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    Your Elvenar Team

Help Optional Squad size research.

Swordkin

Member
Hello y'all

I read somewhere that optional squad size research is actually better to skip than do. Regarding spire and tourny difficulty, but i cant figure out if that was an advice thats outdated and no longer correct or not. Should a new city do optional Squad size research or not?

Swordkin.
 

Yogi Dave

Well-Known Member
Welcome to the forum. Lots of info and help here. We also like to complain. ;)
There is no negative effects for doing any optional techs, not just the squad research. Although, I have sometimes put the KP in them but waited to complete them for a quest in an event. Key word there is 'sometimes'.
 

getmomo

Active Member
The only negative of larger squads is it takes longer to train larger squads. This is only a problem if you are at a point where it takes a long time to train troops. I personally only cater my world map encounters and it has no effect on spire or tournament so I generally skip all optional squad size research and use the kp elsewhere.

GR10_AW2_Runeshard.png
 

Lelanya

Scroll-Keeper
Not true! The troop producing culture buildings are adversely affected by squad size upgrades, so in the main, still avoid them once you reach, Woodelves. Definitely do them up to chapter 5, you need them to get balanced provinces.
 

Talaedraiia

Well-Known Member
Not true! The troop producing culture buildings are adversely affected by squad size upgrades, so in the main, still avoid them once you reach, Woodelves. Definitely do them up to chapter 5, you need them to get balanced provinces.
I’m sorry, but I don’t understand what buildings you are talking about. Are they AWs, event buildings or what? Also, how are they affected?
 

Lelanya

Scroll-Keeper
I’m sorry, but I don’t understand what buildings you are talking about. Are they AWs, event buildings or what? Also, how are they affected?
I am referring to:
Grounds of the Orc Strategist
Vallorian Valor
Training Dojo
Etc.
Like all savvy players I did not run right out and grab a bunch of research. I filled in the optional Squad Size upgrades, about a third had been finished. I then went back to the smaller ones, and took the research when an event asked for them. There was a player on EN Forum who said it would actually help my AW troop producers like Flying Academy. But I don't see it. I feel like their impact has gotten less.

I always found that 3 VVs maintained my troops, 4 increased them, but now in my oldest city I need 8 out just to stay even. I have to use my Merc Camp occasionally and this is an Elven city so I need VGuards for their reach, and Blossoms because no one but Crackie thinks Sorceresses work all that well.

Thoughts? If I could turn back time, I would grab myself by the scruff of the neck and say, go human!!! Stay human!! You don't need that elven city girl! But I didn't :(, and so 8 VVs it is. My AWs still feel out of balance for troop production too. Hmm. Anyhow I stopped taking those research.
 

BrinDarby

Well-Known Member
As a CH4 player, looking at SS increases over the next 6-7, and having
a couple optional SS increases I skip'd... It sure seems that the qty of the
SS increase is fairly consistent. What that means is, over time, each SS+
is a smaller % of the current SS.

Hypothetically : lets say SS+'s are ~40,
and ur SS is 120..... increases are as follows...
Lets also say you start with 100 squads or 12000 troops.
Lets say there are 2 SS+ per CH, and bldg A gives these
troops and scales by ~40 per chapter.

(1) 120 -> 160 = 33.3 % - 75 squads - bldg A ch3 - 120/24h - 1 -> 0.75 squads
(2) 160 -> 200 = 20 % - 60 squads - bldg A ch3 - 120/24h - 0.75 -> 0.6 squads

(3) 200 -> 240 = 16.6 % - 50 squads - bldg A ch4 - 160/24h - 0.8 -> 0.66 squads
(4) 240 -> 280 = 14.3 % - 42 squads - bldg A ch4 - 160/24h - 0.66 -> 0.57 squads

(5) 280 -> 320 = 12.5 % - 37 squads - bldg A ch5 - 200/24h - 0.71 -> 0.62 squads
(6) 320 -> 360 = 11.1 % - 33 squads - bldg A ch5 - 200/24h - 0.62 -> 0.55 squads


The 2 things I'm trying to demonstrate that also occurr ingame is :
1) Over time, SS increases hurt you less in respect to total # of squads
2) Over time, # of squads earned become less even tho the Bldg A
scales per chapter. ( assuming its always upgraded to current CH ).

This mechanism is why @Lelanya 's need for Valorian Valors increased,
just to keep the same # of squads produced per day..... Even if Lelanya's
daily loss's of "Squads" stays equal..... by progression, her need for more
buildings to keep "balance" in her city ...

That was Hypothetical #s, but after research into both progression of
buildings and SS as it relates to chapter ( doing all SS+ ) it sure seems
that the effectiveness of buildings giving troops decrease over time.
 

crackie

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, Buddy's #1 Fan
Military wonders that give freebie units like Bulwark and Toads used a percentage of squadsize to determine how many you get. Bulwark’s training size increase is also off squadsize. At least that’s what the wiki be saying. I never thought about Gator pits giving different numbers depending on squadsize. I just thought they were tied to chapter so everyone in that chapter gets same number of units. Would be interesting if it is off squads.

because no one but Crackie thinks Sorceresses work all that well.
Most of the people doing better than me in tourney are several chapters ahead with more toys like Victory Springs, Simia, Timewarp, etc., so I am doing alright making due with less with using the Buddy system. Can’t win them all though. Like HS clichés, some of us are the artist types being tormented by the athletes for who we hang out with and our refusal to conform! Not everyone resemble the godlike physical specimen of a Hercules. Some of us are flat-footed and need very thick corrective lenses to even see who we are shooting at. We are just misunderstood and problem solve differently! While people like @Sprite1313 have been eating their Wheaties and drinking their protein shakes putting up mad numbers in tourney, I have been spending too much time thinking about what life is like living with tiny T-Rex hands. But I will have the last laugh when KingOlaf pays me millions for my fingerpainting! Or else you just kidnap their llamas for messing with Buddy.
 

Fayeanne

Well-Known Member
The troop producing culture buildings are adversely affected by squad size upgrades

I'm confused by this. Squad Size Upgrade technologies don't reduce the amount of troops produced by such buildings; they just don't change. So what you are saying is... "I'm going to reduce the effectiveness of the AWs that depend on Squad Size, as well as troop instants and other things that depend on Squad Size, so that...my culture buildings look better by comparison"?

Remember, how many squads you have in your Army Camp really is inconsequential, since that squad size is not used for any battles except map provinces (where bigger makes the fights easier which means fewer losses which probably evens out regarding how many losses you'd have if you had smaller squads). So even if the Army Camp shows only 60 squads instead of 100 (due to the bigger Squad Size), you still have exactly the same number of units.
 

Lelanya

Scroll-Keeper
So as always, I take optional squad size upgrades when my map provinces get unreasonable, not just because the research is there and yet another event has 3 or 4 Research a Tech quests. And I am keeping a weather eye on troops from all sources, I am told that the research is supposed to assist all troop producing Wonders, but I cannot verify that this is actually true by my own experience. Sorry if that wasn't clear.
 

Darielle

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, and Buddy Fan Club Member
Welcome to the forum. Lots of info and help here. We also like to complain. ;)
There is no negative effects for doing any optional techs, not just the squad research. Although, I have sometimes put the KP in them but waited to complete them for a quest in an event. Key word there is 'sometimes'.
Good strategy. It makes for such easy event quests.
 
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