one week and record your costs. Then double them to account for an evil spire(sometimes the spire is really nasty and sometimes really kind)

 

[ajqtrz]

@ajqtrz

This is not a question that can be answered by another player. Costs are too dependent upon your specific city build. Expansions, premium expansions, chapter, wonder levels. You should just take the plunge, cater one week and record your costs. Then double them to account for an evil spire(sometimes the spire is really nasty and sometimes really kind)

While, of course, you can't predict the exact amounts, I suspect you can get an approximation, and that's what I asked for. Now an approximation can be rough... 30 million of each good and some number for supplies and coins as a multiple of goods... or it can be more precise, based upon some computations and considerations. In fact, I believe that since the game is finite in it's possible outcomes there may be a formula by which you could get pretty close to the exact match. You'd have to track all the variables in the game and have some kind of idea of how the player will do in the Spire and tournament (his or her skill level in each) but I bet if you did all that work you could get a highly predictive model to work. Fortunately I don't need that level of precision. But I do think a rough estimate of between 10 and 30 million of each is a bit to rough to gamble upon.

In the end you do make a great point. It's complicated. Very complicated.

And maybe, like ed1960, I'll jump in some day and either sink or swim.

AJ

 

[Sprite1313]

sometimes really kind

I think that might be a bit of an exaggeration.

 

[Deborah M]

AJ, I will track it for the next tournament. I did cater this tournament 20 times 6 and I don't believe it was quite as bad as I expected. I meant to track how many goods it took but lost track when I got in a hurry doing the event. I'm thinking my city should be about as hard as it would be since I have all of the expansions and 889 AW levels.

 

[ajqtrz]

AJ, I will track it for the next tournament. I did cater this tournament 20 times 6 and I don't believe it was quite as bad as I expected. I meant to track how many goods it took but lost track when I got in a hurry doing the event. I'm thinking my city should be about as hard as it would be since I have all of the expansions and 889 AW levels.

Thanks! I have only 458 AW levels and a few less expansions so it will be a bit less for me. I think I'll take your answer as the "worst case" scenario for me because of that.

AJ

 

[maeter75]

Fascinating thread, was having similar discussions about which wonders I was going to build. I recently built the P Tower and upgraded my Blooming Trader as going more into the Wholesaler strategy.

 

[Deborah M]

I'm amazed and pleasantly surprised. Today is my first day to see what it might look like to follow some of the suggestions made above. I just looked at planks factory which says regular + relic boost is 10,800 on 3 hour production. My additions are Mountain Halls & Elvenar Trade Center AWs, MM spells, Storm Phoenix level 10 fed and Aureate Phoenix level 8 fed. That brings me up to 40,920 on 3 hour production. I am really WOWed! I feel like an old dog that learned a cool new trick from newer players Thanks!!! I had no idea I could do this. Now to get 2 more Phoenix artifacts.

Just for reference, I have 8 planks factories. That will yield 327,360 planks in 3 hours

 

[MaidenFair]

I do wonder, and it's probably answered somewhere, but how many goods/supplies/coins does it take to do 20 x 6 tournament and top of spire if you cater only? I have about 10 million of each good, but I see @Deborah M speaking of 30 million. Does a six round of 20 provinces and topping the Spire take that much? If it took only, say 5 million I would do a complete tournament/Spire once in a while just to give myself an easier time with troop levels. So what's the (approximate) magic number here?

AJ

As others have said, it really is dependent on your city build. However, for the sake of curiosity, I'm trying to track my expenditures this week. (I'm going to keep a running total here, just so I don't lose track of everything.)

Chapter 12; 145 AW levels; 71 expansions, 7 of which are premium -

First floor of Spire: 7189K coins, 759K supplies, 17960 marble, 22000 steel, 6000 planks, 29400 crystal, 15100 silk, 15390 elixir, 8000 gems, 8460 magic dust, 25200 mana, 1850 orcs, 2930 seeds.

Second floor of Spire: 15280K coins, 1560K supplies, 42600 marble, 64100 steel, 75600 planks, 32500 crystal, 67700 scrolls, 52700 silk, 25500 elixir, 16500 gems, 11500 magic dust, 99200 mana, 13640 orcs, 12240 seeds.

Third floor of Spire: 25100K coins, 2088K supplies, 123200 marble, 171900 steel, 107400 planks, 18800 crystal, 56400 scrolls, 158900 silk, 76500 elixir, 44000 gems, 50000 magic dust, 384800 mana, 26180 orcs, 21400 seeds.

Spire totals for one week:
47569K coins, 4407K supplies, 183760 marble, 258000 steel, 189000 planks, 80700 crystal, 124100 scrolls, 226700 silk, 117390 elixir, 68500 gems, 69960 magic dust, 509200 mana, 41670 orcs, 36570 seeds.
Random extra info: I had to retry more encounters than usual on the third floor, but still only used diamonds exactly once, on the final boss. I also won fewer diamonds than usual, with only the second-floor boss and a third-floor gate guard combining for 95 diamonds on the way up.​

I can't begin to show all the pictures for tournament, haha, so I'll just tot those up at the end of the week in one final accounting. I've estimated in the past that Spire was about 1/3rd of my weekly expenditure, so the numbers might be roughly twice what I got for Spire; we'll see.

 

[Deborah M]

@ajqtrz
All done 20 provinces x 6 rounds in the tournament. It took even more than I expected but it wasn't too bad. I got hung up on trades some. I'm not used to needing trades quickly so I will have to prepare for that next time. It does stink that I did world map visits for a coin boost and I have 300+ neighbors and 100+ coin cities. I think now that I have gone ahead and tried catering the tournament, I may switch to every other week catering and battling. I think this would be a bit much to cater every week. Again, I have all expansions available for research, map provinces and premium. I also have 891 AW levels so it shouldn't get much more demanding than this.

	1	2	3	4	5	6	Total
Coin	35,200,000	40,430,000	62,500,000	110,600,000	55,900,000	49,500,000	354,130,000
Supplies	6,500,000	2,490,000	6,000,000	4,990,000	5,700,000	4,960,000	30,640,000
Orcs	136,000	7,200	160,000	179,600	19,000	82,000	583,800
Mana	-	760,000	1,550,000	823,000	483,000	1,810,000	5,426,000
Marble	233,000	380,000	81,000	710,000	351,000	810,000	2,565,000
Steel	500,000	1,096,000	570,000	186,000	821,000	643,000	3,816,000
Planks	746,000	700,000	581,000	748,000	1,380,000	1,131,000	5,286,000
Crystal	593,800	140,000	53,000	278,000	544,000	630,000	2,238,800
Scrolls	392,000	458,000	424,000	463,000	710,000	970,000	3,417,000
Silk	538,000	465,000	870,000	525,000	332,000	490,000	3,220,000
Elixer	281,800	764,000	239,000	321,000	547,000	470,000	2,622,800
Dust	243,800	358,000	294,000	649,000	704,000	629,000	2,877,800
Gems	439,000	377,000	679,000	368,000	554,000	245,000	2,662,000

 

[ajqtrz]

	1​	2​	3​	4​	5​	6​	Totals
Marble	100,000	420,000	530,000	480,000	550,000	420,000	2,500,000
Steel	300,000	200,000	300,000	400,000	300,000	850,000	2,350,000
Planks	600,000	300,000	100,000	200,000	200,000	200.000	1,600,000
Crystal	220,000	280,000	410,000	180,000	420,000	650,000	2,160,000
Scrolls	120,000	160,000	380,000	360,000	250,000	320.000	1,590,000
Silk	100,000	200,000	200,000	300,000	300,000	230,000	1,330,000
Elixir	100,000	100,000	200,000	200,000	250,000	190,000	1,040,000
Dust	200,000	200,000	200,000	100,000	400,000	200,000	1.300,000
Gems	100,000	200,000	100,000	200,000	100,000	200,000	900,000
Orcs	56,037	53,995	42,700	58,600	40,700	61,900	313,892

@Deborah M and @MaidenFair

This is my list. I took the numbers from the world screen which rounds up or down to the nearest 10,000. I also failed to include coins and supplies, probably because I ignore them in all my calculations since I produce so much more than I ever use. I'll include them next time. This is 20x6 with 142 expansions, 459 AW levels 398 neighbors, and maybe 20 coin cities.

I found this to be, as you say, something I could do every other week. And it will really save the troops for the 20+ provinces. So my plan will be, going forward, to do the first 20 provinces via catering and then switch to fighting every other week. The "off weeks" I'll just fight the whole thing to 30-35 provinces as I usually do.

Thanks for the help.

AJ

 

[Smooper]

I have a second city ready to go to chapter 4 and I was considering a catering city. The resource I care about the most is time and the accomplishments I want in this game are high tourney and spire achievements. After some reflection I have decided I can't do a catering type city focused on goods. From what I can see catering just takes far too long compared to autobattle. In my chapter 11 city, I just did the spire in 36 minutes and I know people can do it much faster. Even if I broke that into several sessions the time it takes to get to the top is the time it takes and solving puzzles every single encounter is far to slow for me to consider. I actually love manual fighting but have almost completely eliminated it from my gameplay because of the time it takes.

Combine the time aspect with having to learn a whole new system of developing my city and I have come to the conclusion that a fighting city is the smartest thing for me. If I am wrong in any of my conclusions, let me know.

 

[Flashfyre]

@Smooper
So, I was going to try and explain to you how a catering city can be Spire and Tourney successful, but then I re-read your comment and saw that time is an important resource to you, and that means anything I have to say about catering is a moot point. Sure, autobattle is quicker, but not by that much; I can routinely cater through 4 Spire encounters in under 5 minutes. If it's a matter of spending a lot of time making decisions, then try using the Spire Wizard to learn some of the traits the negotiating process uses, and how to recognize winning choices.

One last thing: a catering city relies less on all the extra martial buildings and other requirements (near constant pet food supply, making and using UUU/MMM/DA buildings, etc.) which makes city management a bit less complex. Once the various goods producers are set up and leveled, and all extraneous buildings have been eliminated, the city runs fairly well without a lot of maintenance.

 

[Smooper]

@Smooper
So, I was going to try and explain to you how a catering city can be Spire and Tourney successful, but then I re-read your comment and saw that time is an important resource to you, and that means anything I have to say about catering is a moot point. Sure, autobattle is quicker, but not by that much; I can routinely cater through 4 Spire encounters in under 5 minutes. If it's a matter of spending a lot of time making decisions, then try using the Spire Wizard to learn some of the traits the negotiating process uses, and how to recognize winning choices.

One last thing: a catering city relies less on all the extra martial buildings and other requirements (near constant pet food supply, making and using UUU/MMM/DA buildings, etc.) which makes city management a bit less complex. Once the various goods producers are set up and leveled, and all extraneous buildings have been eliminated, the city runs fairly well without a lot of maintenance.

As long as I can do the whole spire in about an hour or so I think it is good. When I first started on spire I did mostly manual fighting to preserve troops and it would take me 4 hours to do the spire. I can't do 4 hours of spire for each city and then throw in a tournament every week also. That's why I started autobattle even though I don't really like it. I can come up with more troops with troop building strategies but can never spend more of my free time on Elvenar.

 

[Iyapo]

I can cater the spire in about 30 minutes, but autobattle is still faster. Did you see this post: Thread 'How fast can you do the spire?' https://us.forum.elvenar.com/index.php?threads/how-fast-can-you-do-the-spire.37060/ speed spire using auto battle, with a video.

 

[maeter75]

Super interesting, again and some good data points on catering. I recently started to do the wholesaler strategy of buying a lot from the wholesaler, via boost using combos such as watchtower, blooming, lighthouse and been buying a lot more goods. That being said I now cater a lot more of the tournament, rarely the spire.