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    Your Elvenar Team

Rebalancing of select (old) event buildings

Deborah M

Oh Wise One
After the update on Thursday, my population only fell by a few hundred, so I stayed around 5,000. I had a weird experience in the game today. My population was around 5,000 yesterday (Friday, a day after the update) and today (Saturday), it's over 10,000. Was there some strange glitch in the update? Cause I didn't think any buildings improved population!

Yes there were buildings that improved :) And some either improved or lost value depending on what chapter the player got them in.
 

GroomerWoman

Active Member
Deborah, I understand the point you are trying to make, but it is inexcusable to expect that everyone will dig through a miscellaneous thread labelled "Spoilers" for information that is important to their game play. That is simply a ridiculous expectation and it is not reasonable to expect that everyone will visit the forums and look through a spoilers thread that has a dozen different subjects in it to see if anything important to the future of their game is included somewhere several pages in. Using it as evidence that people aren't paying attention is utterly ridiculous. That boat just won't float.
Thank You Ashrem that was the point I was trying to make. I do skim through the "important" threads but as you said they are usually several pages long and I have found the threads marked "spoilers" are usually about upcoming events and usually talk about issues the events had in Beta. Of course there is fun banter too which is enjoyable when I have the time to read through them.
 

Nectar of the Gods

Well-Known Member
I only mentioned 2 buildings because those were the 2 biggest offenders. The majority had improvements, so I didn't mention those, and many were buildings that you could only have 1 instance of (e.g., you can't have multiple Scream of Halloweens or Gaegils Balcony).
But it is not just one building and it is not just two. It is multiple buildings. And that is how I went from over a thousand population to -14. I'm lucky I didn't join until October and had fewer event buildings to "adjust". I'm still in Dwarves in 3 of my cities and recovering from a population and culture deficit in all of them that leaves me scrambling to find a way to do something to move forward. They didn't just "adjust" the "biggest offenders". They took a hatchet to the specs of a lot of buildings. Perhaps the outcry wouldn't have been as great if they would have chosen a building or two to hack away at--and given people notice it was going to happen in time to prepare for it. But they didn't. They rounded up a lot of buildings and slashed away. And now they are going to give a spell to bring back the specs of one building? Yeah, that's going to help. :rolleyes: Oh! I forgot the magic residence. Which I'll never be able to upgrade. (O.K. Never is a long long time. I'll add a modifier to "never"-- "likely".) I am in 4 different FSs. Not one of them have ever cleared all 10 chests. I'm not sure what other method one can use to attain one of these spells. But likely, I'll never have one. I had a magic residence once. Bought it when I started playing and got stuck in chapter 2. Hung onto it for the longest time waiting on a blueprint to upgrade it. Finally realized that wasn't happening and that I would have more population if I deleted it and built and upgraded a regular residence. It was hard deleting it. But I finally did, for the sake of my city's growth. Giving away a magic residence is handing a person a band-aid to stem the flow of a cut artery.

I didn't say all players wanted upgradeable buildings. I said many.
Definition of many:
man·y

determiner, pronoun, & adjective
1.
a large number of.
"many people agreed with her"
synonyms: numerous, a great/good deal of, a lot of, plenty of, countless, innumerable, scores of, crowds of, droves of, an army of, a horde of, a multitude of, a multiplicity of, multitudinous, multiple, untold...
And if you follow the "suggestions" forum, and the Timon and Rike Q&As,
? I don't. I never have. I would venture a guess to say "many" players don't have any idea who these people are or why they should spend time away from building their cities to read their Q&As
you'd agree that it has been a constant request from dozens of unique players.
{Bolding mine} That sounds like far fewer than "many".
I don't think characteriznig this change as something a vocal minority wants is accurate.
I do. How many players do you think there are who play Elvenar? I'm sure there are stats somewhere. We have seen only a fraction of the people who are upset about this change come to the forums and voice their dissatisfaction. Those "dozens of unique players" are a minority. A vocal minority, yes.

The outrage you're seeing is people wanting to have their cake and eat it too.
That is so much malarkey.
They want amazing event buildings (see every event thread in the past 12 months of people complaining about the strength of the rewards), and they want to be able to keep them around forever.
Ok. What is wrong with someone wanting to keep what they have won? It hurts no one. It is their city. If they wish to have a chapter 2 event building and they are now in Elementals, how does that harm anyone? (Hint: it doesn't.)
People ask for game changes all the time, and they almost never acknowledge that an improvemnt on one end needs to have a corresponding in-game change that makes life harder.
People's outrage has nothing to do with wanting to have their cake and eat it too. I was fine with the buildings being given for events. I didn't want them to be upgradable. Never crossed my mind. I was happy with the culture and population they had. I was ok with knowing that as I advanced I would be replacing those buildings with new buildings that gave higher population and culture. People's outrage has to do with having a positive population and culture when they went to bed and waking up to a negative population and culture. For me, even the culture thing is not as mind numbing as the loss of population. There are plenty of regular culture buildings that have good culture. The loss of population, though, completely stalled me. When I played the event and won the building and placed it in my city, I was told that building's value would never change. I relied on that contract with Inno. I planned around that building, built around that building, based my city's growth on having that building and its bonuses available. That was ripped away from me. And no one even had the decency to say in the notifications, "Watch out! A tsunami is coming for your city!" That's why people are filled with rage. That's why people are quitting. And that's why Inno is now handing out band-aids.

There's nothing in it for me for "defending" the developers, other than recognizing that I want an improving and evolving game. If anything, that should give credence to my arguments. I wish Inno was giving me diamonds for my forum posts, but you can see from the lack of premium buildings in my city that its simply not the case.
Wouldn't it be wonderful though if they did offer diamonds for posting? More people would come to the forums, I bet. :D
 

DeletedUser12171

Guest
I highlighted a couple of words there that I find quite important. For that particular "rebalance" know someone who saved 100% of their event currency for them, so they got hit a little harder than you did.
You asked "Would you feel shortchanged if they nerfed them 1 month after you got them? 2 weeks? 1 day?" - my answer is maybe, but no biggie. water off a duck's back so to speak. Am I to "blame" for deciding to get only 1 FNC instead of 100? Yeah, of course. Exactly 0 people told me how many FNCs I should have gotten

Is it a matter of time? Of course it is. this is a game that's continually in development, what did anyone expect? I joined the game later than some of you and didn't get to benefit from super powered CL/BS or crazy GA before chapter 5. Is that an issue? Absolutely not. Devs decide how fast the game should progress/change. I don't bother myself with things like that, because it's too much hassle for what is just a game. I just look at what's happening, what is the metagame, and I adjust accordingly. Some things in life are worth fighting for, and tbh this is not one of them. I enjoy the game, don't get me wrong. I'm not in a "life sucks, just gotta suck it up" state of mind. Rather, I take changes in stride. That, if you like, is "part of [my] playstyle" and I hope "might explain [my] position better."
 
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SoggyShorts

Mathematician par Excellence
so this rebalancing compensation will be on all of my cities or once for my account?

Once per account
If you play 7 cities on 1 account you get rewarded on the city you 1st log into

Can we get a clear answer from someone who may actually know? A moderator who may have some direct contact with the devs? A rep from INNO?

Here you go:

quote3.png
You get a magic res on each world.
 

SoggyShorts

Mathematician par Excellence
You asked "Would you feel shortchanged if they nerfed them 1 month after you got them? 2 weeks? 1 day?" - my answer is maybe, but no biggie. water off a duck's back so to speak.
So you've you have never experienced a significant setback due to an unexpected nerf. Lucky you.
 

DeletedUser3122

Guest
Yes there were buildings that improved :) And some either improved or lost value depending on what chapter the player got them in.

Yes, I know some were buffed, but the doubled increase didn't happen until today (Saturday), not on Thursday with the update. Did some strange thing happen that I'm not aware?
 

DeletedUser9287

Guest
I want to know about this new spell, Royal Restoration Spell. I understand we can get it by playing in the Tournaments, but how else can we get them? Will we be able to make them in the Magic Academy? If not, if the Spell can only be gotten like the BluePrints, I don't want them or the Magic Residences. Far too expensive for me.
 

DeletedUser12171

Guest
So you've you have never experienced a significant setback due to an unexpected nerf. Lucky you.

That's not the point, is it? So what if I have, and so what if I haven't? It seems you have also ignored the second part of my post that you quoted

I'll say this much - It's just been about a year since I started playing. In this time, there haven't been any game changes that riles me or makes me feel like quitting. I don't know if it will happen in the future, but chances are no, because I take changes in stride and because these things simply don't matter that much to me
 

SoggyShorts

Mathematician par Excellence
Thank you SoggyShorts for answering 1 of my questions.
afaik 1 spell and 1 mag res per city.
1 PC per city for the entire FS if it completed stage 2. I'm too lazy to get screenshots of those answers from Beta, but feel free to check yourself.
EDIT: I found one
quote3.png
That's not the point, is it? So what if I have, and so what if I haven't?
It goes to perspective. You have pretty much stated that you think some players are overreacting to the change, but you have never had it happen to you.
- It's just been about a year since I started playing. In this time, there haven't been any game changes that riles me or makes me feel like quitting.
Yet, and that was my point, nothing bad has happened to you in balancing changes, so obviously you don't feel the same as others who have been adversely affected.
I don't know if it will happen in the future, but chances are no, because I take changes in stride and because these things simply don't matter that much to me
Again, you'll never know until it happens to you.
 

DeletedUser188

Guest
Here you go:
Thanks for the info I also saw that on beta forum
It seems this is another case of miscommunication between inno games and their forum team
If it is actually each world then it should state that in the official announcement
No where in the announcement on beta or US forum does it say 1 for each world
It actually states ,
For this reason, we will, on top of the free Royal Restoration spell that we had already promised (to be given out once the spell becomes available in the game), give out one free Magic Residence of your chapter to all existing accounts,
Unless all existing accounts now means all existing worlds I read that as 1 per account
What next are all the worlds going to be referred to as servers
I want to believe the beta forum mod but I have doubts about it so I wont really know for sure until tuesday
Ælfwine
Could we get some clarification about the wording of the announcement please:)
 

SoggyShorts

Mathematician par Excellence
It seems this is another case of miscommunication between inno games and their forum team
Indeed. I can see how some players mix up server,world, and account, but the devs should simplify it and use "city" or "player". Better yet, everything except diamonds should be per city, always.
My German is far too rusty to remember the words for each, but maybe that's part of the problem, and stuff just gets google translated to the other 20 languages before being sent out to community managers.
 

DeletedUser12171

Guest
It goes to perspective. You have pretty much stated that you think some players are overreacting to the change, but you have never had it happen to you.
Yet, and that was my point, nothing bad has happened to you in balancing changes, so obviously you don't feel the same as others who have been adversely affected.
Again, you'll never know until it happens to you.

I don't know when did the discussion transform into an evaluation of my personal character and beliefs, but here are the points I did make:

1. Paying for diamonds doesn't mean you own the game, this legally and not just in principle. Implication: you might want to adjust your expectations accordingly

2. Over-reliance on event buildings led to a bigger impact of the change on some players. Implication: you might want to adjust your strategy from here out

For point 2, nowhere did I diss anyone for doing it. In fact I admitted to doing it myself, though I've since changed that, and said that it was fine to do so because the prevailing metagame and mechanic allowed for it. If anything, Ashrem's assertion that I mistakenly exaggerated the impact of the nerf proves that I did take player complaints about said impact seriously

Now I've got people questioning me about how I would feel, what is my playstyle and insinuating that I am insensitive. Lol really now, you guys take issue only when the criticism is against you. But someone comes with a different perspective and his/her opinion is mush. Hypocrite much? In case it wasn't obvious, my viewpoint is an underrepresented viewpoint. Where are all you equal-voice crusaders now?

So now can we stop taking things personally and get back to the topic? If you feel otherwise, I'm sorry, but I stand by what I said.
 
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DeletedUser9934

Guest
Indeed. I can see how some players mix up server,world, and account, but the devs should simplify it and use "city" or "player". Better yet, everything except diamonds should be per city, always.
My German is far too rusty to remember the words for each, but maybe that's part of the problem, and stuff just gets google translated to the other 20 languages before being sent out to community managers.

That would be "Server", "Welt", "Konto", "Stadt" though City is clearly understood, and "Spieler", respectively. I lived in Switzerland for 4 years, but it is 30 years ago. I also know that the business mentality in Germany has changed drastically since then. And a 20% yearly revenue increase awakens business piranhas everywhere!

I took a peek on InnoGames official website, ( https://www.innogames.com/company/about-us/#c868 ) I am surprised that it is just a 400+ people company. With an expected revenue of 200 million Euros this year, it is half a million per person. Though I am certain it is not evenly spread.

It may not be efficient to open up private conversations with the moderators and service people, but sending a fax to 01149 40 7889335-200 starting with the words "Sehr Geehrter Herrn Eike Klindworth," may.
 

rvtdragon1

Well-Known Member
Thank you Soggy. I appreciate the info. I did not mean to direct my frustration towards INNO and their need for clearer communication at you. We are not supposed to discuss things from Beta in this thread but it seems that is the only way we can get any answers. I cannot believe that there is not at least one person at INNO who has a decent understanding of the English language. This entire thread has really been about communication, or the lack of it, and once again we get another example of unclear communication. Even after 354 entries on this thread. I imagine we will get an answer two or three days after they do whatever it is they do. That would be consistent with previous experiences.
 
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DeletedUser4601

Guest
I quit playing beta for exactly this reason 6 months ago when they did a rebalance, I complained and got no results. And yes they can and have done this before on beta.
And they did it in game play as well a few years back. Disgusting, totally disgusting
 

DeletedUser4145

Guest
I went from 1600 population to -2500???? There is no way I can recover ~3500 population. I don't care if the buildings I had are unfair to new comers, that isn't my problem, so why are you making it mine. Diamond replacements or something equivalent needs to be given or my population needs to be restored to what it was.

All people affected should be offered their money spent on the game back. If this isn't rectified, I could see this leading to a class action law suit.
 
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