Hello Just Starting

[DeletedUser2284]

Hi. My name is John -- BALISONG in Winyandor. I am a gamer from WAY back before computers. I have not played this type of game before. I guess the closest would be Neopets where I currently have one of the top 100 battle bets, or Starweb where I was rated one of the top players. I have only been playing for a couple of days, so still have a lot to learn and get done.

I would be interested in how people are using fellowships, and the types of interactions I can expect with other players in the game.

 

[DeletedUser115]

Welcome to the US community, Balisinger!

Before computers, aye? Was there such a time?

 

[DeletedUser2284]

Sure! Dungeons and Dragons, Titan, Magic the Gathering, bridge, chess. There were TONS of games before computers. I did use my Commodore 64 to send in turns for Starweb.

I guess that means I am old. I used to be part of a gaming company called Gamelords Ltd. I even created and published my own game which hardly sold any copies at all. Maybe that makes it a collector's item because of rarity!

 

[DeletedUser68]

I merged your adjacent, contemporary posts. Do please take full advantage of the Multi-Quote, Reply, and Editing buttons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunt_the_Wumpus

And when the kids were small I wrote some programs for the Atari 800, using a language that was variously called Logo Turtle. http://derrel.net/ep/logo/logo_com.htm.

It was an interpreted language, and one of the interesting features was that you could use
$Mary etc, as any variable that started with a $ was runtime definable. So.

$Mary had $little $lamb
Its $fleece was $white as $snow
And everywhere that $Mary $went
The $lamb was sure to $go

Preschoolers have FILTY minds.

A half dozen of us got thrown out of the campus data center one day, because we were doing drum riffs on the big chain printer.

 

[DeletedUser2284]

Thank you!

The only programming I did was in Algol, Lisp, or later in Lotus Programming Language. I worked at the computer center at Carnegie Mellon when going to school there. There were always people making inventive use of the computers.

 

[DeletedUser594]

With a fellowship you're able to engage in trade without the penalty imposed on trading with undiscovered player cities. They also offer the abiltiy to give and receive neighborly help members outside of your opened map territory, and of course social interaction, advice, sharing ideas etc...
That's the "textbook" answer.
Player interaction and the emergent properties arising from player interdependence are perhaps the single biggest determiner of success or quitting in frustration for many in this game (and one of my favorite topics of discussion) I can and have talked a few ears off about it and I'm glad to chat some more any time.
Forgive me if I am being obtuse, I'm trying to answer without spoilers
You'll have plenty to sink your teeth into.
Look for a group that's relatively new--all under 7K or so which would indicate still being in the first 3 chapters of research. You may enjoy a second city on Elcysandor (sp?) which is the newest of the worlds available- playing one of each race is enjoyable and each provide a unique set of challenges and rewards.
.
The best advice I can give is to follow the quests closely, especially in the beginning, as that will build up a solid foundation of coin and supply. When I start a new city I hem closely to the quest line for quick builds.
This is a great resource to start with: https://us.wiki.elvenar.com/index.php?title=Main_Page

I'm also on Winyandor and always happy to chat in game messages.
Cheers and good luck!

 

[DeletedUser2284]

Thanks Varron. It sounds as if it is better to have a fellowship with people who are NOT your neighbors. I will check out your link, and start looking for a fellowship.

 

[DeletedUser594]

Yeah- you can already trade/Nh (neighborly help) with those close by and it means if there is a shortage of some goods to trade in the hood it's going to be short in your fellowship as well.

 

[DeletedUser68]

It amuses me that a thread titled "Just Starting" has morphed into a discussion about the History of Computing, which is a lovely example of thread drift. So let me do my part as well, and add some gaming theory and philosophy.

I saw a statement in the Beta forum that, on it's face, is absurd, but once you think about it for a few minutes,
it's an important concept that's fundamentally true.

We are grown up adults, who frankly understand this game better than the designers.

I'll illustrate my point by describing another Atari 800 program that I wrote for the kids.

Typing Tutor Pseudocode
1. Use a Do Loop, of random length, to iteratively build and display
    a string of color-coded ASCII characters that are available on the keyboard as a direct key press
2. Provide a descending tone and a "plop," and display the final character in a LARGE font size
3. If the kids get the wrong key, provide a quiet disappointed melody
4. If the kids get the right key, blow whistles, play a happy tune, and flash the lights
5. Rinse and repeat

The kids, and especially not the two and three year olds, didn't think so.

The object of their game was to AVOID the indicated key.​

They would happily press keys until they got the "wrong one" and the program cycled.

Within a couple of weeks all of the preschoolers in the neighborhood could type, even though they didn't have a clue how to spell. So the program was a HUGE success, far more successful than I ever imagined that it could be, but it certainly wasn't the game that I had in mind.

My point addresses the very SOUL of a City Builder.

• The developers absolutely understand HOW the program actually works,
  better than we ever will.
• The user community understands how the program actually WORKS,
  better than the developers ever will.

Evolution is the theory of unintended consequences, and therein lies my fascination with City Builders.
We quite literally don't, none of us, know where we're going, but we'll still get there.
We are, all of us, quite literally "Just Starting."

 

[DeletedUser43]

Yes, Missanthropy. That was exactly what I meant. Oh, the devs may write the code, but they don't play this game in real time. I doubt whoever developed chess would have a clue what all books today are talking about!

Can I write code and make this game? Not a chance. Can we all analyze game rules, find the best ways in and out of the rules and predict player behavior once new content is added? Much better than the developers!!

Welcome to this crazy game Balisinger! It is fun and fascinating and there are so many ins and outs of this game! Feel free to message me on Arendyll world. I love talking about this game and different ways to play! In general, the devs have designed this game to be too slow to play for us adhd Americans! But don't worry! We have all found ways to make it much more fun!

 

[DeletedUser627]

Hi and welcome!

About fellowships:

Unless you're lucky, you'll likely change several times as you determine your personal playing style and find compatible players.

During the first chapter of the Research tree you can be creative and find something to do herein. Soon that will change, and you'll spend 5 minutes here, then there's no play for 3 or more hours, 5 minutes again, etc. Given this relatively new scenario, fellowships best provide support by:

1) lots of active trading. If you can, select the largest fellowship that will accept you. They're more likely to have goods you need (but can't yet produce ), and they'll accept your posted trades more quickly just because you're a member. Along these lines, look around your world map, find the largest player within 12 circles of you, and contact him. Let them know you intend to be a serious player, and ask if they're willing to help you with trading. (It's possible they may have "discovered" you and can pick up your trades without discount - some will even pick them up and absorb the discount).

2) Neighborhood Help. Some fellowships "visit" each other daily, and keep track of who does and doesn't cooperate. The benefits of visiting are significant. You'll want to settle into a fellowship that plays as you do: consistently or intermittently.

3) chat. Not only whether or not they chat, but subject matter. Most are G or PG, some not...

One last word about the trading: it's crucial. You'll only be producing your boosted goods, so fellowship interdependence is crucial.

****

I took a player survey in December (results published here in Forum). 1/3 of the top 120 players wouldn't have started in Elvenar if they'd known the direction things would take. Even the ones who would have played, often regret spending $.

Of the top 30 players, 2/3 of them regret ever starting.

Am I advising you to quit? Absolutely not. More like, delay spending any actual $ until you're certain you like the game.

 

[DeletedUser68]

I doubt whoever developed chess would have a clue what all books today are talking about!

To steal your Chess analogy, a book about Bridge won't make much sense if you're not yet playing with a full deck.

 

[Maz Mellor]

To steal your Chess analogy, a book about Bridge won't make much sense if you're not yet playing with a full deck.

Not yet? I'd wager there are plenty of experienced bridge players who still aren't playing with a full deck. If I played more often these days, I'd confess to being one of them.

 

[DeletedUser627]

To steal your Chess analogy, a book about Bridge won't make much sense if you're not yet playing with a full deck.

This really is an apt analogy. Implication being that Inno knows where the game is going (full deck) and we currently don't?

I would enjoy following leadership with a sense of anticipation. My parents used to make us walk backward down the staircase landings on Christmas morning, giggling with excitement...but this type of development strategy requires that the blind trust the leader with the big picture. What if the grand entrance had culminated with bags of coal under the tree? What if we had paid for our own gifts and been disappointed?

We could take another poll of players, "Do you trust Inno?" Or "do you trust the direction Inno is taking in the development of Elvenar?" Or "do you trust Inno to develop Elvenar into a game enjoyed by current players?" "Do you trust Inno intends to develop a fun game?" We could ask this question in multiple ways, but the conclusions are foregone.

Player trust which was initially given freely was squandered, and rather than develop a strategy to reacquire the trust, it feels like developers remain in denial of its loss, unwilling to accept responsibility for the loss, and adamantly insisting we owe it to them.​

We've already seen too many players spending money / time based on the cards we could see, only to find that subsequent cards added to the deck either invalidated the money they'd already spent, or made play less enjoyable / unavailable.

 

[DeletedUser594]

I do trust inno based on 4 or 5 yrs of playing their games almost exclusively and having been a part of the arc of a new game and getting a sense of how that unfolded. It's early here still- most of the game mechanisms are pretty well developed and the main thing lacking is that next big thing we are expecting- tournies, to tie together some of these threads, create a new kind of interacting, stop me from losing my mind in boredom. I don't know if they plan some meta game on top of that- foe has guild vs guild- but it's easy to make a conflict based game
The fairies are a nice release, but it's another of the same cycle. I'm wanting the thing that changes how we interact with the game/each other. And on that note I would really like to see some fellowship wide tasks/contests, something for team building , getting the home base moving, chatting interacting..,not that i am huge on chatting but it is nicer than hearing crickets.
I do trust inno bcs they've done it right imo in most cirumstances in many games- sometimes it takes a minute or two- but generally I've agreed with their strategy-
but for early players, maybe who haven't seen the level of change that unfolds the first few years- I totally get the frustration of catching the current groove only to get sideswiped by change. For me baseball is a good analogy- we played some catch to warm up..,then we take the field and run drills and then there's a game.

 

[DeletedUser1797]

I find Elvenar fun and competitive...a little redundant and I don't like getting stuck, but it is just a game....a diversion from the the real dramas that appear in my life