Goods Imbalance

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Expired Trades? Well buddy... that’s an excellent idea. You’re thinking out of the box. Those who insist on having cursed trades can submit them, those from inactive players would go away and the rest of us wouldn’t have constant trouble seeing them all the time.

Have you tried recommending that?

Trades already expire after 7 days. Inno just needs to shorten the time it takes for that to happen.

 

[DeletedUser20951]

Trade decay would be great at eliminating some of the third tier excess, but I hesitate to fully endorse it due to how unfair it could in certain situations, such as dead neighborhoods or inability to log on frequently. I'm all for a shortened trade expiration, though, and it prompted the idea that perhaps separate notifications (think another button) would have merit, one for various aid/interactions and one for trade acceptance, with the addition of notes when your trades have expired? I've felt for quite a while that having these divided into different locations would be nice, make it easier to keep track of both, but it's never been a must-have-MUST-HAVE-NOW type of thing for me. Just, yeah, "That'd be nice and neat and more orderly."

 

[DeletedUser20951]

Also, I've brought it up in the past with a snarky "lower tier fairy" comment, but I genuinely wonder, if a huge swath of players, mainly advanced and high-producing, are pumping out massive amounts of third tier with little to no incentive to construct second or first tier factories, where are all of these lower tier goods supposed to come from? They won't/don't exist to trade for.

 

[WolfSinger]

My ranking has taken a dive lately as I decided I no longer care to chase ranking. I have 4 each T1, T2 and T3 manufactures as wee as 2 each of my boosted sentient goods. I do a mix of cater and auto fight in tourneys. I typically am able to balance goods without CT trades - but after a a heavy goods tourney (like scrolls) I will post a few (usually T2 for T1 and at 1 asking for 1.5)

If we're getting these set buildings that are driving part of the imbalance - maybe the dev team should give consideration to changing the Crystal Lighthouse back to what it was before it was nerf'd.

 

[DeletedUser20255]

Also, I've brought it up in the past with a snarky "lower tier fairy" comment, but I genuinely wonder, if a huge swath of players, mainly advanced and high-producing, are pumping out massive amounts of third tier with little to no incentive to construct second or first tier factories, where are all of these lower tier goods supposed to come from? They won't/don't exist to trade for.

Theoretically the market should correct the over-production by the producers realizing there is a glut and switching production. There is some legitimate need for cross-tier trades for newbies who haven't geared up yet and occasional need to level production. Also I'm sure some of the trades get clicked on accidentally by players in a hurry. But that should only account for a small portion. I have no explanation for why "advanced" players pump out 3rd tier goods. Classic scenario for inflation.

 

[DeletedUser20951]

Theoretically the market should correct the over-production by the producers realizing there is a glut and switching production.

I have no explanation for why "advanced" players pump out 3rd tier goods.

The reasons have already been pointed out on this, which are mainly score, ease of access, and efficiency. Switching production to focus on lower tier results in a loss in all three categories, so you pretty much have to knowingly handicap yourself, and you're unlikely to find enough players clamoring to do so. I personally resent, strongly, the concept of supplying those overproducing third tier with my first and second tier drudgery. It is not an even exchange of labor.

 

[Deborah M]

The reasons have already been pointed out on this, which are mainly score, ease of access, and efficiency. Switching production to focus on lower tier results in a loss in all three categories, so you pretty much have to knowingly handicap yourself, and you're unlikely to find enough players clamoring to do so. I personally resent, strongly, the concept of supplying those overproducing third tier with my first and second tier drudgery. It is not an even exchange of labor.

Yup. The first time I got a really bad feeling against cross tier trades was when a top 10 player sold off all their T1 in favor of gaining ranking by replacing with T3 and cross tier trading for all T1. That’s why I filter them all out. When I think of it I do still check for the newer players. They don’t put a dent in my inventory so no reason not to.

 

[DeletedUser20951]

The first time I got a really bad feeling against cross tier trades was when a top 10 player sold off all their T1 in favor of gaining ranking by replacing with T3 and cross tier trading for all T1.

I was blissfully unaware of this tactic for a very long time, and was, quite frankly, completely dumbfounded when it was explained to me... I understood the goal, but my mind balked and wanted to flee into the hills at how utterly selfish a strategy it is. "Wait, hold up, players actually do that?! WHERE IS MY CLEANSING FIRE? A desperate need for an exorcism is nigh!"

 

[DeletedUser2959]

I've stopped taking cross-tier, even from my FS. I'm not going to fill my city with T1 manu's and the residences and workshops to support them just so someone else doesn't have to balance their production.

 

[DeletedUser20255]

With all due respect none of the responses above answer why the law of supply and demand is suspended. I get the point about score but what good does it do if you have a high score but you're producing goods that nobody wants? The point I was addressing is that few people are picking up these trades.

 

[NightshadeCS]

With all due respect none of the responses above answer why the law of supply and demand is suspended. I get the point about score but what good does it do if you have a high score but you're producing goods that nobody wants? The point I was addressing is that few people are picking up these trades.

I disagree. The trades ARE being taken. These are the reasons why:

1. Many (most?) players trust the star system of the trader and take 2 or 3 star cross-tier thinking there is no downside to them.
2. Some players are quite altuistic and if they have enough to spare, want to help others who seem to be struggling with a tier.
3. Early chapter players want to get a jump on tier 3 goods before having to build those factories so accept the cross-tier goods (and also likely suffer from point #1).

 

[Ashrem]

Okay, I'm beaten. I'm going to start filling the trader with "three Star" cross tier trades so I can share the pleasure with others.

 

[DeletedUser20951]

Another mystery is how quickly players grasp the benefit of accepting the rare lower tier offering asking for higher (GOOD cross-tier), yet making the leap that the inverse version of such trades are the opposite of beneficial is a struggle. *scratches head*

 

[DeletedUser20951]

With all due respect none of the responses above answer why the law of supply and demand is suspended. I get the point about score but what good does it do if you have a high score but you're producing goods that nobody wants? The point I was addressing is that few people are picking up these trades.

I had to ponder this, because it genuinely confused me, as we've stated fairly explicitly why it is not in the best interest of a player to accept them, but your question is why people keep posting these trades? Well, it doesn't truly cost them anything to, there are likely a goodish amount accidentally accepted to make it worthwhile, I've met plenty of players that do accept any trade they can in order to be helpful, and stubbornness is a common trait. You, yourself, first addressed this matter by expressing the fact that your cross-tier were not being taken often enough to support your fellowship and still you continued to put them up.

 

[Ashrem]

Maybe if more people "shared our good fortune" by maintaining 50 "good" cross-tier trades we could trigger a few epiphanies.

 

[DeletedUser20951]

Maybe if more people "shared our good fortune" by maintaining 50 "good" cross-tier trades we could trigger a few epiphanies.

Oh, the comments of "good fortune" have been annoying me. Dude, I wasn't given these goods, I've earned them with nary a cross-tier ever placed!

I could probably manage to post GOOD cross-tier for a day or two, but I suspect that the active cross-tier posters in my areas would snap them up and my already acrimonious view of them might turn decidedly murderous.

 

[DeletedUser20255]

I disagree. The trades ARE being taken. These are the reasons why:

1. Many (most?) players trust the star system of the trader and take 2 or 3 star cross-tier thinking there is no downside to them.
2. Some players are quite altuistic and if they have enough to spare, want to help others who seem to be struggling with a tier.
3. Early chapter players want to get a jump on tier 3 goods before having to build those factories so accept the cross-tier goods (and also likely suffer from point #1).

I'm glad to hear cross-tier trades are being taken. Problem solved then (but i'm not sure how we got here from all the bemoaning of CT trades cluttering up the trader).

 

[DeletedUser20255]

Another mystery is how quickly players grasp the benefit of accepting the rare lower tier offering asking for higher (GOOD cross-tier), yet making the leap that the inverse version of such trades are the opposite of beneficial is a struggle. *scratches head*

Assuming we are still talking about advanced players here I concur. But everyday brings more newbies. I took a "good cross-tier" trade offered by a FS member this week. And then told her she is cheating herself. Education is a never-ending mission.
If you pay attention to the names of the biggest offenders it becomes pretty obvious that these are people who know better but turn a deaf ear to complaints in chat.

 

[Ashrem]

I could probably manage to post GOOD cross-tier for a day or two, but I suspect that the active cross-tier posters in my areas would snap them up

Good was in quotes for a reason. I posted 60 trades of things like 11 gems for 40 scrolls and 13 elixir for 50 crystal.

 

[DeletedUser20255]

I had to ponder this, because it genuinely confused me, as we've stated fairly explicitly why it is not in the best interest of a player to accept them, but your question is why people keep posting these trades? Well, it doesn't truly cost them anything to, there are likely a goodish amount accidentally accepted to make it worthwhile, I've met plenty of players that do accept any trade they can in order to be helpful, and stubbornness is a common trait. You, yourself, first addressed this matter by expressing the fact that your cross-tier were not being taken often enough to support your fellowship and still you continued to put them up.

Thank you for expressing your confusion. My initial point had to do with production (why don't players switch production to match market trends). The response was because they'd lose to many ranking points. That's where I'm still confused. You keep your 3rd tier production because you don't want to lose ranking points. In the meantime your excess 3rd tier goods are mounting up in inventory and not doing you any good until you trade them. Of necessity a downward CT trade.
I guess the point is the problem is local. Some of us have a major problem with imbalance of trade (this topic) others don't and just want to justify keeping their 3rd tier production for the score's sake. Have I got it now?