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    Your Elvenar Team

News from Beta - May Contain Spoilers!

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Myne

Well-Known Member
I would like to throw something out to think about, and perhaps to add to the pile of thoughts on this. When the spectral stone first made its appearance, everyone was loving it. We wanted it to be a regular occurrence. Since it was so hard to get, INNO thought it was quite the valuable thing. Rather than just making it the occasional gift in an event, they decided that allowing it to be available in the MA should satisfy us. But given how valuable an item INNO believes it to be in the scheme of things, it was placed on par with diamonds for availability. With that line of thought, in order to do so, it had to share space with diamonds. Do I like it? No. We can't change it though.

I also would like to make a suggestion. When we ask for things of the developers, we need to include in our discussions how they would possibly see the value of the item in the game. Then perhaps, we should discuss how our suggestion of what we want would impact the difficulty level of the game so that we could more likely see the consequences of our requests. INNO seems pretty determined that the difficulty level of the game isn't going to go down and may even (probably) increase. We need to keep this in mind. This game is not like any other, and that is part of the draw for many of us.

I agree they may be herding us in a way towards the spire. Diamonds are used there and are the greatest source of income for INNO in this game.
INNO exists to make money. Never forget that. They have a cunning way of doing it but like any business, without it they are doomed.
 

Iyapo1

Well-Known Member
Maybe it is just me, but I dont recall the spectral stone getting a lot of love bombing in the forum....in my Fellowships it was universally condemned by every one who caters the spire as being inconveniently place on the UI...something that should be used asap so it no longer appears tagged onto the available goods list.
 

Sprite1313

Well-Known Member
Maybe it is just me, but I dont recall the spectral stone getting a lot of love bombing in the forum....in my Fellowships it was universally condemned by every one who caters the spire as being inconveniently place on the UI...something that should be used asap so it no longer appears tagged onto the available goods list.
Hmmm... and given the percentage of avid forum posters who fight, rather than cater (present company excluded, of course), it seems unlikely that it would have gotten a lot of love.
 

Iyapo1

Well-Known Member
Once you have at least 5 spectral stones, you can go to the final boss on the third floor and laugh at him as you use five stones to complete the final chest without losing anything, troops or goods.
Wohoo...5 spectral stones will save me some goods and maybe 50 diamonds! /s

That is a booby prize...imo! I am going to miss the diamonds! I am tempted to go change my rating on google play.
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Well-Known Member
Wohoo...5 spectral stones will save me some goods and maybe 50 diamonds! /s

That is a booby prize...imo! I am going to miss the diamonds! I am tempted to go change my rating on google play.

And I should go and make mine higher, since back when I started, a lot of the stuff that makes the game so much easier had not been added yet, and free diamonds were almost non-existent. Take away the Spire, take away crafting, take away all the expiring buildings that give diamonds.
 

Iyapo1

Well-Known Member
I remember those days well. I quit playing and came back to the game it is today with genuine access to free in game currency. I like that the game had moved away from the other model. I like that it is free to play and you can even get a lot of extras if you grind for diamonds. It is irritating that they are regressing.
 

Henroo

Well-Known Member
Once you have at least 5 spectral stones, you can go to the final boss on the third floor and laugh at him as you use five stones to complete the final chest without losing anything, troops or goods.
I typically easily beat the final spire boss using autofight. And I tend to only use 1 type of troop in multiwave spire encounters using autofight. On a good week with good line-ups I will typically replace my troop losses from this encounter with 3 to 4 normal hours of production from my military buildings. And keep in mind that since I only typically use 1 type of troops, this means the output of only 1 building replaces my losses. The output of the other 2 just add to my troop stash. On a bad week, with bad matchups it might take 6 to 8 hours of production to replace losses. So what you are really saying is that 5 spectral stones COMBINED is less beneficial than me dropping 2 five hour boosters on barracks, training ground, or mercenary camp. Depending on which troop type I used.
 

BrinDarby

Well-Known Member
Maybe it is just me, but I dont recall the spectral stone getting a lot of love bombing in the forum....in my Fellowships it was universally condemned by every one who caters the spire as being inconveniently place on the UI...something that should be used asap so it no longer appears tagged onto the available goods list.
I cater the Spire almost exculsively. When those (darn) things came out, I noticed
instantly my % went down getting correct picks (try 1). My way of doing things didn't
chg, nor did anything other than having 1 SpecStone. I instantly used it and did so in
all of my worlds as soon as I got 1. ( my %s went back up after using it, go figure )

Random ??? I'm collecting imperical data that says otherwise, in many aspects in
this game.... "Trust Inno" , well... not anymore. I am not accusing Inno of anything,
because I don't have the data to prove my theories.

@SoggyShorts ,
So then if its 45% less chance of diamonds, the player offset is increase # of worlds
played in by 50% and keep on trucking......Does this help or hurt Inno ( rhetorical Question )
well, its simple ... its like cutting off your nose to spite your face. Exponentially increasing
server need for storage/map space/processing/ect/ect/ect ...... 0 increase in revenue.

These are draconian changes that Inno thinks helps/balances out things, yet Doesn't !!!
This change , will not hurt the farmers, it will hurt the 1 world'ers ..... Just like other
changes don't hurt extablished/older players, they just hurt newer/smaller players.
Or changes making an evolve critical, and anyone not having it gets scroooood.

I can hear it now :
Mgr 1 : My report says too many ppl have too many diamonds in reserve.
Dev 1 : There's always gonna be horders ( & farmers/pushers )
Mgr 1 : Find me ways to decrease how much are available.
Dev 1 : Players also aren't buying the new stuff we're selling... enough.
Mgr 1 : Noone will pay $$$, when they have tons of diamonds...
Dev 2 : If we offered better stuff, players will pay diamonds...
Dev 1 : We also have many other things players have said they'd buy.
Mgr 1 : Then ppl just horde the good stuff and imbalance the game.
Dev 2 : We also could clamp down on cheaters.
Mgr 1 : No, thats just too expensive and time consuming. Time is $$.
ect ect ect........

Sherlock holmes's famous quote : " When you strip away all the things you can
show/prove to be false, whatever's left... however improbable.... Must be true."

Do we know why the Devs do what they do, we can only guess, But just
as with everything else ( usually ) in life, there's ( usually ) a reason for everything.

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me !!!
in every game online players will backlash against such practices as this.
Times when "croud-sourcing" reveals shady practices, and is disceminated.
We blame TheDevs, when its thier boss's thats who we should be mad @.
 

Aritra

Well-Known Member
I cater the Spire almost exculsively. When those (darn) things came out, I noticed
instantly my % went down getting correct picks (try 1). My way of doing things didn't
chg, nor did anything other than having 1 SpecStone. I instantly used it and did so in
all of my worlds as soon as I got 1. ( my %s went back up after using it, go figure )
I do cater the Spire exclusively (ch.12,6) and I have perceived no difference with Spire negotiations before or after the introduction of the Spectral Stone.
 

Yogi Dave

Well-Known Member
One of the data miners from Beta showed the new breakdown of percentages from the Mystical Object that may help you decide if you want to continue to hoard or not.
The images here are very blurry. Do you have any that aren't? I can mostly read the new mined ones, but the pic to the old ones I can't. If there is a link to clearer images, that would be good.

EDIT: Never mind. I found them in the beta forum: Release Notes version 1.146
 
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SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
given how valuable an item INNO believes [spectral stones] to be in the scheme of things, it was placed on par with diamonds for availability.
Old
When opening Mystical Objects 10x the average diamond winnings was 550
New
When opening Mystical Objects 10x the average diamond winnings is 300
Plus a 33% chance of 2xSS

This means that INNO must be assigning a value of ~378 diamonds per spectral stone.

More realistically a stone will be used to avoid a 50/50 chance in the spire thereby saving 25 diamonds half the time. So the actual value is closer to 12.5 diamonds.

Unless of course I'm mistaken and caterers would prefer to use 5 at once and save the resources instead of saving diamonds?
 

Myne

Well-Known Member
Old
When opening Mystical Objects 10x the average diamond winnings was 550
New
When opening Mystical Objects 10x the average diamond winnings is 300
Plus a 33% chance of 2xSS

This means that INNO must be assigning a value of ~378 diamonds per spectral stone.

More realistically a stone will be used to avoid a 50/50 chance in the spire thereby saving 25 diamonds half the time. So the actual value is closer to 12.5 diamonds.

Unless of course I'm mistaken and caterers would prefer to use 5 at once and save the resources instead of saving diamonds?

Thank you for the math proving the worth placed on the spectral stone. Outrageous even in this economic climate. As I have said before...Inno giveth and INNO taketh away.
 

Myne

Well-Known Member
To make up for a 45% loss you have to increase effort by 82%, not 50%.

When the devs do something that a player doesn't like are they really going to play twice as much?
Seems like an odd response to me.

Possibly. It feels like the effort to slow your progress is at every turn.
 

Moho

Chef
Thank you for the math proving the worth placed on the spectral stone. Outrageous even in this economic climate.
If the majority of the players prefer to cater, and if their catering skills are not really great, then there may be a lot of people who regard the spectral stone as really valuable.
 
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