Increasingly difficult tourneys

[Deleted User - 3932582]

I think 10 chest groups that do mostly catering is probably anomalous.

There shouldn't be any difference between any of the tournaments as far as catering costs, because catering is not based on troop mix, but on value.

There is no difference on per-encounter basis. You just have to cater a lot more encounters during scrolls tournament, because either fight is unwinnable, or you run out of troops way earlier

 

[The Unbeliever]

I don't get why getting 10 chests seems to be this unattainable goal. Hitting 30K in FA is difficult (and for pretty meh rewards); hitting 10 chests is not (and rewards are pretty good). You only need to hit 1600 points per person on average (for full FS), and 1600 should be relatively easy to do for any reasonably committed player no matter where in chapters he/she is. OK, perhaps FS exclusively made of chapter 1-3 players would have a hard time hitting that

Yes, even for scrolls tournament. It is just somewhat more expensive (in goods) than usual, but it is just one of the 9. You do keep some inventory of goods, right?

Well, considering how rage-inducing scrolls can easily be, demanding everyone ponies up is at the very least a hate crime against your fellows...

And I just enjoy being a bit tongue-in-cheek too.

 

[Mykan]

Forcing your fellowship to go for 10 chests on the Scrolls tournament is pretty much committing crimes against humanity.

Lol,love the wording

A fellowship that does push weeks this is fairly true, and anyone needing those relics for boosts (normal or sentient) best find another fellowship

For a fellowship that runs down 10 chests normally it is a different matter. My fellowship is down 3 people this tournament and we are still flying through chests with every expectation we will get 10. No extra pressure on members for the reduced member number or difficult tournament. We just have enough people who chase tournaments for self gain, as a result everyone benefits.

Granted dust and scrolls are the test of a 10 chest fellowship when it is first becoming a 10 chest fellowship and it is not uncommon to see these ones get chest 7 or 8 out of 9 weeks until they finally get across the line, Once there they typically don't look back.

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

For a fellowship that runs down 10 chests normally it is a different matter. My fellowship is down 3 people this tournament and we are still flying through chests with every expectation we will get 10. No extra pressure on members for the reduced member number or difficult tournament. We just have enough people who chase tournaments for self gain, as a result everyone benefits.

Exactly true for my FS as well.

 

[Ashrem]

or you run out of troops way earlier

What is this "Run out of troops" of which you speak?

Spoiler

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

What is this "Run out of troops" of which you speak?

Spoiler

View attachment 5612

Heh. This only means that you're not going far enough in tournaments

In all fairness, only in Woodelves I have reached the point when I am accumulating troops after hitting my tournament objectives. Well, for most tournament types, that is

 

[Ashrem]

I go exactly as far as I want to. Last marble was 8700+ points

 

[SGT AT ARMS]

Ok been reading- it seems battles are tougher an losses are more- However, as I sift thru what is being posted I realized that in the early stages I outgrew where I am today. Now its a game of catch up. when in actuality I should have started slower, grew slower, and let myself get to the pace the game requires-- "NOT", what I think I require. It is a game and just that- meant to be fun an challenging. Yes, I do see somethings where it is apparent the "House Rules" are against a player and in the favor of the game.( No one ever wins at the Casino all the time) Its a business for them- enjoyment for US when the two clash- well then there are rooms like this to vent. I have a GREAT FS- they set me up well from the start- advise an resources what they did NOT give me was the "Common Sense" to NOT out play myself. In Hindsight- and in future playing- its like a train crossing - stop- look- and listen. If I start losing what I think is too much in troops or res I quit attacking/negotiating. Its just that simple for me play within ones means. Just an opinion from the new guy.

 

[bkbajb]

I do not see them as getting harder, but I keep upgrading my AW's to continue adding the bonuses available. Choosing the correct troops is important. Have you missed an upgrade on the tech tree, or are you getting close to one? Try thinking through the game instead of blaming. Usually when I have a hard time I find out that I have done something wrong. Once corrected things get better

 

[The Unbeliever]

I do not see them as getting harder, but I keep upgrading my AW's to continue adding the bonuses available. Choosing the correct troops is important. Have you missed an upgrade on the tech tree, or are you getting close to one? Try thinking through the game instead of blaming. Usually when I have a hard time I find out that I have done something wrong. Once corrected things get better

The problem is that in Elvenar, and especially with the tournaments, the "game" is basically rigged against the player until you hit the final couple of chapters...
Consider that:
1. The only 2 possible military boosting AW's until end of Ch.6 are the Needles (nearly half way through Ch.3) and the Sanctuary/Monastary (end of Ch.4).
Of those, only the Sanc/MM is of any notable value early on, as your barracks is still too low a level to really get the big advantage of the training time boost.
The bulk of the military AW's are actually locked away behind the end of Ch.8 - 14. So really, until you're into WE's chapters, you're constantly fighting at a marked disadvantage, unless you can at least boost your Sanc/MM to insanely high levels and at least get the better HP boosts.
But most of your face-punching bonuses & 'freebie' troops are unavailable until the back 40% of the game. (outside of a few rare craftable buildings which seem to be few and far between now)

2. Player units & upgrades are just 'slow drips' while the enemy is always highly advanced by points X/Y/Z.
Pointless on the main map encounters, but in tournaments, it's a fething insult... The enemy starts gaining high powered 3* units by province #6, which means it's easily doable for Ch.4-5 players to be getting hosed.
Also, the fact that we're 14 friggin' chapters now and we STILL don't have all of our own units even able to research their 3* versions yet!

3. The AI is fething hot garbage.
The fight system in this game is a bloody joke. I don't have hours and hours to waste trying to cope with the gakky battle system that's even more dysfunctional & prone to crashing than FoE's notoriously awful GvG system! (and THAT'S saying something!)
So outside of buying a gaming quality PC to deal with the awful battle engine, I'm forced to auto-battle, and all the gak that brings. Thus, my troop loses are much higher each week, and I spend more goods to negotiate the many fights the AI is too slowed to fight our properly.


Really, I've been finding that between the start of Fairies and through until end of WE's, tournaments are a fething gak-filled disaster now because I just don't have the techs & AW's available at this point to counter the increased enemy strength. (notably from the bigger 'forced' SS techs)

I figure things won't start to get noticeably easier again until I can get the likes of;
- more 2-3* upgrades on the key 'dedicated' troops. (ie: doggies + orc strats for humans/blossoms for elves)
- access to Shrewdy Shrooms + FoH's + DA + TotT's. (a couple key atk boosts for the heavy units/mages + added training size boosts)

But as of now, tournaments have gone from something that was mostly fun to a friggin' nightmare!

 

[Kekune]

The problem is that in Elvenar, and especially with the tournaments, the "game" is basically rigged against the player until you hit the final couple of chapters...

That doesn't match my experience, unless by rigged you mean smaller cities can't totally dominate the tourney. To me, that seems fine - we all need something to strive for.

I'm in the 2nd half of wooodelves now, and my tournament scores have been steadily increasing. I leveled my martial monastery (currently 7) and shrine (currently 5) as soon as I got acess to them, and have made liberal use of crafted military buildings. I skipped squad size techs starting in ch 5. I only autofight, and cater when I have to. I only go to 5 stars due to schedules (and sleep).

My fellowship pushes every other week, so my scores aren't consistent, but if I evened them out I could hit 2000+ a week without sweating. That's not world domination, but it's not "gak" either. A few chapters down the road, that number will be bigger.

I guess what I'm wondering is, what are your expectations? I'm at the end of the chapter range that you say is screwed, and I don't feel that.

 

[samidodamage]

I'm at the end of the chapter range that you say is screwed, and I don't feel that.

I tend to agree with this. I wonder if me having never played any combat games until deciding to try it out here (sometime around Ch4; didn't even train troops before that unless for a quest) gave me zero expectations and I just learned how to do it here.
I started my 2nd city almost a yr ago now, after playing for a year and learning a bunch. I built the 2nd city for tourneys with the focus on fighting. Started an FS of 1 and got over 500 pts the first tourney. (It's on Khelonaar). That was primarily fighting and my limit was largely because of needing to clear more map provinces of that tourney type. Should also be noted that tourney was NOT Scrolls (despise Scroll tourneys). Luckily I didn't hit that until the 6th week and managed to get 800+ points. Even though it's my boost there and at the time I was trying to max that out, pretty sure I did a mix of fighting/catering on that one. That mix of fight/cater continues for (the despised) Scrolls tourneys as I am entering Orcs there. While dust sometimes has more catering involved as well, on the other tourneys I'm at least 95% fighting (90+% is autofight; I'll sometimes manually fight an auto one I lost that looks like it should be winnable) and have been since the beginning. Yes, the AI can be stupid, but since it seems to be stupid in both directions (for us as well as the enemy) it balances out as long as you are set up to replace the losses. I've enjoyed the tourney more in this smaller city than in my Elementals one. It's ok in the larger city, I just don't feel any challenge really until it come to the (awful) Scrolls tourney. And that's not truly a challenge, it's just 'how long can I take having my ... handed to me' before I give in and cater! And I agree with whoever said it: the posts here on how hard the tourneys have suddenly become happens mostly during a (dreaded) Scrolls tourney with the occasional Dust tourney thrown in.
Did I mention I despise the awful Scrolls tourney?

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

Really, I've been finding that between the start of Fairies and through until end of WE's, tournaments are a fething gak-filled disaster now because I just don't have the techs & AW's available at this point to counter the increased enemy strength. (notably from the bigger 'forced' SS techs)

My experience is also different. While there was a low point, it was around early Dwarves. Even then, while fighting sucked (primarily because low troop production, not because fights were unwinnable), catering was pretty cheap.

And from Dwarves on, fighting became easier and easier. I have been hitting 3K+ since the Dwarves on autofight.

 

[Ashrem]

The problem is that in Elvenar, and especially with the tournaments, the "game" is basically rigged against the player until you hit the final couple of chapters...

You can't rig something that has no win condition. There aren't may ways to make Elvenar be about beating anyone. The duty of the programmers is to make it interesting. that means constantly increasing the challenge.

 

[Mykan]

2. Player units & upgrades are just 'slow drips' while the enemy is always highly advanced by points X/Y/Z.
Pointless on the main map encounters, but in tournaments, it's a fething insult... The enemy starts gaining high powered 3* units by province #6, which means it's easily doable for Ch.4-5 players to be getting hosed.

I wonder if catering is the counter balance for smaller towns? I don't have a chapter 4-5 town but I do have a chapter 3 one (no optional SS) and catering is ridiculously easy. Coins, supplies and some T1 goods and I can "win" any tournament encounter, I can easily produce what is needed from tourny to tourny. I am yet to find the point that T2 goods are needed but am already producing those goods for the towns general economy, perhaps the catering needs will get harder at that time.

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

I wonder if catering is the counter balance for smaller towns? I don't have a chapter 4-5 town but I do have a chapter 3 one (no optional SS) and catering is ridiculously easy. Coins, supplies and some T1 goods and I can "win" any tournament encounter, I can easily produce what is needed from tourny to tourny. I am yet to find the point that T2 goods are needed but am already producing those goods for the towns general economy, perhaps the catering needs will get harder at that time.

Yep, that's pretty much was my setup. I got fully established T3 production, but I still barely needed T2 for catering. The biggest problem was T1 drain, while having an excess of T3 and T2. Did a lot of cross tier back then, sometimes going as low as 4:1 T1:T3 ratio. I just had no use for much of T3, and I only had 2 manufactories.

 

[bkbajb]

I have said this too many times but this game is not a race. Too many people want all of the rewards all of the time. One player in our FS completed the event in 1 day, why? I do not agree that the tournaments are getting harder. Every 9 weeks I look back at the previous 9 weeks scores and decide what my new goal is for each week. We just finished the Scrolls tournament which has always been my hardest one. I got 900 more points this time over 9 weeks ago. Why, part of the reason is that my AW's are boosting more now. If some people would slow down, learn and be patient then the game is more enjoyable. Of course, that is just my opinion.

 

[hvariidh gwendrot]

it's like when luke skywalker tried to use the force to get his jet fighter out of the mud and said it was to big then lil ol yoda went all showoffie with the force and lifted it out ..

 

[SoggyShorts]

One player in our FS completed the event in 1 day, why? ......If some people would slow down, learn and be patient then the game is more enjoyable. Of course, that is just my opinion.

To some players the game is more than just staring at pretty buildings. There is a puzzle element to the game if you choose to play it, and completing a 28 day task in a day can be a rewarding accomplishment.
I also finished the event 24h after I started, and now when my daily prize of choice comes up I'll have almost 5k ess to spend on it. That and I can use the space to make a major renovation to my city since I know for certain that I won't need any for at least 30 days.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

To some players the game is more than just staring at pretty buildings. There is a puzzle element to the game if you choose to play it, and completing a 28 day task in a day can be a rewarding accomplishment.

Some of us think this is boring. 27 days of sitting around doing nothing while you wait for your special prize to show up as a daily? This is why I limit my "cheating" til after the event starts, before I will look at quest lists or prize lists. And even then, I really only pay attention to the tasks that take 24 hours or longer to do and plan a little bit for them. Sure, they sometimes put a good building early in an event, like the Golden Palace this time on, I think, Day 3, but even without planning, I had more than enough essence to get three of it. Now I just need to find room to put them out. lol