Imagining new pet abilities

[Risen Malchiah]

Some pets are utterly fantastic, dare I say game-changing. Others have been rather disappointing.

Fire Phoenix (+attack power for 24 hrs)
Storm Phoenix (+MM spell power for 3.5 hrs)
Aureate Phoenix (+boosted goods for 3.5 hrs)
Brown Bear (+troop bonus for 12hrs)
Polar Bear (-cooldown for tourneys for 5 days)
Panda Bear (free goods starting from the 2nd pet food used)
Coldfire Phoenix (+KP for completed scouts in 24 hrs?)

I'm curious what ideas everyone has for new pets & abilities. Consider Fire Phoenix & Brown Bear as the top end, and Panda (which requires 2 pet food to get anything) and the new Coldfire Phoenix (+KP from a completed scout) as being the low end. (This is more a discussion and bantering of ideas rather than something polished enough to present in the ideas thread.)

Aside from a truly awesome +health ability, mine would be:

Giant Tortoise - +% increased speed bonus on builders that have been blessed for 1 hr. Inno incentive: It could encourage players to buy more builders to maximize benefits. Player benefit: Feed the tortoise when you have 3-5 blessed builders and plan on upgrading a ton of stuff at once, especially if the upgrades are particularly long. Downside: Potentially the same thing as using time boosters but uses pet food instead and could be worth more or less than a time booster depending on the building being upgraded.

 

[Ashrem]

A few thoughts

Wolf - Spirit-sniffing - Reduces Spire cool-down doors by a percentage when fed.
Gnome - Alchemy - increases boost percentages temporarily
Gorgon - Instill Fear - Reduces enemy troops movement by % for time
Minotaur - Fierceness - Adds damage to melee troops only % for time
Dryad - Beauty - Double culture bonus for time
Dolphin - Trade - Expands regular goods offers, or removes fees on trades for xx hours
Gryphon - speed workers - reduce workshop production times by % for time
Sphinx - Expansion - Adds extra builder for xx hours or speeds builders by 25% for xx hours

 

[Black watch]

A few thoughts

Wolf - Spirit-sniffing - Reduces Spire cool-down doors by a percentage when fed.
Gnome - Alchemy - increases boost percentages temporarily
Gorgon - Instill Fear - Reduces enemy troops movement by % for time
Minotaur - Fierceness - Adds damage to melee troops only % for time
Dryad - Beauty - Double culture bonus for time
Dolphin - Trade - Expands regular goods offers, or removes fees on trades for xx hours
Gryphon - speed workers - reduce workshop production times by % for time
Sphinx - Expansion - Adds extra builder for xx hours or speeds builders by 25% for xx hours

YEAH... YES PLEASE!!!

 

[Risen Malchiah]

Gorgon - Instill Fear - Reduces enemy troops movement by % for time
Gryphon - speed workers - reduce workshop production times by % for time

All great ideas, but these two jump out at me in particular.

The Gryphon would be similar in concept to the temporary increased speed days that Inno experimented with in the past. I can see this being quite valuable. And if there was a pet that affected factories, it would be a boon to caterers and be fantastic when combined with Aureate and Storm.

The Gorgon would be outstanding and might encourage more manual fighting to make the most out of it. Finally something to hamper those pesky mistwalkers. But as much as I would love this, I wonder if this would upset the balance of units too much? I also thought of something that raises our initiative slightly (potentially allowing a mage to act before an archer, etc ) but figured there was no way Inno would go for that. If we can discuss possible scenarios of how the Gorgon would work (good or bad), it might help.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Other than the often-requested defense boost for troops, as that is the only thing really with no way to boost, I would not even list any ability that duplicates something that we already get in-game, whether from building AWs or from promoting troops to 3-star and unlocking their abilities. So I do not expect any other ways to boost troop damage or anything that would reduce enemy attack or defense, etc. I would say the same thing about AWs in general, but we did get that one bear that reduces tournament cooldown, while also have an AW that does that. I know that one was aimed at early-game players, so there may be a chance with that happening with other late-game AW abilities also.

As for Builder boosts, one thing I and others have suggested in the past is a way to use more than one Builder at a time on a build or upgrade, where each Builder after the first would reduce the time by another 5%, so the normal one builder would be the normal 10%, but say you use all five builders with the effect active and it would reduce the build time by 30%. This, or other builder ideas, may or may not be worth a pet food though, depending on the amount of time instants in the game.

 

[Ashrem]

I would not even list any ability that duplicates something that we already get in-game

I think that's a mistake. Graphic dependent games like Elvenar depend heavily on every player's ability to have something that looks unique. As long as the buildings don't stack with each other, I think having two or three or ten different buildings that do similar things in different strengths and combinations is good for the game. Avoiding buildings that become "must-haves" like the fire phoenix for anyone who ever wants to fight is important, which is where (I think) the resistance to redeploying it comes from. But if there were two, or three, or four different buildings that were almost as strong in combination, but take up substantially more space and multiple feedings to achieve the effect, they allow people to approximate the same thing without all having the same city. Combining my suggested minotaur with the existing troop buildings which boost light ranged and mages, and adding another building to boost heavy ranged lets them make the Enlightened light ranged and Magnificent Mage buildings very rare, and forcing players to dedicate at least two buildings in their city (and preferably more) to get the effect with any regularity.

I'm going to say I think the Fire Phoenix was a mistake. I think it should probably be nerfed, whether to a smaller effect, or to a more restricted effect, or shorter one. and replaced with five different buildings that each affect a single troop, or only allowed to funciton for one day per feeding, while a unit speicfic building could be effective for five days. So if the Minotaur were +50% to heavy melee only (for five days) while the Fire phoenix were 20% to all troops for five days (or 50% to all troops for one day or even just 8 hours), they could coexist with less balance threat. It would also force serious fighters to devote a larger area of their city. 16 squares for the phoenix, and another 9 squares for each of the unit-type-specific buildings would be over sixty squares, which is more than two full expansions before roads.

 

[DeletedUser24439]

I would welcome a pet ability that gave an additional 4th turn in spire convinces for a short period of time.

A level 1 would only give 3 minutes but each level would add another 3 minutes so at level 10 you could have a 30 minute effect for an additional turn.

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

A few thoughts
....

The following is not a criticism, but rather my personal view on the ideas, for discussion purposes A few of these ideas are basically dressing up exchange of pet food for a limited time boost. Not that there is anything wrong with that But personally, I'd be hard pressed exchanging limited pet food for something that can be done with time boosts, unless the rate is exceptional. A lot is based on a fact that currently, pet food is less available than time instants (which can change of course).

>> Wolf - Spirit-sniffing - Reduces Spire cool-down doors by a percentage when fed.
Unlike tournaments, spire cooldown can be rushed with time boosts quite effectively (and conveniently enough, you get timeboosts from the Spire). So unless the percentage reduction is quite high, I'd lean on conserving pet food vs timeboosts. If looking at cooldown reduction, I'd much rather see bypassing waiting on several gates completely rather than proportionate reduction. Dropping several gates to zero has a convenience factor, you can solve those encounters when you have time in one go. But then it makes it exactly a replacement for dropping several time instants at the gates.

>> Gnome - Alchemy - increases boost percentages temporarily
Isn't this basically Aureate/Storm Phoenix (never remember which is which)?

>> Gorgon - Instill Fear - Reduces enemy troops movement by % for time
This is interesting and pretty unique effect, which may or may not be pretty powerful. The problem is, with most people doing autofight it might be really hard to figure out contribution of this effect to fighting efficiency.

>> Minotaur - Fierceness - Adds damage to melee troops only % for time
This is rather straightforward, and definitely useful effect, considering we don't have expiring buildings with melee boosts. Can do extra damage as described, or can do extra health (just for melee), to even out the odds a bit against ranged units.

>> Dryad - Beauty - Double culture bonus for time
Not quite sure what the use case for that would be, really. Pet food for extra coins / supplies? Not sure I like this trade off...

>> Dolphin - Trade - Expands regular goods offers, or removes fees on trades for xx hours
This might be interesting for early game players, probably will do nothing for late game. With removal of fees you probably would want to pre-arrange some trade exchanges as to not waste time of effect. Not sure how expansion of regular goods would work, it might be simpler.

>> Gryphon - speed workers - reduce workshop production times by % for time
Again, something that can be done with time boosts, and unless the reduction is massive (or for a long time), I just don't see trading pet food for extra supplies (especially considering supplies are capped). And with PoPs and supply instants out there, I would think that these would be better at getting extra supplies in a pinch.

>> Sphinx - Expansion - Adds extra builder for xx hours or speeds builders by 25% for xx hours
Also a direct substitution for time boosts. Maybe other people do massive rebuilds more often, but I went through the whole game with 3 (later on 4) builders, and can't say that I was particularly constrained by builders at any point of time. There were a few cases where I did a lot of building (primarily residence upgrades, and some others), but again, wouldn't be spending pet food (and space for the pet itself) to deal with these limited scenarios. Unless it dramatically cuts off build times, so instead of upgrading a couple of dozen residences over a week you can do it in a day or two.

Maybe with such an effect the metagame may change - and it would make sense to build/rebuild things more often. Perhaps effect could have something to do with fast-tracking multiple upgrades of the same building. E.g. nowadays building maxed out workshop from scratch is a very, very long process later in the game. So if that can be fast tracked for cheap (relatively), that might be valuable (also, for upgrade quests).

 

[Ashrem]

Unlike tournaments, spire cooldown can be rushed with time boosts quite effectively (and conveniently enough, you get timeboosts from the Spire). So unless the percentage reduction is quite high, I'd lean on conserving pet food vs timeboosts.

Again, something that can be done with time boosts,

Also a direct substitution for time boosts.

Time boosts are (apparently) going to be harder to come by, and maybe nearly imposible for people who are afraid of the Spire

This might be interesting for early game players, probably will do nothing for late game.

Not quite sure what the use case for that would be, really. Pet food for extra coins / supplies? Not sure I like this trade off...

Any time I propose new buildings, one of my primary goals is to create meaningful choices for players. I am always in favour of buildings that some people will value and others will think are junk.

Not sure how expansion of regular goods would work

I failed to make that part clear. I was thinking an expansion of the trading area, so more visible trades.

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

Any time I propose new buildings, one of my primary goals is to create meaningful choices for players. I am always in favour of buildings that some people will value and others will think are junk.

That's fine, I have no issues with things that wouldn't be useful to me, but I can see how it can be useful for some meaningful player population. So I get trading improvements, but I still don't quite get the Gryphon. That's why I asked for a use case, as I don't quite see who / what scenario that would be for.

 

[Ashrem]

That's fine, I have no issues with things that wouldn't be useful to me, but I can see how it can be useful for some meaningful player population. So I get trading improvements, but I still don't quite get the Gryphon. That's why I asked for a use case, as I don't quite see who / what scenario that would be for.

Players in early chapters (especially those who like to participate in the tournaments) often run into a hard wall when they run out of supplies. The ability to run workshop productions faster should be useful to some of them, but possibly not enough to make it worthwhile.

 

[Risen Malchiah]

Yeah, some ideas may be redundant with time instants in the game, but as Ashrem noted, time boosters may become more difficult to obtain (outside of the Spire). They may appear in a later event if enough people make a fuss about losing them, but overall having multiple buildings that can do somewhat similar things presents newer players the ability to get buildings with interesting effects while longterm players can enjoy the synergistic effects of buildings that work together.

Polar bear is a good example. Great on its own. Absolutely amazing when paired with Timewarp.
Brown bear mimics Simia, but having both is really nice.
Storm** is fairly weak, but can be really good with a high level Elvenar Trade Center. (And if combined with a hypothetical pet that speeds up factory production could be even better.) ** Edit: I mistakenly said Aureate, which has nothing to do with MM spells.

A pet that modifies builder speed (or allows multiple builders to be used on the same building upgrade) would be a variation of time boosters, but it would give players some interesting choices. It could also make builders more valuable for diamond-spenders (which would make Inno happy).

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Aureate is fairly weak, but can be really good with a high level Elvenar Trade Center. (And if combined with a hypothetical pet that speeds up factory production could be even better.)

Do you mean Aureate or Storm? Aureate only increases your base amount of boosted goods produced, before the boost is added. Storm boosts your MM percent and uses the boosted amount for this calculation.

 

[Risen Malchiah]

You're right. I always get those mixed up. Lol I better get it straight since I plan on using the 2020 artifacts to make 2019 artifacts for the MM spell phoenix. (I already have Fire naturally.)

 

[Black watch]

So, quick question... of the two, which is better overall going forward from chapter 13. Aureate or Storm Phoenix's.
I'm leaning toward Storm, but I have a nagging suspicion I'm missing something.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

So, quick question... of the two, which is better overall going forward from chapter 13. Aureate or Storm Phoenix's.
I'm leaning toward Storm, but I have a nagging suspicion I'm missing something.

Aureate is crap if you are comparing special abilities. The bonus goods use your base production, not your boosted production.

 

[DeletedUser18111]

So, quick question... of the two, which is better overall going forward from chapter 13. Aureate or Storm Phoenix's.
I'm leaning toward Storm, but I have a nagging suspicion I'm missing something.

The Aureate is crap, just less crappy compare to the current reward this event.

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

I would welcome a pet ability that gave an additional 4th turn in spire convinces for a short period of time.

A level 1 would only give 3 minutes but each level would add another 3 minutes so at level 10 you could have a 30 minute effect for an additional turn.

Not going to happen under the current circumstances, with a 4th turn you always succees in negotiating.

I would love to see a per of wonder I don't care that drop the negotiating costs a bit in the spire.
This week so far all goed well, but it takes an insane amount of effort to keep up with the gold coin supply, so any pet that helpts in that sense is a pet I like

 

[samidodamage]

@BlackWatch, I'm going with Storm.
If timed right, I can get 2 boosted production collections from using MM spells(that increase amounts of my boosted production and if I use it first thing in the morning, that first one will be on a 9hr production). I'm way less impressed with getting 2 productions on my base production. Ex: lvl 25 Marble base production is 370 marble on a 3hr production. I know it's more on a 9hr (can't check that now), but a lvl 10 Aureate would give 740 extra marble for that 3hr collection IF I used pet food. And since it lasts the same 3.5hrs, no...just no...

 

[Black watch]

Aureate is crap if you are comparing special abilities. The bonus goods use your base production, not your boosted production.

The Aureate is crap, just less crappy compare to the current reward this event.

@BlackWatch, I'm going with Storm.
If timed right, I can get 2 boosted production collections from using MM spells(that increase amounts of my boosted production and if I use it first thing in the morning, that first one will be on a 9hr production). I'm way less impressed with getting 2 productions on my base production. Ex: lvl 25 Marble base production is 370 marble on a 3hr production. I know it's more on a 9hr (can't check that now), but a lvl 10 Aureate would give 740 extra marble for that 3hr collection IF I used pet food. And since it lasts the same 3.5hrs, no...just no...

THANK YOU SO MUCH ALL THREE OF YOU. Perfect, it's what I needed to make up my mind...
I also just finished looking at AW and found the Storm to be similar to the Elven Trade Center.... if I read the information right. Yeah, not placing the Aureate OR the Coldfire...
I can't for the life of my figure out who thought that bird was going to be a good idea.

Anyway, thank you all again, I very much appreciate it!
Blackie