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    Your Elvenar Team

Preparation for future chapters

  • Thread starter Deleted User - 849402856
  • Start date

Deleted User - 849402856

Guest
Dear all,

I am writing to ask about what I can do to be better prepared for future chapters. I am currently in early Chapter 3, and I feel I am currently producing enough coins/supplies/goods for catering. I can finish the 5 - 6ish tournaments that I have to complete each week, and also during my first spire experience this week I could make it to near the end of High Halls.

Therefore, I want to do some preparations for future chapters when I can. Based on my reading of some posts, I think I can
- Build some Orc Nests to begin accumulating Orcs
- Build some Grounds of Orcs Strategists to get some Orcs Strategists (I am human, and I heard human heavy melee isn't so good).
- Build Moonstone Library to begin accumulating spell fragments and combining catalysts. With the SF and CC, I can in turn begin crafting pet foods, military temporary buildings, or anything else that might turn out useful in the future (please suggest).

Below are what I have already been doing:
- Trying to level the ancient wonders (currently leveling Golden Abyss, and planning to build the needles as soon as possible)
- Trying to get some fire phoenix artifacts from the current event and the upcoming fellowship adventure

What would you recommend me do? Any suggestion will be welcome. Regarding my playstyle, currently I usually cater/negotiate, but in the future I would like to mainly fight and cater occasionally when that is more efficient.

Thanks in advance!
 
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Gladiola

Well-Known Member
@Kazaar Here's my perspective as a fellow chapter 3 player. I just played my first spire too, but started on the last day so I only got through the fourth floor.

Orc Nests will not start accumulating orcs unless they are acquired in the orcs chapter or upgraded with RRs when in the orcs chapter to the orcs level. So there's little point in placing them before orcs. I believe they produce supplies below orc chapter.

Orc Strategists are heavy ranged. I have a Grounds of the Orc Strategist, and it's quite nice. It gives decent culture for our level as well as popping out the units.

Moonstone Library only produces CCs when you also have all four other buildings attached. You can accumulate a lot of spell fragments just from doing the spire (I got 7000 just on my first round). Look into joining a fellowship that gets at least bronze in the spire so you can get CCs as fellowship rewards. (Not to mention diamonds!) Military buildings, timers and instants are things that people like to craft. Which ones are best for you depend on your style of play.

I would be interested to hear from more established players how they feel about Needles in light of AWs causing greater difficulty in spire and tournaments. If you are not having a problem replacing troops it might not be worth it.

I would love to have artifacts for the 2019 phoenix. I'm going to wait until I have at least 8-9 before I craft it from my MA; then it will be in a higher level chapter when I make it.
 

Henroo

Oh Wise One
Most chapter 3 cities do not have enough training time to fully take advantage of Needles. When my city was in chapter 3 and 4 I had 4 maxed armories. Despite this, my training times hovered between 3 to 4 hours. This meant that every time I was away from the game for longer than this, my barracks would run out of troops to train and would go idle. Building and upgrading Needles made the issue even worse. For example: instead of my barracks running out of troops to train after about 3.5 hours, with Needles it might run out of troops after 3 hours. The issue of training time really does not get solved until you get the Dwarven Bulwark AW at the end of the Dwarves chapter. This AW gives a massive increase in training time. Once you have DB, you have enough training time that you can load in a lot of troops and truly take advantage of Needles.

I think a more important wonder in the early game is the Martial Monastery/Sanctuary (the name changes depending on if you are a elf or human, but it does the same thing). You get it in chapter 4. It gives all of your troops a toughness boost and it gives you culture. Fights are so hard early in the game that everything you can do to improve your chances is worth it.
 

Lelanya

Scroll-Keeper, Keys to the Gems
Henroo makes some good points. Use the space instead for Endless Excavation. This wonder gives a lot of benefits and is never a bad option, nor would you think about selling it. It's probably better than supplies from Orc Nests. Definitely Grounds of the Orc Strategist, and place a few of them if you can.
Definitely Moonstone Library.
The other advice can give, is build a balanced city. Try to keep all your buildings in roughly the same range, all blue, all aqua, all purple. Add in good hybrid event culture for extra population, this will help.
 

Deleted User - 849402856

Guest
Thanks everyone for the answers. I learned a lot from the answer.

- Orc Nest: I didn't know that Orc Nest did not produce Orcs before I reach the chapter. Thanks, Gladiola.
- Needles: Actually I didn't know specifically what this wonder did. I just heard that it was a good military wonder. As Henroo said, I am not sure if this wonder will be very useful to me at this point because I don't fight much right now and my under-upgraded barracks and armories are already producing enough troops for those few fights. I think I will, at least, de-prioritize Needles in terms of building and leveling it.
- Ground of the Orc Strategist: I will look for this building in the craft menu definitely.

- Moonstone Library set: Interestingly, people seem to have different opinions about it. Although the Spire gives a substantial amount of both spell fragments and combining catalysts, I thought of building the library set for some extra. Crafting, and especially crafting the phoenix artifacts with 10 CC nowadays, has depleted my CC completely, so I felt a bit of extra might come in handy. I will do more research into it.
 

Gladiola

Well-Known Member
@Kazaaar Also think about building the Golden Abyss if you don't have one already. That is a Wonder that will grow with us. It provides population as a percentage of your working population -- a tiny amount initially (I would get 34 if I built it right now) -- but as your population grows it will naturally give more and more, as well as when you upgrade it. The extra coins can be used at the wholesaler or possibly to buy Knowledge Points. I know there are a variety of opinions about buying Knowledge Points since each one costs more than the last and we have to buy them for events, but what I have heard from big players is that in the long run the cost of KP now is not a big deal. (And you can use the KP to upgrade the Abyss!)

The GA is my top priority wonder to build when I expand my city to its chapter 3 boundaries.
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
Three future things that you will never get enough of, especially when you first need them: the little green orcs starting in chapter 8, Mana starting in chapter 9, and Divine Seeds starting in chapter 11. Being in a fellowship that does well enough in the weekly tournaments is also important, because you can start winning Royal Restorations and Blueprints, to save for future chapters also. The RRs are important because they are used to upgrade an event building by one chapter and this can be a way to get orcs, mana, and seeds sooner in the relevant chapters. Any event building you win that gives a product, like supplies or goods, may change to giving orcs, mana, or seeds when it is upgraded with RRs to the matching chapter. For example, if you win a building in chapter 7 that gives some sort of goods, check the upgrade tab and see if it changes from goods to orcs when it is upgraded to be a chapter 8 building. If it does, then as soon as you complete the chapter 8 Advanced Scouts, you will be able to upgrade that building and get orcs from it right away. Same thing for chapter 8 buildings that may change to making mana in chapter 9, or chapter 10 buildings that change to giving seeds in chapter 11. Doing this will make the start of those three chapters a lot easier.

Also be prepared for the game to majorly shift when you get to chapter 6 and the first of the Guest Race chapters. From that point on, each chapter will have a unique guest race, and buildings to go with them, that are only needed for that chapter.
 

Gladiola

Well-Known Member
Orc Strategists are orcs in name only and are not (now at least) related to the orcs and goblins chapter. They are way too smart and handsome to be orcs in any case. Normally you unlock the ability to make orc strategists in the training ground in a later chapter (I think Elementals?). But the Grounds of the Orc Strategist makes them without using the training ground, without requiring supplies, before you have completed the research. Pretty nifty. There are a few other buildings that do something similar. The Vallorian Valor craftable building gives Vallorian Guards and the Witch's Hut (unfortunately not craftable afaik) gives Faineant Frogs. There are probably others I haven't learned about yet.
 

Deleted User - 849402856

Guest
Thanks, everyone. I am also right now crating my first Grounds of the Orc Strategist from the MA hehe
 

crackie

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, Buddy's #1 Fan
I'm in chapter 3 ...and i am making an instant building called Grounds of the Orc Strategist. Can I use it immediately or is it only when I get to chapter 8?
Don't forget your friends the Vallorian Valors (also crafted in MA)! They are the best units for dealing with heavy range early game cause Treants take too long walking to the battle scene. I use less Vallorian Valors as my mages got upgraded mid-game, but Orc Strategists are still in heavy rotation. Also, sell them and re-craft them when you chapter up. Don't waste royal restorations on these things!

I also agree with @Henroo about not being able to fully take advantage of Needles early on, but I still go to town upgrading mine really high early chapter, mainly because early game, there aren't that many wonders to compete with. I've only got GA and Monastery. By early settlement chapters, you'll have more wonders that need your attention, but hey, that Needles is already chapter 15 so you can ignore it or whatever and just feed it armories. Making troops too quickly is a first world problem :)
 

Lelanya

Scroll-Keeper, Keys to the Gems
Hey there
In the interests of clearing up misinformation.
Orc Strategists are most definitely orcs, and are gained during chapter 8 in the tech tree. They are cooked in the Training Grounds, and use 'worker' orcs instead of supplies, just the same as the heavy melee unit. This is a good strategy to save on supplies if you are producing enough orcs to spare.

Grounds of the Orc Strategists is a great culture that is particularly useful for low level players, as it grants them the troops without waiting, nor does it cost orcs, just the 2x4 space to place it.
They upgrade to 2 and 3 star further along in the tech tree.
 

SoggyShorts

Mathematician par Excellence
I would be interested to hear from more established players how they feel about Needles in light of AWs causing greater difficulty in spire and tournaments. If you are not having a problem replacing troops it might not be worth it.
Henroo was quite right about the Needles. Unless you are able to constantly queue up more troops by clicking on the barracks every couple of hours it will sit idle if it trains troops too quickly.
The training time calculator can help players find the right ratio of barracks:armories:needles
www.tinyurl.com/trainingcalc
Also think about building the Golden Abyss if you don't have one already.
...
The GA is my top priority wonder to build when I expand my city to its chapter 3 boundaries.
A note on the GA:
IMO It's the second-best starting wonder by a long shot for many players and not worth placing until later.
E.G. That mock city I designed for you (link) has the GA giving you a measly 105 pop compared to your residence (also 3x3) that gives 420 :oops:
In fact, it doesn't give you more population than a residence unless you get it to level 26 which would require a whopping 9,000 KP investment.​
Compare that to the ToS
At level 1 with zero KP invested it gives 22,000 supplies per scout which is the equivalent of 5 fully leveled workshops in 24h. With a moderate investment, you can get it to level 6 where it gives 2 KP per day and beats out 10 workshops in production if you scout regularly.​

So unless you are planning on staying in chapter 4 for many months instead of progressing through it in weeks the ToS might be a much better choice and the Golden Abyss can wait until your working population gets above 8,000 so that it's better than a house. (approx mid to late chapter 5)
 
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Gladiola

Well-Known Member
@SoggyShorts The GA doesn't require culture, though. Although I came up with a better solution. I got a Phoenix Chick from the daily event yesterday that gives me 220 population (as much as a level 10 residence), plus 136 culture and 113 marble per day. I plopped it in to replace one of my level 7 residences (that I had planned to upgrade to level 8), and the change allows me to maintain a 150% culture bonus with neighborly help while still having population to upgrade my crystal factories to level 6 and marble factories to level 9. I haven't placed my expansions yet -- still thinking about the best layout and enjoying slightly lower tournament and spire costs.

As for staying in chapter 4 for months, it's a possibility given that I've been playing for around 5 weeks now and am still in the early stages of chapter 3. With my very conservative scouting (I have scouted 29 provinces in 5 weeks), I don't think the ToS would be much help on the supply front. It is going to be a long time before my main hall is level 15. While upgrading main hall is useful for providing coins and supplies from neighborly help, I still have a surplus of coins and supplies and would rather put that population and culture toward buildings that produce goods, which have no storage limit.
 

SoggyShorts

Mathematician par Excellence
Your working population is explosive in the first few chapters. By level 8 the GA should be worth its footprint even in a chapter 3 city.
Unless @Gladiola has far fewer expansions planned than normal I don't see it, and that's chapter 4.

Level 13 at least even with a silly no road mock design.
Do you have a chapter 3 design where a level 8 GA is better than residences?

In her current Ch 3 city https://www.elvenarchitect.com/city/planner/f65689487e4843a68d2dc86afd295ac8/
a level 8 GA gives 86 pop vs her level 8 res giving 170 pop
 
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