How do YOU feel about Cross-tier Trading?

[Deborah M]

I had a player once who sold all his Tier One and Tier Two manufactories and insisted that the rest of the fellowship to make for him what he was not prepared to make himself.
Needless to say, he is no longer with us...

We had somebody who did that with T1 to make room for Elementals but then rebuilt them.

 

[DeletedUser3468]

I had a player once who sold all his Tier One and Tier Two manufactories and insisted that the rest of the fellowship to make for him what he was not prepared to make himself.
Needless to say, he is no longer with us...

I've run into players like that too. After being told he needed to produce all 3 tiers of his boosted goods, he complied for a short time and then returned to his old ways. Yeah, he got booted too. (Making it even worse, this was in a Fellowship that actively discouraged cross tier trading)

 

[kctanzen]

If there was some mechanism (likely hard to code though) for a secondary, FS only subset of trades .. this could be alleviate some of these issues. Perhaps a 3 : 1 ratio of non FS trades open and accepted for each FS only trade .. capping FS trades at 10ish, non FS remains the same.
This would allow internal cross tiering to happen with whatever beneficial weighting you want or need to help out smaller folks or make better use of production leveraging BUT would still require you to participate in the broader open trade network. Just spitballin' though....

 

[Ashrem]

Any restriction on who can see some trades is likely to be detrimental to a game where there are already many people who don't have access to enough trades to function well.

 

[DeletedUser]

@Ashrem has a very good point, and before anyone who also plays FOE says, "well, there's a Guild-only option for the trade market there", consider whether or not it was part of the game to begin with. When I started FOE two and a half years ago, it was already in place, and as much as I like it there, I don't think it would be such a great thing here. There are players who would be shut out entirely, which would be just as bad, imo, as prohibiting cross-tier trades.

 

[kctanzen]

Any restriction on who can see some trades is likely to be detrimental to a game where there are already many people who don't have access to enough trades to function well.

Totally agree -- hence my spitballin' approach
Idea wasn't Intended to limit trades but promote more trading in general, since the limited view trades would be a small ratio of normal transactions.
Heck, if the Lighthouse can generate 3 random neighbor help chests - should be pretty easy to put a flag on FS only trades in a rolling window as well.
Or use the same timer as a building set for x number of records.

 

[Ashrem]

Totally agree -- hence my spitballin' approach
Idea wasn't Intended to limit trades but promote more trading in general, since the limited view trades would be a small ratio of normal transactions.
Heck, if the Lighthouse can generate 3 random neighbor help chests - should be pretty easy to put a flag on FS only trades in a rolling window as well.
Or use the same timer as a building set for x number of records.

Easy vs hard isn't the point. Eventually, the majority of the high-quality trades would be reserved for FS only (even if they had to restrict themselves to ten at a time), and if made a ratio, some would manipulate even the most stringent of ratios by posting dozens of bad trades in order to protect the largest possible number of good ones.

One of the game's greatest shortcomings is low interaction between players causing retention trouble. Anything that reduces positive interaction between strangers is likely to exacerbate that effect.

 

[Jackluyt]

Timon said in a recent Q&A that he does not intend to add more filters to the Trader - he said it is already too complicated for the average player.

 

[Ashrem]

he said it is already too complicated for the average player.

This is why we can't have nice things....

 

[kctanzen]

One of the game's greatest shortcomings is low interaction between players causing retention trouble. Anything that reduces positive interaction between strangers is likely to exacerbate that effect.

There have been weeks that have gone by that, other than fellowship members (and chat when working) I get no interaction from other players, other than a notification that somebody took a trade or stopped by my city to help out. And even in the fellowship, it can be pretty scarce and sporadic, and not just because others have life away from a computer or game. There just isn't a strong sense of community and conversation in the game that I have experienced.-Forums are a completely different kettle o' fish though!

 

[samidodamage]

About cross-tier trades: Don't post them, don't usually take them (will if the player meets certain criteria) and have had the discussion with FS members about them. Have had the FS member who built just enough T1 & 2 (3 each; dwarves level) and then filled up on T3's (8 at last count); posted all cross tier trades and complained no one was picking up their trades. Decided to handle it by having a conversation about value: the value of anything is what someone else will pay for it. Members are obligated to pick up other members same tier trades for their boosted goods. Members may take other trades if the trades have value to them, but are not obligated. If you get those T1 boosted goods to take those trades by making them or trading T3 for them or find a fairy to fly them in to your inventory, I don't care as long as you accept same tier trades for your boosts. Members will make their own decisions about cross tier trades and the value they have for them. While the cross tier member did constantly put up chat posts about all the 3 star trades they had posted (yep, 1000 T3 for 15000 T1 is a 3 star trade ) that ended the discussion on why people weren't taking their trades. They hung in there for several months until they left the FS supposedly because they weren't getting enough visits from FS members.

 

[DeletedUser9433]

@1Cinner How did you even find this thread lol

I'm a blonde that should explain it all lol.......

 

[mucksterme]

he does not intend to add more filters to the Trader - he said it is already too complicated for the average player.

then i fear what that says about the average player

 

[ekarat]

Our fellowship just added a requirement that all trades (by experienced players) be 3 stars. Members are strongly encouraged to pick up other members' trades. Trades have a quantity limit of 5000 (they are debating lowering it to 2000), so that newer members don't feel bad when they cannot fill a more experienced member's trades because it is too large.

Cross tier trades are allowed and extremely common.

I personally find the result to be a disaster. Think through the implications.

My point is that the star rating system has consequences, especially when the rates that define a 2 star trade do not match the rates that define a fair trade for a lot of people. I do not think cross-tier trades are the problem, so much as the star rating system values cross-tier trades inaccurately.

 

[Deborah M]

Seriously? That is ridiculous. It isn't like only FS members are going to see and pick up the trades. I would be out of that FS in a heartbeat!

Just a suggestion. In our FS and when I was in a smaller FS if we want to help someone we arranged in chat & had them post 4 to 1 trades. That way you can help but others won't take it since It is a "bad" trade.

 

[mucksterme]

Our fellowship just added a requirement that all trades (by experienced players) be 3 stars. Members are strongly encouraged to pick up other members' trades. Trades have a quantity limit of 5000 (they are debating lowering it to 2000), so that newer members don't feel bad when they cannot fill a more experienced member's trades because it is too large.

Cross tier trades are allowed and extremely common.

I personally find the result to be a disaster. Think through the implications.

My point is that the star rating system has consequences, especially when the rates that define a 2 star trade do not match the rates that define a fair trade for a lot of people. I do not think cross-tier trades are the problem, so much as the star rating system values cross-tier trades inaccurately.

First off, it's your FS you can do what you want so I'm not criticizing.
BUT
A couple of notes that would bother me about it.
As far as requiring 3 star, if that is the only requirement it is practically meaningless. I have seen people post "3 star" trades that are 3010 Steel for 3000 Plank. big deal
personally. my standard trade is a 10% markup. ie 5500 Steel for 5000 Plank

The other thing is demanding a 2000 limit. Do you know how annoying that would be when you need 100K crystal?

 

[kctanzen]

Min / max trade requirements would be a pretty big indication that I would not be part of that fellowship for long.

 

[SoggyShorts]

Trades have a quantity limit of 5000 (they are debating lowering it to 2000)

Your FS produces roughly 174K steel per day. Assuming those players want to balance their T1, that's
58K steel for planks
58K steel for marble
Your FS also makes 240K scrolls per day
80K scrolls for crystal
80K scrolls for silk
For T3 154K dust is
51K dust for elixir
51K dust for gems
--------------------
Total number of 2,000 trades per day: 189. That is 24 pages of trades every single day.

A 2K limit on trades might be the crappiest FS rule I've heard of.

Spoiler: These are my current trades up

 

[DeletedUser3507]

I have started to give at least 90% of my trades as 3 stars, As I can afford it..

Spoiler: Inventory

And I do take cross tier trades...
@SoggyShorts this is my justification for having more manufactures

 

[DeletedUser188]

This goes against my better judgement about commenting on necroed (is that even a word) threads but here goes

@Ashrem has a very good point, and before anyone who also plays FOE says, "well, there's a Guild-only option for the trade market there", consider whether or not it was part of the game to begin with.

When I started playing FoE over 5 years ago there wasn't a guild only trade option and they added it after players asked for it
Also when FoE started there weren't any guilds just like Elvenar didn't have any Fellowships when it was released
So never say never when it comes to inno games