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    Your Elvenar Team

Fair trade and fellowships

mucksterme

Oh Wise One
Trade amounts are 1000 & 1100 ..... players A & B are trading ......
is this a fair trade ?????
According to ppl like Soggy .... ?? well, Soggy would say
if the deal is 1100:1000 (same tier) its a fair trade.......
yet if its 1000:1100 then its not.... yet its the SAME TRADE !!!!!

Perhaps we need a change in terminology that better reflects how many of us feel

1000:1000 is a fair offer
1100:1000 is a good offer
1000:1100 is a bad offer
 

Darielle

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, and Buddy Fan Club Member
Nerwa said:
Within an FS Brin is a 2- and 3-star trader, picking up trades several times daily. His stockpiles make for an excellent team reserve supply, and he is especially generous with new players.

You see @Darielle , your comment couldn't be further from the actual truth.
Several times a day ?? more like several times an hour ( for 14-18 hrs a day )

I'm not out for #1, unless my Fellowship is #1... all for 1 and 1 for all ( within the FS )

You totally ignored the part where I said, "You'd be out for numero uno for your group, too (as someone mentioned earlier that you are generous with your fellowship)."

But then, people do tend to ignore what doesn't support their argument.
 

Diellashana

Member
Nobody bullied me. It's a FS posted rule that I misunderstood. Combination of neighborhood/FS took 1:1.5 trades until I was about 250K-300K. Estimation due to dumping 100k into kp. A trade would come in and I would immediately put it back on the trader. I quickly ran into the 60 trade limit max so I allotted 20 trades to each tier. This is in about 3-4 days time in joining FS.

I have very fat stacks for my level. I now have a maxed out chaper 2 city going into chapter 3. I'm waiting for Sunday morning to chapter up so the spire will take a snapshot of me at chapter 2.

The Winter Magic event, generosity of neighborhood/FS, and light gem buying has set me up for many chapters to come.

I've studied the squad size equation post for tournaments/spire. I know any more expansion, relics, overscouting, etc is just doing more harm. I now enter a slow jog into chapter 3.
 

BrinDarby

Well-Known Member
But then, people do tend to ignore what doesn't support their argument.
I ignored nothing, the comment was I believe ...
I hope that doesn't sound like an insult, because it isn't. You're probably the kind of person someone would want in their group if they were in a cutthroat game that needed a good protector. You'd be out for numero uno for your group, too (as someone mentioned earlier that you are generous with your fellowship). In a game like that, I'd probably get eaten. That's why I'm here.
Exactly meaning in another game, not this 1 ...
therefore my comment was both valid and on point.
I was not commenting on your attempt to disclaimer things.

Now since you claim not to be insulting... ok , then lets have a rational conversaion,
shall we ?? How about you or anyone, in detail list the progression and limitations
of the Trader ..... just so we know what facts we are talking about .... then I can show
you why this subject never gets solved and why there's so much confusion over it.

Trader 1,2,3,4 ? differences in limitations or lack thereof. resources used, ect ect ect
---InPUt---iNpUT---need InpUt---
 

Myne

Oh Wise One
I am not understanding where @BrinDarby and @ajqtrz feel they are being bullied. People have stated their opinions and you have stated yours. Existential discussions about what constitutes fair and unfair have no place in this. PERCEPTION is the key. If your trades are perceived as unfair, they won't be taken. You can argue, fuss, and fight from dawn til dusk and that is not going to change. I think you both are resentful that folks won't take your trades if they are unbalanced to a great degree in your favor. That, to me, is like someone being angry another person won't let them pick their pocket!
This weeks' moves introduced someone to our neighborhood who places trades such as 2000 silk offered and 20000 scrolls demanded. Ridiculousness. Hope they have figured out a way to hatch more scrolls in this scroll starved neighborhood because that's the only way they will get them. Trades like that foster ill will. Like it or not, it reflects back on you.
 

BrinDarby

Well-Known Member
if they are unbalanced to a great degree in your favor.
Seriously , you have missed the point ....
and do you really consider 15% "great degree" ?? ( 10000 : 11420 ) same tier.
even your example 2k : 20k can't happen, 1:8 is Max .. do you mean 2k : 16k ?
 

Myne

Oh Wise One
I said my peace. If all you got out of what I stated is the piece of a sentence you posted, I have nothing else to say to you. The term "will argue with a stump" comes to mind. Also cognitive dissonance.
 

Darielle

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, and Buddy Fan Club Member
I said my peace. If all you got out of what I stated is the piece of a sentence you posted, I have nothing else to say to you. The term "will argue with a stump" comes to mind. Also cognitive dissonance.
I'm with you, Myne. When people want to deliberately misunderstand you, there seems to be no point in keeping up the argument. I think I'll bow out of this one, too. :)
 

BrinDarby

Well-Known Member
1641069804865.png


@Killy- , wasn't a joke ... you saw the quote from myne
 

ajqtrz

Chef - loquacious Old Dog
I am not understanding where @BrinDarby and @ajqtrz feel they are being bullied. People have stated their opinions and you have stated yours. Existential discussions about what constitutes fair and unfair have no place in this. PERCEPTION is the key. If your trades are perceived as unfair, they won't be taken. You can argue, fuss, and fight from dawn til dusk and that is not going to change. I think you both are resentful that folks won't take your trades if they are unbalanced to a great degree in your favor. That, to me, is like someone being angry another person won't let them pick their pocket!
This weeks' moves introduced someone to our neighborhood who places trades such as 2000 silk offered and 20000 scrolls demanded. Ridiculousness. Hope they have figured out a way to hatch more scrolls in this scroll starved neighborhood because that's the only way they will get them. Trades like that foster ill will. Like it or not, it reflects back on you.

First, my claim is not that I'm being bullied but that players are. It is an act of coercion to tell a player they will be shunned if they don't do things the way you think they should be done. Here's a definition of bullying: "seek to harm, intimidate, or coerce." Usually it a high status member trying to intimidate a lower status member of the group into doing as the group or he/she wants them to do. I'm not sure why one wouldn't think telling a person they will be shunned, (or shunning them, for that matter), or treated as a pariah when they don't put up trades with which you agree. They are, quite often, lower status players and, quite often, follow the advice exactly because it is a higher status member giving it. And when that member supports the claimed group norm, it makes it an obvious use of social pressure to get the person to conform. Group bullying is just as prevalent in games as in real life. So it's not me who, in this case is being bullied in this manner, though I have been "warned," that I will be shunned if I continue doing what others don't appreciate me doing.

A second point is rather minor, but important. I never post a trade with less than a 5% bonus for the buyer. I can't remember doing that since I was in chapter 10 or so. My trades get taken fast.

Now as for perception, you are right. But if you use idea that "this is how it's done," you are just using an ad populum argument...this one with implied threats of being shunned and/or trades not being taken. Why people perceive 1 and 0 star trades is for two reasons. 1) the players insist on enforcing the idea, and 2) the star system makes the claim of the value of the goods as if it were absolute. It's not, as I've demonstrated and as we've seen over and over in the game. Thus, when we claim the star system is a "fair" measurement of the value of our goods, we are being unrealistic. The value of our goods is, and should be, whatever we say they are. Maybe nobody else thinks so, but if they don't our goods will sit in limbo until we get tired and realize we are asking too much -- and that is a learning experience they will learn. If our goods are worth what we say they will sell because, given their immediate circumstances, the buyer says they are worth that. In both cases encouraging and even implying punishment if they don't do as the group does, is not healthy.

You are right. It's perception. I am only arguing for the right to perceive the value of my goods the way I like, not the way the system claims, a way that is enforced by players who are, in my opinion, suffering from a little group think.

AJ
 
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