Getting to second base?

[Deleted User - 3932582]

Not sure why you guys compare frogs output with GotOS output, at least at 1:1. To me, frogs are a lot less valuable than strategists. I can produce virtually unlimited amounts of frogs as they only need supplies and time. SOS production has a cap based on orc production, and that can't really be rushed.

 

[Kekune]

Not sure why you guys compare frogs output with GotOS output, at least at 1:1. To me, frogs are a lot less valuable than strategists. I can produce virtually unlimited amounts of frogs as they only need supplies and time. SOS production has a cap based on orc production, and that can't really be rushed.

Fair. I'm really going to replace orc nests with my lvl 3 witch hut. Similar orc output, plus pop. The frogs are just extra.

 

[The Unbeliever]

I don't think there will be a 2:1 conversion for the Halloween event. So far the Phoenixes and Bears are the only categories that get conversions. But they are also the only buildings that use pet food. As far as I know, there has never been an artifact conversion option for any building that does not use pet food.

No, the *only* reason we have seen only phoenix + bear artifact conversions thus far is simply because, they have been the ONLY true 'repeat' themed events since the introduction of evo buildings!!
2019 Events:
Valentine's single quest line event
Carnival w/Set building
**Phoenix w/Fire + Storm + Aurite evo buildings
Summer Solstice
Queen of the Seas single quest line event
Summer Mermaids
**Autumn Zodiac w/Brown + Polar + Panda Bears
Tale of Dr. Frankensplien single quest line event
Winter Magic 2019 w/fugly Gingerbread Mansion

2020 Events:
Elvarian Carnival w/new evo building (no return of previous year's set buildings, as they were deemed stupidly OP...)
**Phoenix Tale w/Coldfire (new) building + 2:1 crafting recipe for previous year's chickens
May Celebrations
Air Trader's Voyage
Sorcerer's Pilgrimage
**Autumn Zodiac w/Moon Bear (new) building + 2:1 crafting recipe for previous year's bears
Halloween Misty Forest

As we can see, the only events that have repeated from 2019 through 2020 have been the Carnival (which gave a set in 2019 so is not applicable in our current study), and the Phoenix + Zodiac events... everything else is either 100% different themed, and/or was simply a short single quest line event vs. a full blown interactive event.
(ie: why would a Sorcerer's themed event give Mermaid conversions?!)

And yes, Winter Magic is back on Beta now, and while there appears to be no conversion yet for the previous year's building, that Gingerbread House was also universally panned as the single most under powered 'grand prize' of all time.
The Witch's Hut on the other hand is most definitely an S-tier building, on par with both the Fire/Storm Phoenix & Brown Bear for what it gives... Time will tell of course if we *do* get the chance to acquire more upgrades for it next year, but thus far, we've had 2/3 "repeat" events that have given us that option.

 

[ajqtrz]

I'm getting 31 orc strategist per hour from my grounds of orc strategist That 744 per Grounds per day. 8 squares means almost 100 orc strategist per square per day. The mistake is it's 32 per hour, not day. In addition, my orc strat grounds provide 6800 culture (lvl 15). That's 850 culture per square.

So: 740 orc strats and 6800 culture for 8 squares for the grounds of the orc stratigest

vs a lvl 3 Witch Hut (which is about the best you can do with the event and FA) gives you,

1738 pop, 8140 culture, 1452 frogs and 1792 orcs.

For most players the extra pop and culture are okay, but not worth a lot. If you are in chapters below about 8 you may still be experiencing some pop problems, but you are usually at the point were you can solve them pretty easily. So it is, in my opinion, the orcs and frogs that really make the building worth something. But is it more than the Grounds of the Orc Strategist, square per square?

Since the Grounds of the Orc Strategist is 16 squares and the Witch Hut is 16 to compare square per square you increase the Grounds of theOrc Strategist by 1/2 (or equivelant to 4 squares) to 1116 orc strategist. You also need to consider that Orcs need to be trained to be Orc Strategists so there is that cost as well.

The Witch Hut, at lvl 2, (which is probably what that second Witch Hut will be for most players) the orcs and frogs are: 1320 and 1590. Thus, square per square, I think, a bit less than the same number squares dedicated to a Grounds of the Orc Strategist.

So if you think 1188 frogs and 1431 orcs are worth the same or more than 1116 orc stats, you will consider Soggy's statement about a lvl 1 Witch Hut to be true. If you, as I, think the value isn't quite there, you will disagree. In the end, my analysis says that Soggy is close to right but just a bit short for a level one Witch Hut. And at level 3 the 2nd Witch Hut is worth the space but below that it's a close call to a reasonably firm "not."

AJ

 

[The Unbeliever]

For Human players, especially pre-Halflings chapter players, ANY amount of Frogs is automatically an A-tier building, since Mortars are arguably fighting Barbarians for the title of 'most useless unit in the game.'

I'm not placing my Witch Hut for the Boyz. I'm placing it so I can have a usable heavy range unit that doesn't get its *** handed to it by the very things it's supposed to beat the gak out of.
(...seriously, Mortars are the ultimate suck.)

 

[Henroo]

The frogs are not that great at 1 star. The human mortar is not a great heavy ranged unit. Yet my 3 star mortars have higher attack values and more range than the 1 star frogs. From everything I have read, the frogs will get considerably better once they get promotions, but looking ahead in the tech tree that does not happen until fairly late in the game. I have multiple chapters to get through before I get there. Until a player reaches this level, the frogs are not as valuable. However even at 1 star I can win fights with Orc Strategist that I can't win with 3 star mortars. And I think that a 1 star Orc Strategist is much better than a 1 star frog. Furthermore the promotions for Orc Strategist come earlier than the ones for frogs. I think for a player in the early to middle stages of the game, this should be considered when evaluating a low level Witch Hut vs Grounds of Orc Strategist.

 

[DarkKitty]

OK, I'm slow on the uptake here because this is the first event I've played where I'm actually going to place the building. So I don't know any of the mechanics. I am *so close* to Chapter 6 but I needed to claim the building and the artifacts before the event expired. I'm a little sad that I didn't make it in time to grab the Witch's Hut at the higher base level.

I definitely want this building: It's cute and I worked hard for it.

What, if anything, can I do at this point that will give me a higher base Hut? Can I place and delete it in hopes it will show up in crafting? Will RR work on it? Thanks in advance for your patience with the noobie details.

 

[Henroo]

@DarkKitty Yes Royal Restoration will upgrade the Witch Hut. It will also work on any other event building. You will need 1 RR spell for every space it occupies. Since it is a 4x4, you will need 16 RRs

 

[DarkKitty]

Cool, thank you @Henroo.

So, is that the only method, then? RR spells?

 

[samidodamage]

think 1188 frogs and 1431 orcs are worth the same or more than 1116 orc stats

As an elf, with one city where frogs are 2* (orc strats there are still 2* as well), and the other city they're 3*: the frogs alone are worth more to me than the orc strats. I use golems way more than the orc strats anyway and get a few of them free from the Temple of Toads (placed mostly to increase heavy range attack power). With the new structure and range & initiative being king (imo), frogs win hands down. They have attack bonus against both light range(though less than the orc strats) and light melee where orc strats only have attack bonus against light melee. Much more versatile unit for me as they also get first strike against enemy heavy range. I saw how valuable they were in my first city, so started making them in the 2nd city while they were 1* (and less useful) so I had decent stock when they went to 2*. I've not regretted that decision yet...

 

[Henroo]

@DarkKitty Yes, RR is the only method in the game to upgrade event buildings or any other magical building. With the exception of Magical Workshops and Magical residences, those 2 buildings require a Blueprint to upgrade.

 

[The Unbeliever]

The frogs are not that great at 1 star. The human mortar is not a great heavy ranged unit. Yet my 3 star mortars have higher attack values and more range than the 1 star frogs. From everything I have read, the frogs will get considerably better once they get promotions, but looking ahead in the tech tree that does not happen until fairly late in the game. I have multiple chapters to get through before I get there. Until a player reaches this level, the frogs are not as valuable. However even at 1 star I can win fights with Orc Strategist that I can't win with 3 star mortars. And I think that a 1 star Orc Strategist is much better than a 1 star frog. Furthermore the promotions for Orc Strategist come earlier than the ones for frogs. I think for a player in the early to middle stages of the game, this should be considered when evaluating a low level Witch Hut vs Grounds of Orc Strategist.

Even Lv1 Frogs will moderately out preform Lv3 Mortars vs. enemy Light Infantry, since the Frogs have far better bonuses, AND, a Lv1 Frog has more HP than even a Lv3 Mortar!!
Against enemy light ranged, Ork Strats even @Lv1 are a better option, *except* when there's enemy knights/v.guards about. (again, simply due to the specialized bonus)

The Mortar's damage spread is just far too swingy, and even on a good RNG roll, he just doesn't pack enough of a punch, while he takes a shedload of damage in return - even from enemy light units, despite his supposed 40-50% reduction bonus...
Maybe he works (slightly?) better if you have the time to grind away manual fighting everything? But with just auto fighting, he's a waste of time. I can't even begin to recall the number of times I've had ALL my garbage Mortars wiped out by a field of enemy light units, even with decent terrain helping out.
Seems to be the only times my Mortars don't utterly suicide themselves is when the terrain is perfectly set up to completely screw over the enemy units!

 

[DarkKitty]

Gotcha. So abandon all hope of crafting a new one and just concentrate on RR. Thank you again, @Henroo .

What's the point of certain base buildings showing up in crafting rotation then? Why can't they be evolved?

 

[The Unbeliever]

Gotcha. So abandon all hope of crafting a new one and just concentrate on RR. Thank you again, @Henroo .

What's the point of certain base buildings showing up in crafting rotation then? Why can't they be evolved?

because the Elvenar devs are cruel.

 

[StarLoad]

Not sure why you guys compare frogs output with GotOS output, at least at 1:1. To me, frogs are a lot less valuable than strategists. I can produce virtually unlimited amounts of frogs as they only need supplies and time. SOS production has a cap based on orc production, and that can't really be rushed.

If you are going to compare do not use the Orc Strat use the Orc Nest, Like MinMax is saying its apples and oranges. Even trying to compare the Orc Strat vrs the Frog is silly in the long run.

 

[Kekune]

The mistake is it's 32 per hour, not day.

Well, shoot. This is why I usually leave the numbers to other folks, lol. Sorry for the flub.

As I replied to min-max earlier, I really haven't considered the troop output much before this conversation. I've compared the orcs output to my other sources of orcs, and it compares very well even at low levels. And free troops (one of my favorite kinds of troops, no less) is just gravy.

 

[Gath Of Baal]

OK, I'm slow on the uptake here because this is the first event I've played where I'm actually going to place the building. So I don't know any of the mechanics. I am *so close* to Chapter 6 but I needed to claim the building and the artifacts before the event expired. I'm a little sad that I didn't make it in time to grab the Witch's Hut at the higher base level.

I definitely want this building: It's cute and I worked hard for it.

What, if anything, can I do at this point that will give me a higher base Hut? Can I place and delete it in hopes it will show up in crafting? Will RR work on it? Thanks in advance for your patience with the noobie details.

If you have not placed it yet and want to save Royal Restorations

Then you could disassemble the base and wait for it to show up as a recipe in the crafter.. I did this with my Coldfire Phoenix and it did take about 5 months for it to show up to craft but by then i was 3 chapters further into the game and got a new Coldfire base to reflect that.

The downside to doing it this way is that you cannot place it immediately and gain the benefits it provides

Edit: If you place it and then sell it you can get a higher base back but you will loose any artifacts you evolved it with.. By Not placing and disassembling it you will still have the artifacts to evolve your new base when you craft it

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

If you have not placed it yet and want to save Royal Restorations

Then you could disassemble the base and wait for it to show up as a recipe in the crafter.. I did this with my Coldfire Phoenix and it did take about 5 months for it to show up to craft but by then i was 3 chapters further into the game and got a new Coldfire base to reflect that.

The downside to doing it this way is that you cannot place it immediately and gain the benefits it provides

IF they ever add it to the crafting rotation. The May Tree base is still in there and the Wise Golem base was never added. So either they are way behind or do not plan on adding any more bases to crafting. For that matter, while the Phoenix are still in there, I am pretty sure that all the bears went away with the conversion recipe at the end of that FA. So for now, do not expect to see anything other than the four Phoenix bases.

 

[DarkKitty]

Thanks, @Gath Of Baal and @Enevhar Aldarion.

So, is there any way of knowing? Is there a list of what is or isn't in rotation? How soon did the May Tree show up after the event?

 

[Lelanya]

Hey DarkKitty
It's nice to see you have finished the event so well
The answers lie in the Release Notes, as a rule, the crafting changes are often Announced there. Sometimes one of the staff may hint or even tell us on a feedback thread.
Beta Forum, and News From Beta in General here, are useful sources of information. On Beta the thread Undocumented Changes is a fascinating read.