Reduce the base tournament encounter timer

[hoopity]

A level 1 Polar gets you very close to your arbitrary 14hrs mark and if you want to do serious tourney, you’d have to manage pet food anyway. To say it costs you 1 Pet Food is not a great argument as then, should we say we get military strengthening for free too bc the benefit of Fire Phoenix isn’t it’s portal profit/coin rain but it’s feed effect. That will cost you at least a Pet Food a week. By your reasoning, maybe we should get those benefits for free too. Why not recovery bonus from Twilight without pet food as well? See slope? Slippery be it! Besides that there is Timewarp as everyone already pointed out, tourney is also completely optional to do, which means doing 0 rounds, let alone 6 rounds. Hence, losing sleep is optional too.

The Fire Phoenix is a non-sequitur -- making the combat encounters easier has nothing to do with my post, so your pet food point is moot. Players can either cater or complete encounters without a pet-food enabled military boost.

And yes, the Polar Bear and 1 pet food per week will mostly avoid the issue. I'll ignore the countless "give us more pet food" complaints on the forum for a moment, and just ask: why would it be such a problem to let timewarp-less players (which is most people <2 years of play) be able to more conveniently schedule their tourney play?

 

[hoopity]

As for effort to make an unnecessary change - to change a variable would draw their attention away from other projects that might actually be useful.

It's ok if you don't think this is a good suggestion, but this is rude. I know this suggestion forum is basically a pipe dream that rarely gets changes made, but I still put effort in, so please be at least a little open-minded.

As for the rest of your post, yes, it is already feasible to do this. I have been doing it across multiple worlds every week for years, so I understand the pain. In fact, in my original pitch I said:

"The current 16-hour timer requires anyone who wants to complete all 6 stages of a given tourney province to sacrifice their sleep and play in very strict time-windows at least once or twice per week, every week, indefinitely."

Those windows you posted require a precise schedule where the first thing you do in the morning and last thing you do at night is sit on your phone/computer waiting for a timer to tick down. And if it takes you more than moment to complete the tourney? I'll sometimes take 15-20 minutes to do rounds across a couple worlds. What if your schedule slips by a few minutes? I know you think that the current set up is fine. But I'm suggesting that the 16 hour window is pointlessly painful to do every week, and it doesn't seem like it would impact the game to turn it down.

 

[Genefer]

No, I'm sorry, when I wrote that the map issue popped into my head and internally, I was thinking about all the things that have been introduced when there are issues that really need to be addressed. My feelings over the map just bled into my comment. I really, am sorry, and yes it was extremely rude.

 

[Genefer]

Oh, I didn't even consider the multi-world player. I am down to my Sinya city, so this is not an issue anymore, but when I was playing three cities the other two received far less attention, and not near as much tournament activity, because I didn't have the time. So, I can see how this could potentially limit the sleep of multi-world players.

 

[Ashrem]

@Ashrem Adding a new pet-food using building or expiring building doesn't really address what the change I'm suggesting is aimed at doing. I simply want all players to complete two rounds in one day every week without having to wreck their sleep schedule. Your suggestions are really just extensions of the solutions that are currently in place.

Yes. that's exactly what my suggestion is, because I disagree with you. You are requesting a change which reduces the value of work I've already expended in game. I can do a round every three hours without spending any pet food because I have put 17,000 KP and a ton of sentient goods and mana and divine seeds into levelling my ancient wonder, and you want the developers to give it to people who haven't done that.

Your idea starts with the (invalid) assumption that everyone should have a right to complete six rounds in their tournament.

 

[hoopity]

No, I'm sorry, when I wrote that the map issue popped into my head and internally, I was thinking about all the things that have been introduced when there are issues that really need to be addressed. My feelings over the map just bled into my comment. I really, am sorry, and yes it was extremely rude.

No worries, I overreacted. I was dealing with an ant-infestation in the playroom so that had me on edge!

Yes. that's exactly what my suggestion is, because I disagree with you. You are requesting a change which reduces the value of work I've already expended in game. I can do a round every three hours without spending any pet food because I have put 17,000 KP and a ton of sentient goods and mana and divine seeds into levelling my ancient wonder, and you want the developers to give it to people who haven't done that.

Your idea starts with the (invalid) assumption that everyone should have a right to complete six rounds in their tournament.

Your response starts with the equally invalid assumption that everyone shouldn't have a right to complete six rounds in their tournament. Or maybe I should say 'unsupported' and not 'invalid'? Only Inno gets to decide what the design goals are for their game. If you can show me the documentation on this, I'll concede the point, but I don't think you'll find it. In any case, your assertion is bunk: all players can already complete all 6 rounds -- it's just inconvenient to do so, and unhealthy with long-term play, in my opinion.

As for your statement about de-valuing the work put in on your Timewarp, I guess I just think you're overreacting. I'll quote myself from my original post:

"This will devalue the Timewarp AW -- I have a lot levels on mine!"
True, the Timewarp would be made somewhat less important. But, it would still be useful for getting the tourney timer into even shorter ranges. You can still save on pet food when you get your timer down to 5-7 hours between rounds and do 3 rounds per day. You still benefit from being more flexible during events when you can save tourney provinces for the right time to complete a quest. You can still get the 0-hour wait in conjunction with the Polar Bear and double-dip on expiring troop boosts. And of course, it still has the sentient production boost!

Whatever, agree to disagree I guess.

 

[Ashrem]

Your response starts with the equally invalid assumption that everyone shouldn't have a right to complete six rounds in their tournament. Or maybe I should say 'unsupported' and not 'invalid'? Only Inno gets to decide what the design goals are for their game. If you can show me the documentation on this, I'll concede the point, but I don't think you'll find it. In any case, your assertion is bunk: all players can already complete all 6 rounds -- it's just inconvenient to do so, and unhealthy with long-term play, in my opinion.

I've made no such assumption. Everyone can already complete six rounds without any extra assistance if they are willing to get up early once a week or stay up late once a week. I did it for several years before the Polar bear and Timewarp existed. No one is denied the chance to do six rounds barring their life choices, and I have done nothing to ask they be blocked from doing so. Inno has deployed a function which is open to everyone, and has offered at least three paths to making it easier (Timewarp AW, Polar Bear, and buying diamonds to speed up the timers).

I've already indicated I'd be supportive of them finding more ways to make it easier for people willing to expend some sort of time, effort, or money. Your idea proposes something for nothing, takes value away from time and effort that many other people have already expended, and takes value away from Inno by reducing the incentives for people to use diamonds. The single biggest threat to any idea is whether it will reduce income for the developers.

The second item they ask you to consider in the "read before posting" for Ideas is "Will it benefit players from all markets and all stages of the game?" Your proposal is a benefit to early players and takes value away from later stage players after they have already expended that time and effort.

It might not be a hard sell to enough of the newer players in the community to get passed a poll, but I'd happily bet real (as in three-figure) money that the developers won't even entertain it if it gets to them.

 

[BrinDarby]

I believe its 11am ( mst ) start time currently.
thats 10a pst , 11a mst , 12p cst , 1p est ...

Before I even address loss of sleep.... lets address if
the player has a traditional job..... 8a-5p... with 1 hr
for lunch. For some thats 4:30p and 1/2 hr lunch.
Lets also say they only use the PC version. Now you
are asking the player to potentially break company
rules by accessing the game from work, or drive home
access Elvenar, then drive back... ( you better live really
close if you want lunch too ). So if your 1st chance to
play tourn on tues is when you get home from work,
before dinner, before you do anything. @ that point,
you have already lost between 5-8 hrs.

Normally events always start @ 3am for me, so thats
worse case 5am est.... meaning it starts before anyone
usually gets up, but then day 1 ends right as that player
gets home.... about 6pm, possibly missing day 1 prize.

Your standard player, across many different games, only
logs on for 2-4 hrs, after dinner, before bedtime. therefore
they get 1 shot @ tourn rounds each night, plus 1 on sat.
Thats 5 rounds....... tues, wed, thurs, fri, sat. Having a PolarBear
will NOT fix this, only AW TimeWarp will, and thats not
available to most players.......

Therefore its "plausable" that this very situation is created
by Inno to force players to use boosts/diamonds/AWs or
something to chg the basic schedule.

The ONLY way to defeat this with loss of sleep is to NOT have
traditional JoB. Then u can set a alarm for 3am, to do an xtra
round , and you will be there when it starts to do that 1st rnd
without losing your time to complete. You also need to be
available more of the 24h clock, so...... so much for a "real" life.

Why "plausably" does it start when it does ??? my guess is it
starts 4p german time, right before staff goes home.... Thus
this would clearly be setup for German time not USA time.
When Events start like 3am , thats also what 8-9a German
time ???? right after staff gets to work each day...... duhhh.

As my 1st comment said..... you only need 1 staff on duty
24/7 , if Inno is as successfull as some have said , then
the cost of that 1 staff dwarfs a potential systemic problem
that will effect revenue/user base/ect/ect ....... That allows
1 game run in 8 timezone servers, to all cater to the timezone
of the playerbase...... not the timezone of the Staff of Inno.

I guess by the time you can build a TimeWarp, Inno has got
enuff of your $$$$/diamonds and you've used enuff boosters
for Inno to finally cut you a break.......thats what ??? CH 14 ?

This is a simmilar example to how Inno nerfs currency in
Events so its assumes most reg players will be 1 artifact short.
In tournaments, its assumed I guess you'll be 1 round short too.

This situation is created by Inno, prolly on purpouse, to aid in
revenue to the game. It certainly is not meant to aid in "Fun"
or "ease of play" for thier customers......... Us .....

 

[Killy-]

The huuuuge advantage of timewarp + polar bear is the double usage of boosters. I don't get how players with those 2 think, they would lose anything, if the tournament cooldown would get lowered. You still have the same advantage and there is no reason to act like "I worked so hard for this, so nobody else can get some improvement for free". At least that is my opinion - 6 rounds of tournament should be reasonable for most players and it is not right now.

 

[hvariidh gwendrot]

i don't see a disadvantage in letting newer players be treated as newer players, and advanced players as advanced, (and we do need more pet food, i can't even keep up using 4 a week) if someone can't finish all 6 rounds they have other options to score, that's the way it is, otherwise just hand out participation trophies for everyone and don't worry about scores

 

[Ashrem]

The huuuuge advantage of timewarp + polar bear is the double usage of boosters. I don't get how players with those 2 think, they would lose anything, if the tournament cooldown would get lowered. You still have the same advantage and there is no reason to act like "I worked so hard for this, so nobody else can get some improvement for free". At least that is my opinion - 6 rounds of tournament should be reasonable for most players and it is not right now.

It's not losing something, it's suddenly having past effort wasted. if the tournament is shorter, they're not going to allow me to "un-level" my Timewarp, so all the KP and resources I put into it could have gone somewhere more useful where they wouldn't suddenly not be doing what I paid them to do.

 

[Yavimaya]

Did you read my proposal for a Sun Bear? Maybe your proposal could complement your idea.

It wouldn't me like your Sun Bear idea post and did I needed an account but I have an account. Odd. But I like it so just letting you know there is an extra like to your idea out there!

 

[Killy-]

It's not losing something, it's suddenly having past effort wasted. if the tournament is shorter, they're not going to allow me to "un-level" my Timewarp, so all the KP and resources I put into it could have gone somewhere more useful where they wouldn't suddenly not be doing what I paid them to do.

Well, that isn't the case, like I already stated. Timewarp let's you use your boosters for 2 tournaments and that advantage stays the same. By the way, what are a few tousand kps anyways? Since runes became worth 15 kps, upgrading wonders shouldn't be that difficult anymore, but maybe I should just complain about that fact, because I had to work for my kps, when I was still building wonders.

 

[SoggyShorts]

it's suddenly having past effort wasted.

Is it though? I'm pretty sure we've all gotten more than our "money's worth" out of it. Also, a zero cooldown and a 10% reduction are hardly the same thing.
You're kinda saying that the Ferrari you worked hard for and have used for years is wasted effort if everyone gets a moped for free.

As games advance and add more and more features/events/chapters etc they need to give newer players advantages we never had (time boosters, portal profits etc) so as not to overwhelm them, and give them a chance to meaningfully participate in aspects of the game that our experience has pretty much trivialized.

Yes, I was super thrilled to level my timewarp, and I put full effort into it and enjoyed the sweet reward once I had earned it
BUT
The hatred I had for the 16h base and the fact that I lost sleep for a silly browser game was insane. If the accomplishment is somewhat diminished but that horror is removed, then that's more than a fair trade-off.

 

[Ashrem]

Is it though?

Yes it is. I haven't had this Ferrari for years. I've only had it for a few months. And if Ferrari suddenly cut the price of having that level of performance, I'd be annoyed with them too.

 

[Sprite1313]

Round 5: Friday - 6 am
16-hr
Round 6: Friday - 10 pm
Done

In other words - If they are losing sleep - it is because they have not created their own schedule, and that's on the player

Except, if you are starting tournament at 10pm (in your scenario), you aren't going to sleep at 10pm. So, you are spending whatever amount of time to do tourney, then disengaging your brain, getting ready for bed and going to sleep. You are then getting up before 6am to be able to start tourney at 6am. So, less than 8 hours of sleep. Throw in the fact that the 2pm middle of your schedule is during work hours for most people, so is likely to slide a little to the right until somebody can get a break and play. This will, in turn, drive the 10pm start later and lead to less sleep.

It's not losing something, it's suddenly having past effort wasted. if the tournament is shorter, they're not going to allow me to "un-level" my Timewarp, so all the KP and resources I put into it could have gone somewhere more useful where they wouldn't suddenly not be doing what I paid them to do.

I don't feel that asking for a minor reduction in the start point for cooldown negates the value of the polar bear and (more significantly) the timewarp. My timewarp and polar bear allowing me to do two tourneys and two spires on one set of buildings (and using less pet food) means that I still have advantages that a new player doesn't have.

I think this is an idea that could make the game more enjoyable for new players (thus getting them to continue playing longer, which is good) without diminishing the game for older players. It's not like the new tournament/spire formula that punished advanced players for having advanced. It doesn't even completely level the playing field. All it really does is provide a quality of life improvement for early chapter players.

Yes, it might mean fewer players spend diamonds to speed tournament cooldown, but I doubt that many are doing that; the rewards just aren't worth it. On the flip side, a more sustainable tournament schedule might get more players to stay in the game, enjoy it, and spend diamonds in the long run.

I support this idea.

 

[Ashrem]

It wouldn't me like your Sun Bear idea post and did I needed an account but I have an account. Odd. But I like it so just letting you know there is an extra like to your idea out there!

That post is on the beta forum, so you'd need a beta city and forum account to participate there (including liking)

 

[Glandeh]

I would love to see the cooldown reduced. Living in the same time zone as Germany, tournament starts for me at 7PM. That means for me one round Tuesday evening, one round on Wedneday in lunch time (working from home, so no issue with company internet), but it has to be finished before 2PM to be able to do a second round Thursday morning before I get to work (autofight and negotiation) and another late in the evening (when I would rather be in bed). The last rounds are no issue, can do those Friday and Saturday early in the evening.

 

[Genefer]

If the purpose is to address sleep deprivations - doesn't it make more sense to increase the cooldown period?

Even with 14-hours the time of the day will be all over the place - work & sleep will still be disrupted.

Of course, if the cooldown was extended the Pet Food demand will increase - so that's out lol


Out of curiosity, why would support staff be needed for the US server to use the US time zones? I think all they would need to do is create an offset for the different time zones associated with the US server, Japan.... Having a clock specific to the servers would not require any additional staff, because the game is played at all hours every day already, so there should be staff on hand already in the even the game goes off the rails.


It would not require someone to manually set the countdown timer, and push start weekly. Add the offset parameters to the function - add it to the code with whatever syntax required - basically a selector & attribute and hit run - Voila! I could be wrong lol, but it seems very simple.



Sprite - I wasn't suggesting using those hours - that was my guestimate of when the tournament begins - and the soonest it could be completed - without any AW or Evolve influence - to show there is I think 16-hrs of time that can be used to create a schedule that better suits the player.

 

[BrinDarby]

Out of curiosity, why would support staff be needed for the US server to use the US time zones?

Have you ever noticed, Events and stuff start Only when
there are staff @ work. Many times we have been told
Inno wants to have someone there if a problem arises.