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    Your Elvenar Team

Not placing expansions?

Can someone please convince me to place my expansions? I have 3 province expansions (almost 4) and a research expansion that I haven't placed. I have placed quite a few premium expansions. I don't "need" the space, obviously I can fill it with good stuff.

Mostly I'm thinking about Marindor's recent posts and the upcoming tourny changes, MinMax's calculations (and that he's said he's holding onto expansions himself...), etc. They impact spire and soon tourny difficulty, but that impacts was "low" and has apparently become even lower in the current beta changes. It does seem that I should be placing expansions...but I've been holding off thinking not placing them makes things easier for me. If the game isn't completely crazy, I should be wrong.

You can see I'm trying to convince myself...why can't I get there? Help?
 

Deleted User - 4739469

Guest
Being newer, myself, the only thing I can really contribute is: more space means an easier time rearranging your buildings. Otherwise, if you aren't finding rearranging buildings to be problematic, I suppose holding on to expansions would be good for later chapters - then, when you actually require more space, you can simply throw down expansions as you see fit. ;)
 

ajqtrz

Chef - loquacious Old Dog
I'm in the same boat. I have plenty of space so the expansions I get aren't that important. On the other hand, in storage they are there if you do ever need them. If you have enough room to move things around AND do the guest races (can you really have too much space for those?), don't place them until you need them.

That's my advice, for what it's worth.

AJ
 

Ivy1996

Member
Which chapter are you in? In order to fully complete the spire and do my part in the tournament, I really need all the space I can get! I'd like to move quickly through guest races, and that takes up a lot of space too. Why wouldn't you use the space?
 

CrazyWizard

Oh Wise One
Which chapter are you in? In order to fully complete the spire and do my part in the tournament, I really need all the space I can get! I'd like to move quickly through guest races, and that takes up a lot of space too. Why wouldn't you use the space?

The difficulty in the spire (and soon tournaments) is based on research, expansions and wonderlevels.
Since the formula has recently changed (version 1.11) we do not know yet the exact values and therefore can not judge if placing / buying expansions is a wise or a not so wise decision.
 

Pheryll

Set Designer
The difficulty in the spire (and soon tournaments) is based on research, expansions and wonderlevels.
Since the formula has recently changed (version 1.11) we do not know yet the exact values and therefore can not judge if placing / buying expansions is a wise or a not so wise decision.
This Beta analysis seems to show what happened in that change:
MinMax Gamer said:
OK, so with very limited data so far (some from here, some from EN tournament), here are some speculations re: changes:
- Impact of regular expansions went down, but not significantly so
- Cost of premium expansions vs regular ones went down, from 75% down to ~60%
- AW impact stayed the same
- Research impact indeed went up, from 1.0042 up to something like 1.0045 (doesn't sound like much, but remember, this is a base for an exponent)
 

KarlD

Well-Known Member
I don't see any reason to place expansions if they hurt even a little bit and you don't have a need for them at the moment. When you need them, use them, otherwise leave them in storage.
 

Deborah M

Oh Wise One
I've resigned myself to look at it this way. I have every available expansion. I have every AW with 503 levels to date. I have finished all chapters. I have spent 4 1/2 years building my city and working on my AW's. I am a long way from happy about the calculations for the Spire and now the new Tournament. I feel like they have betrayed any of us who actually played the game and spent $ in the ways they strongly encouraged. That being said, I will not get stressed out about it. A little sad maybe because of feeling betrayed. But, the thing is that whatever the changes are it seems pretty relative. I'll use what I have to do what I want and leave what I don't want to stress over. That's just what I do now anyway. If more expansions come, great! I always want more space. If my AW's are not as powerful because they have chosen to penalize me for all of that time & work, Oh Well! I set a goal years ago to have them all and refuse to abandon my goals to place and upgrade them. The chapter penalty is water under the bridge since they are all in my rear view mirror. Not a chance I'm going to let these changes change the way I enjoy playing my game.
 

Aritra

Well-Known Member
I don't really understand why having "extra" space is problematic.

I've only been playing six months and expansions are what I can't seem to get fast enough. I have a well thought out arrangement (planning is part of what I do while waiting on builders and expansion availability), or at least well as a new player can anticipate future needs. Right now I'm just having fun arranging my stuff. :) The idea of having them and not using them doesn't make sense to me. Already, I know they can get expensive (research expansions, why do I have to pay to place them, didn't I already earn them???), but I need land! Aesthetic is more important than points/ranking to me, and I spend my game time trying to utilize the resources so I can build faster (I refuse to spend actual money on it). My city must be organized; I can't bear to place stuff any ol' way, but there are many that do (discovered upon visiting my neighbors). To each their own...

Back to the original inquiry, I don't know how the spire and tourneys affect player strategy, especially regarding land, but I agree with some who have replied to simply store them and use them when you need it. Not sure if we have storage limits (doubt it, but I also wouldn't be surprised). :)

Just wanted to add my two cents. Sorry if I drifted off topic there...
 

CrazyWizard

Oh Wise One
I don't really understand why having "extra" space is problematic.

I've only been playing six months and expansions are what I can't seem to get fast enough. I have a well thought out arrangement (planning is part of what I do while waiting on builders and expansion availability), or at least well as a new player can anticipate future needs. Right now I'm just having fun arranging my stuff. :) The idea of having them and not using them doesn't make sense to me. Already, I know they can get expensive (research expansions, why do I have to pay to place them, didn't I already earn them???), but I need land! Aesthetic is more important than points/ranking to me, and I spend my game time trying to utilize the resources so I can build faster (I refuse to spend actual money on it). My city must be organized; I can't bear to place stuff any ol' way, but there are many that do (discovered upon visiting my neighbors). To each their own...

Back to the original inquiry, I don't know how the spire and tourneys affect player strategy, especially regarding land, but I agree with some who have replied to simply store them and use them when you need it. Not sure if we have storage limits (doubt it, but I also wouldn't be surprised). :)

Just wanted to add my two cents. Sorry if I drifted off topic there...

Each of us find different ways to enjoy the game,

For some it's estetics, for others the ranking itself and for another group it enjoying the competition in tournaments or fellowship adventures or any combination of the aforementioned.

For those that really enjoy the tournaments, who's goal is it to improve and become better in it. maybe even compete for the top rankings.
For this group the rules are going to change dramatically, wonders, expansions and research are going to have a huge impact on the game.

No longer is progress guaranteed by advancing in the game, placing more expansions and building up your wonders.
Since these 3 factors are intertwined it's all about finding the right balance advancing in the research tree, placing expansions and placing wonders.

Advancing to far in those 3 factors will lead to worse results instead of better.
Eventually you will find the sweet spot and then it's game over, as at that point there is little left to do in the game as you cannot advance further in the tree, not place anymore expansions, nor level up a a single wonder with no future of new introductions.

This is what makes the comming change a horrible change in my opinion but the devs seem to be unwilling to accept there failure and adres these concerns for real.
 

KarlD

Well-Known Member
I don't really understand why having "extra" space is problematic.

I've only been playing six months and expansions are what I can't seem to get fast enough. I have a well thought out arrangement (planning is part of what I do while waiting on builders and expansion availability), or at least well as a new player can anticipate future needs. Right now I'm just having fun arranging my stuff. :) The idea of having them and not using them doesn't make sense to me. Already, I know they can get expensive (research expansions, why do I have to pay to place them, didn't I already earn them???), but I need land! Aesthetic is more important than points/ranking to me, and I spend my game time trying to utilize the resources so I can build faster (I refuse to spend actual money on it). My city must be organized; I can't bear to place stuff any ol' way, but there are many that do (discovered upon visiting my neighbors). To each their own...

Back to the original inquiry, I don't know how the spire and tourneys affect player strategy, especially regarding land, but I agree with some who have replied to simply store them and use them when you need it. Not sure if we have storage limits (doubt it, but I also wouldn't be surprised). :)

Just wanted to add my two cents. Sorry if I drifted off topic there...
The size of tournament fights (and hence the size of losses) is currently determined by your world map squadsize. For ages people have avoided optional squadsize increases in research because they increase the difficulty of tournaments while others have been upset to find out that the researches they did actually hurt them rather than helped them. Now Inno is changing that and the difficulty will at least partly be determined by the number of earned and purchased expansions. So if you don't need the space there is no point in placing any expansions if they don't help you and only hurt you. It's not about having "extra" space; it's about having more expansions and hence more difficult tournament fights when the new tournament system is implmented.
 

DeletedUser19458

Guest
We are going from extra squad increases hurting you, to extra land hurting you, and 'extra' AW's hurting you.

I've stopped placing land. I am still leveling wonders, and it has become increasingly difficult to finish the spire to the point where I'm not sure it is worth it anymore, I cannot get back enough rewards as troops I loose since it is only the cost that goes up, not the rewards.
 

DeletedUser20616

Guest
We are going from extra squad increases hurting you, to extra land hurting you, and 'extra' AW's hurting you.

I've stopped placing land. I am still leveling wonders, and it has become increasingly difficult to finish the spire to the point where I'm not sure it is worth it anymore, I cannot get back enough rewards as troops I loose since it is only the cost that goes up, not the rewards.
I am also thinking of keeping one of my cities in a perma-lower chapter just for easier spire.
 
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BrinDarby

Well-Known Member
Hey @CrazyWizard ,
So if its Research, Wond lvls, Expan ....... Is it when you earn the expansion, or is it
when you've placed the expansion ??? :oops:
If you have no wonders, complete no research, and complete no provinces
( have no expansions to place ).... shouldn't then the difficulty stay constant , week-week ???

I'd like to know tho cause if I can't continue to close provinces, because it earns me an
expansion, even if I don't place it, then thats bad ....lolol.....
BrinD
 

BrinDarby

Well-Known Member
and you're 100% sure about that ???
heh heh heh , thanks.....
so scouting and completing provinces don't effect it @ all, hmmmm ????
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
and you're 100% sure about that ???
heh heh heh , thanks.....
so scouting and completing provinces don't effect it @ all, hmmmm ????

A mandatory expansion research will increase your squad size when you complete the research AND when you place the expansion. An optional expansion research only increases squad size when you place it. Supposedly, none of the optional researches, no matter what they are for, will increase squad size.
 
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