InnoTV May Episode

[DeletedUser51]

Dear Humans and Elves,

Please leave your feedback on our newest episode of InnoGames TV in this topic!

Kind regards,
Your Elvenar Team D

 

[DeletedUser627]

I appreciate the format change to responses to some of our most pressing questions. I hope we see some exciting developments once the decision-making process is completed.

 

[DeletedUser1792]

I really appreciate that they think about a daily login bonus; as an active player I am also for it.
But I will never understand the developers why they still have the magic academy as a mandatory building in the main story questline. It is absolutely unnecessary if they already decided to create mightier spells. The players will notice that with the mightier spells the MA will be worthy so they will build it and even upgrade it like so many players already upgraded the builder hut. I don´t want to start a new discussion about the MA - all I want to say is, that I am disappointed about these news because I really hoped that the developers would declare peace in this fight "players vs. developers"

 

[DeletedUser43]

Why are you intentionally angering your players? I don't get it. I really don't get it.

If we want the building for whatever reason we will build it. If we don't want the building for whatever reason, WHY ON EARTH ARE YOU FORCING PLAYERS TO BUILD IT?????????

LEAVE US ALONE!!!!! Why can't WE DECIDE? Here, I will just give you my account and you can build the city you obviously have decided I need to have. Then I can come stare at it like an idiot. I just love being treated like a rat in a maze where you constantly slam doors in my face.

And I don't want to hear the whiny "I like it so I don't care" kind of response. Who cares whether you want it or not? That isn't the point. The POINT is that they are taking away options in the game. If you want a city without an armory, you should have one. If you want a city without a trader, you should be able to build one. What possible difference does it make to anyone? All this does is make SOME players unhappy....for whatever reasons (and I have many!). If you don't stick up for the players when they do something you don't care about, then you won't have anyone to stick up for you when they take away your favorite option in this game.

I really hoped that the developers would declare peace in this fight "players vs. developers"

This is WAR!!!!!

 

[DeletedUser1036]

WHY ON EARTH ARE YOU FORCING PLAYERS TO BUILD IT?????????

In reality at this point nobody is being forced to build it, all you have to do is let the one quest stay where it is and forget that part of the quest line.
The major issue as I see it is not being able to sell it or get rid of it once you have built it. Also not knowing that if your just starting out.

Anyway moving on, that was an interesting video since it gave just a small hint of the future updates (regarding the academy) but didn't mention anything else about the Tournaments which are in Beta and now listed on the Wiki.

 

[DeletedUser43]

No...not forced. You just lose out on all the storyline quests if you don't. That is a horrible choice. You either get this lousy option or that horrible option. Gee thanks.

Lousy vs. horrible. What a way to play a game.

 

[DeletedUser61]

I just love being treated like a rat in a maze where you constantly slam doors in my face.

This is rather like complaining that Football has Rules!!! Why can't everybody just run around and do their thing?

Of course the game has rules and puzzles. It's the structure of the game that provides the interesting challenge.

• It not supposed to be easy
• It's supposed to be worth your while

 

[DeletedUser43]

No. Sigh. You have missed the point completely. This is like playing Monopoly and being told you MUST buy States avenue...and Baltic....and Marvin Gardens.

You can make every house and every road and every placement mandatory too. Won't that be fun? How about if I make it mandatory to clear a certain number of provinces before you can progress....oh wait....yeah.

How about if I make it mandatory that you need to have as many factories as all the rest of us Kat? How about if I make it mandatory that you have to have as many buildings as many of us have? Would you enjoy that? Would you enjoy it if I made it mandatory that you have to use as many expansions as we have? Or ....wait for it.....what if the next change makes it mandatory that you have to CLICK as much as the rest of us?

I am speaking about principles.

This is a game of choices. Take away choices and you take away some of the game.

 

[DeletedUser1792]

This is rather like complaining that Football has Rules!!! Why can't everybody just run around and do their thing?

In my opinion this comparison doesn´t fit to the issue, that the MA is as good as "mandatory" (because who wants to play a city builder without main story quest line...). Of course football needs rules to keep a standard of fairness. Well in Elvenar these are the game rules which ensure that
you don´t create "push-accounts", "do not use bots" and so on.
But each football team has its own strategy to win. Maybe you agree with me Katwijk that it is ridiculous to decide, that each team has to use the same strategy in this case to build the magic academy...

 

[DeletedUser61]

Take away choices and you take away some of the game.

Exactly my point. It's like eating your vegetables when you'd prefer just steak and dessert. While there's lots of room for different balance points, simply ignoring portions of the game isn't as engaging, in the long run.

To your other points, I had to adjust my playing style when the Advanced Scouting Chests were added, because before the chests were added it was more economical to wait until you could simply steam roll the defenders. Did the change NEED to be made?? Yeah, because it actually provided us with MORE choices that now need to be made, in a timely matter, to avoid the blockage.

 

[DeletedUser1792]

While there's lots of room for different balance points, simply ignoring portions of the game isn't as engaging, in the long run.
To your other points, I had to adjust my playing style when the Advanced Scouting Chests were added, because before the chests were added it was more economical to wait until you could simply steam roll the defenders. Did the change NEED to be made?? Yeah, because it actually provided us with MORE choices that now need to be made, in a timely matter, to avoid the blockage.View attachment 774

I agree, finally the Advanced Scouting Chests were a necessary measure to make sure that the players have enough provinces open to use the
tournament-feature effectively and I didn´t hear any any more criticism since they opened tournaments on beta. But the MA is another case.
It is built in a few hours instead of the provinces, which we had to conquer and scout. This can take a long time, so making it mandatory was necessary. But in the case of the MA there are no reasons to make it mandatory because of possible upcoming features because you can build the MA in a few hours!

 

[DeletedUser43]

Yeah, because it actually provided us with MORE choices that now need to be made, in a timely matter, to avoid the blockage.

Choice:

You keep using this word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

I didn´t hear any any more criticism since they opened tournaments on beta.

Criticism. Criticism. Criticism.

They lost a lot of players with that move and they lose more all the time because of it. If players want to clear provinces they will keep playing. If they don't, now their only options are to clear or quit.

Why keep making the only choice to quit?

It is one thing if players see a tournament coming as a reason to clear more provinces or if they want to clear more provinces because they want space, but to be FORCED to clear provinces when they don't want to, takes away options. That is all this game is, is options. Fewer options = less game.

 

[DeletedUser1122]

I agree, finally the Advanced Scouting Chests were a necessary measure to make sure that the players have enough provinces open to use the tournament-feature effectively

What tournament feature? The bugged out, non functioning, player eliminating, diamond only misfit of a feature being insert into the broken world map.
The tournament concept released into to beta 1 was 80%
complete
"I didn´t hear any any more criticism since they opened tournaments on beta."
I think your radio broke
You support that they force players to the fit their concept? HA HA German flexibility - my way or the highway
Yea! a city builders game. Lets fight.

Well that ended an interesting consultation with the players. We heard you butt....out
Sure were a lot of wasted key stokes

 

[DeletedUser1036]

All I can really say about the Magic Academy is that it really would not be this big of an issue if it was part of the original game starting out in the beginning for all players. Sure the dev's put it retro on the knowledge tree and I am more then sure it does help new players just getting started.

I could argue the same point by complaining about the Barracks. But I don't even though I haven't used it in months, to me it has the same value as the Magic Academy does currently to other players such as those complaining. The only reason I have 2 (used to have more) Armory's is because it was a place to increase my point's level in the rankings. To me Elvenar was offered as a PEACEFUL game where you did not have to fight if you did not want to. Yet here we are with a mandatory build (the Barracks) that was useful in the beginning couple of ring's in world scouting, but is still a building you can't sell and is larger in space then the Magic academy! Think about that........

Now the peaceful players that have always negotiated since they could are about to be offered a new feature called tournaments. From what I have seen on the WIKI it is a fight only option, so that is something a few players won't even pursue after the first few battles because squad's cost supplies which have far more value when it comes to making better buildings or more goods then gambling in a fight you may or may not win.

I'm sure some people will really get into the tournaments and learn how to fight because they have the promise of acquiring knowledge points quicker but I have already finished the KP tech tree completely as well as expanded my city to the allotted maximum the game offer's.

In the end I'll watch and maybe build the Magic Academy if I see the an advantage to it. Actually have been thinking about it just to get it over with but the side quest rewards haven't really been all that big to me so I'm still holding off on the build. I really do enjoy playing this game and I'll live with what ever the power's that be put forth in front of us because yes we play and enjoy it, BUT they own the game not us.

 

[DeletedUser594]

There is a negotiation option if you don't want to fight in the tournament you can "cater" the event- which is really the same as negotiating in all but name.

 

[DeletedUser1036]

Cool because I don't know all that much about it yet

 

[DeletedUser1016]

All in all I think the May video was lame...answered about 5 "weak" questions with ...."dah, I don't know"....

 

[DeletedUser1036]

To me I can see why this game may be a harder challenge to the developers then others because it isn't your typical wham bam hit the enemy hard with what you can build or afford. I'm sure the developers are looking at all of the suggestions and scratching their head's saying That's cool, that isn't cool and of course how in the world do I code that without upsetting the main code?

Were on a different frontier here people, and of course there are many different type's of players. Those who coin like myself and those who want the world handed to them and you can't please everyone.

 

[DeletedUser2062]

I guess I will have to figure out InnoTV

 

[DeletedUser627]

Of course there's less criticism from newer players - they don't have to deal with a changing expectations. Most of us here started playing the game with different Rules @Katwijk . Your analogy about playing football - you can't update the rulebook repeatedly during a game or even a season. Oops, sorry - we're moving the goals 10 yards back. Oops, sorry - now there are only 3 downs, not 4. Oops, sorry -no passing game, only a running game. Oops, sorry -the only way past these new Rules is to pay the Referee.

If they feel their game needs new Rules, they should be saying, "Oops, sorry - you're now required to build an Academy...but since we changed the rules on you, here's a free expansion to put it on. We know you'll soon like this change, and we'll prove it."

Of course football needs rules to keep a standard of fairness. Well in Elvenar these are the game rules which ensure that you don´t create "push-accounts", "do not use bots" and so on.

I bet you're a fair person in real life, Senedai, because you attribute a sense of fair play to others. Unfortunately, the "no push accounts" and "no bots" have nothing to do with fair play. If fair play were the standard, they wouldn't have such a blatant "payers win" game. Push accounts and bots allow non-payers to win - that's why Inno doesn't allow them.

• It not supposed to be easy

• It's supposed to be worth your while

This is sooooo true. And there are soooooo many cool, creative and fun ways Inno could increase the challenge and make this worth our while. So why don't they? This is really the crux of the matter - where the rubber meets the road. Every project has a primary driver, and Elvenar's primary driver is profit.

Elvenar isn't a cool game driven by passion designers / developers who want to be profitable.
Elvenar is a mechanism to make the most money possible by using modern marketing methodologies;
it just happens to be in the form of a game.
​

You're the project engineer, Katwijk. Re-evaluate every decision, every turning point of the game history, and the apparent priority driver is profitability - not game quality. So there's no real point in arguing game theory, fairness, what Inno does / doesn't intend. If we want changes, we have to affect profitability.