Combat - browser vs mobile

[samidodamage]

For the multi-wave battles in the Spire, the second round gets sorted by Initiative order I believe.

Round 2 is sorted by flipping the Round 1 order, so units in positions 1,2,3,4,5 become the units in positions 5,4,3,2,1 in Round 2. Round 3 flips back and becomes the same positions as Round 1.
Note: I took screenshots of all multi-wave battles (troop selection windows and battlefields!) for about 2 entire Spire climbs before I figured out the pattern! I'm not only old, I'm slow

 

[Cleo7311]

More things to try - thanks all!
I have learned to pay close attention in manual mode to the crippled units. I will try to retreat crippled ones. And sometimes I can cripple an enemy with a light hit, then clobber it with a power unit. Then there are those nasty terrain maps that trap my units while letting the AI run wild..... And the multi-wave spire rounds that reverse the second wave, so I can kill one wave, but get slaughtered on the next - negotiate time!

 

[Raccon]

And the multi-wave spire rounds that reverse the second wave, so I can kill one wave, but get slaughtered on the next - negotiate time!

Yet another advantage of browser manual fight over the auto fight, you can raise the white flag and save your troops when the situation gets really sticky. In auto fight you'll lose all your troops before you realized the battle ain't going in your favor!

 

[Cleo7311]

What are examples of the 7 buff buildings to make combat easy rather than the Fire Phoenix?

When the AI units are favorable, I like to use a combo of archers & golems - both have good range and can sweep the field. The mix varies according to the AI - archers for mages & heavy infantry, golems for all light units. Against heavy ranged, I have to shift out.

 

[Zoof]

What are examples of the 7 buff buildings to make combat easy rather than the Fire Phoenix?

When the AI units are favorable, I like to use a combo of archers & golems - both have good range and can sweep the field. The mix varies according to the AI - archers for mages & heavy infantry, golems for all light units. Against heavy ranged, I have to shift out.

If everyone else is talking about the same thing I'm thinking of, I know of only four of them:

Unleashed Unit Upgrade - 2x2 5-day expiring building. +25% troop health. Found in MA crafts.
Magnificent Mage Multiplier - 2x2 5-day expiring building. +50% mage damage. Found in MA crafts.
Enlightened Light Range - 2x2 5-day expiring building. +50% light range damage. Found in MA crafts.
Dwarven Armorer - 2x3 5-day expiring building. +50% troop health. Found as a possible prize in various Spire chests.

There were a couple other similarly-expiring buildings that I heard were sold in some kind of promotional.
Either way, all these buildings stack with each other, so if you wanted to transform all your light ranged troops into miniature Death Stars, go ahead and flood the entire town with ELR. The wisdom of burning that many expiring buildings when your supply can't cope is a whole 'nother kettle of fish. But at least for that 5 day stretch, it'll be as if a second sun rose above your city to smite all who come against it

There are also Ancient Wonders that also provide a damage boost to various troop types, but the expiring buildings above are available (very relatively speaking) right from the git-go.

EDIT: On a re-read of the thread, perhaps it was meant that "7 buff buildings" was less "types" and more "actual buildings" altogether. The previous spire/tourney cycle, I burned 5 buff buildings: 4 MMM and 1 DA.

 

[Henroo]

Tangential question: Do the individual unit abilities (other than the star rating) actually work on the mobile version, since there is no battlefield fight shown (i.e. no terrain map, no tracking of rounds, no selecting of unit positions, etc.), and the lineup during unit selection seems to have no bearing on the end result?
For example, when up against a mix of Heavy Melee and Heavy Ranged units, using a mix of Mage units, it seems that I lose more Banshees than Buddies, and even less Blossoms. Now, I know there are differences between them as to their star ratings that affects the results, but given that my Banshees are 4* vs Hvy Range and my Blossoms are 4* vs Hvy Melee, I do try to use them against the proper enemies.

As far as I know the unit stats are identical on both the PC platform and the mobile platform. I switch between platforms, use autofight on both, and my results do not seem to vary. Since I am using the same unit selection strategy and have the same unit buffs regardless of which platform I am using, this seems to be evidence that things do not change. One big issue is that mobile does not display unit stats in as much detail as the PC does.

The issue of range is especially important. In fact, I think this might be the most single important aspect of Elvenar combat. As far as Elvish mage units, Buddy has a range of 3, Banshee has a range of 3**, and Blossom has a range of 5. With regard to the results you talked about, the extra range is almost certainly the reason you are losing less Blossoms in the encounters. I quit training Banshees in my elven city. I tried them but due to the extra range Blossoms would still do about as well against heavy ranged as the Banshees, despite the Banshees having better bonuses against HM. And against any other unit types Blossoms were way better. Now if you are playing as a human, the basic barracks mage unit Priest also has a range of 5. And it has better bonuses against heavy melee and a better overall damage special ability than the Blossom does. I'd say the Priest is probably the single best unit in the game.

**Banshee Range is edited from the original post. When I first wrote this I said Banshee had a range of 4. That is actually the movement rate. I mixed up the figures. I've now corrected this error.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Banshee has a range of 4

Banshee has a range of 3.

 

[Henroo]

Banshee has a range of 3.

You are correct. I was doing this from memory and I mixed up the movement of 4 with the range. I'm going to edit my original post to reflect the right information

 

[Gkyr]

It especially helped when my Frogs were still 2*:
If there's only the one Hellhound, line the Blossom up to strike it. The Frog will take a turn before the Hellhound and with the Blossom's reduced defense debuff on the Hellhound, the Frog will take it out.

Perhaps I did not follow directions, but it did not work by a long shot.
This was the result:

AW: MM 26, DAbbey 17, ToT 23 buffs: 1 MMM, 1 UUU, 1 DA.

 

[crackie]

Perhaps I did not follow directions, but it did not work by a long shot.
This was the result:


AW: MM 26, DAbbey 17, ToT 23 buffs: 1 MMM, 1 UUU, 1 DA.

That's correct, assuming you've also hit the Hellhound with the Frog. I think you are in same boat as me and the Frogs are too wimpy in upper provinces with only 2 promotions. That's why I was saying substitute Blossom with Buddy (though in this case, Buddy won't be able to reach with obstacle). If Buddy hits the Hellhound, he bites you with -50% power. Although, you're in Round 3 already. Did he go snack on the Banshee first before Blossom? You should have been able to hit at least 2x with the Frog by Round 3. Hellhound's health is still super high.

 

[Raccon]

Perhaps I did not follow directions, but it did not work by a long shot.
This was the result:

View attachment 12702
AW: MM 26, DAbbey 17, ToT 23 buffs: 1 MMM, 1 UUU, 1 DA.

I always get better results using heavy melee rather than using mage + frog or mortar when the enemy lineup is Hell hound + heavy range combo and the battle field is not blocked. On the battlefield like yours five 3* Golems (If you're playing elf) would do better than mage + frog considering the presence of the over reaching K9.

 

[ajqtrz]

Thanks all for the detailed discussion here. I've learned a lot and will use it to improve my own battles. Especially considering the placement of troops (order of selection, since I auto-fight), and initiative.

AJ

 

[BrinDarby]

Auto-fight or manual battle, starting posistion Matters.
If you get ppl "stuck" behind other units, they cannot move
until the other units move first.

 

[Gkyr]

I agree with all, especially @Raccon , as you can see from my post #12 in this thread.

 

[Cleo7311]

If you haven't played manual mode at least a few times, watched how the computer moves, and the sometimes evil terrain maps, you will never realize what you are up against. Sometimes the computer will make a well designed attack, other times a dithering useless one. I have switched to auto complete only to see the AI send my key units the wrong way to get pounded to pieces. Many a time I have been defeated in auto mode, then replay with the same armies manually and had an easy victory. Other times the AI units and terrain make it another one to spend the goods on.

 

[Zoof]

Ah yes. The intricacies of the autofight, as seen when you start it manually and click the autofight button there to watch the horror unfold in all its terrible glory.

I've found that the most expedient way to figure out the inner workings of the autofight is to do just that, but not before prepping your skull for the beating the aneurysm-inducing autoplay will work out. Some of the idiocy does make sense; it's coded in such a way that expedient death occurs and does little to prevent them, lest it catches itself in an endless loop. The little it does, I've found, is taking the most direct path towards the outermost edge of its range to reach out to whatever punching bag it prefers regardless of the proximity of things that could reach out and beat them to mush. Mostly those of high initiative, regardless of the troop's actual weakness or strengths.

Oh alright. To be perfectly honest, I don't believe I learned a whole lot from it aside from the basics because I value having an brain aneurysmless life. I'd like to say that the small flask of alcohol I have on my desk is because of the attempt, but I'd be lying. I just like the aroma of the added cinnamon flavoring.

On another note, the writeups in this thread have been very valuable and I've taken to attempting something this week in Tournament that I haven't tried before: Manual fighting every province in the first round and writing down (typing up?) notes of the battlefield terrain to have a better idea of how awful of an idea it could be to autofight each province for the following five rounds. My losses... were lesser. I think.

 

[crackie]

I always get better results using heavy melee rather than using mage + frog or mortar when the enemy lineup is Hell hound + heavy range combo and the battle field is not blocked. On the battlefield like yours five 3* Golems (If you're playing elf) would do better than mage + frog considering the presence of the over reaching K9.

If I'm using all Heavy Melee, I'll just autofight it rather than bear the excruciating frustration of watching everyone move 2 hex at a time. If there are no Hellhounds, you have to sit through them all just walking on their first turn too. AI doesn't do that badly with handling melee troops. Its general weakness is positioning range troops properly and failing to utilize terrain to keep them safe. Heroes' Forge and fed Fire Phoenix should give them enough advantage to not blow it. *fingers crossed* Seriously, you can finish like 3 encounters in the time it takes to finish an all Heavy Melee encounter.

If you haven't played manual mode at least a few times, watched how the computer moves, and the sometimes evil terrain maps, you will never realize what you are up against. Sometimes the computer will make a well designed attack, other times a dithering useless one. I have switched to auto complete only to see the AI send my key units the wrong way to get pounded to pieces. Many a time I have been defeated in auto mode, then replay with the same armies manually and had an easy victory. Other times the AI units and terrain make it another one to spend the goods on.

Preferably don’t do it immediately after you have eaten as to not lose your lunch.

To be perfectly honest, I don't believe I learned a whole lot from it aside from the basics because I value having an brain aneurysmless life.

The Mist Walker Roulette experiment has been most fruitful. I now feel pretty comfortable sending in mages with Misty around and will still be confident I can walk out with a win.

 

[Raccon]

Seriously, you can finish like 3 encounters in the time it takes to finish an all Heavy Melee encounter.

Well, that's the only choice left for those of us who've got No Buddy!

 

[Zoof]

[...]
The Mist Walker Roulette experiment has been most fruitful. I now feel pretty comfortable sending in mages with Misty around and will still be confident I can walk out with a win.

That was actually one of the earlier lessons that I learned from the forum and applied to great success in some scenarios. That is, get higher initiative troops like the expendable greenies dryads to attract Mist Walker attention. One of the only lessons I ever learned with regards to using more than one type of troop. I hope to learn others

 

[crackie]

Well, that's the only choice left for those of us who've got No Buddy!

Wise Golem, Voice of the Prophet, and Flying Academy. I don't train any. She comes over to hang out and watch movies.