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    Your Elvenar Team

Discussion Rise of the Phoenix Cult event discussion thread

CrazyWizard

Well-Known Member
This is an assumption based on projected mathematics applied to gaming points most players do not reach. Most players dont go past the high halls. Most players dont go past ten tents. At what chapter will the costs of that over run production?
Tournament slayers and KP farmers keep inciting panic and despair in players that are minimally affected.
It's not panic, it's reality that if it continues at this way at some point it will become impossible.

I have already noticed people who have mayor issues at 20 provinces, I myself are still floating on 3 bears that keep me somewhat alive.
The tournaments are set up that the first few provinces are always possible, but I do not consider 10-20 provinces die hard or overkill.

But that range will be hit sooner than later by these rising costs.
Lets just say if you at least have some interest beyond the absolute minimum you'll be affected at some point.
 

Iyapo1

Well-Known Member
@CrazyWizard
You got nailed right between the eyes as did other players with wonderful wonders. Your tournament average was devastated by the change. KP farmers also got flattened.

Most players dont go past 10 tents....but they read the forum and get the wrong idea because no one is saying....stay under 4k keep it high and tight and you wont be chewed up(much).

Players come in with little 2k tournament averages and chapter 6 cities and blame the tournament changes because no one is being clear about where the grinder lives.

It lives past tent 15, past the frog, and past chapter 12.
 

jesikrey

Active Member
I was wondering why I even placed this phoenix.... hmmmm.... mana I guess but the other two bonus productions the 4000 royal velvet (I am boosted on velvet) and the one KP, meh... too bad we cannot hide the darn bird! I should've thought about it better lol
 

samidodamage

Well-Known Member
It lives past tent 15, past the frog, and past chapter 12.
Note: I am not a competitive tourney player; I'm content with 5 rounds of 20 provinces and a score of 3-4K.
I think this is a bit misleading, especially when talking about AW's. Other things in the game are based on the number of AW levels; the biggest being divine seeds (that decay). Players need them in Ch11 Halflings and in increasing quantities going forward from there. They're needed to make sentient goods (that also decay); they sorta replace the supplies used to make standard goods. This hits players who use diplomacy and cater heavily the hardest. Mana needs will also continue to increase, and I've seen players get into trouble with mana when they replace/upgrade mana event bldgs with those same bldgs that make seeds at higher chapters. Willows are just too big to be effective; there are better regular mana bldgs going forward but they are not nearly as good as event bldgs. Players do get the Dragon Abbey AW at the end of Ch10 that can produce mana on demand if they have a big enough inventory of spells to cast at will. But, again, that increases the number of AW levels as it is upgraded to get more mana/spell as well as needing space (20 squares of an expansion). The only regular bldg seed source is the bonus seeds available from the Trader (they top out at 3hrs, so collecting every 3 hrs increases your inventory more than waiting to collect past the 3 hr mark), the only other regularly available seed producer is the Festival Merchant in crafting. The mana production of that Merchant is also good, but will be lost if the space is used for higher level Merchants for seeds. More expansions will be needed to keep the old ones and add new ones. The amount of seeds from the Trader depends on the number of AW levels; the more AW levels, the more seeds with each collection. Choosing to have fewer AW levels will hamstring a player especially if they need sentient goods for catering/diplomacy.
As far as the frog for combat players: he comes on board in late Halflings, but is pretty squishy at 1*. He may be more viable for humans at 1* as their mortars are pretty weak, but for elves Golems are a better choice. He's decent at 2* (gotten in Ch13 Amuni), and with his range can be used in certain battles with better results than the 3*Golems, but it's not until he gets to 3* in Ch15 that he becomes the powerful unit that most advanced chapter players are talking about. Don't get me wrong: I love my frogs! But, I did fine before they were introduced. Note: I only play as an elf.
Am I doing what I'd like to do in tourneys/spire even with the current structure for increased costs? Yes. Do I dislike the introduction of a structure that penalizes growth/progression in a city building strategy game on the principle of the idea if nothing else? Double yes! Also, my own perception is that it disadvantages the non-fighters the most. I know several, one of whom I've been in an FS with for 3 years. That's where I've witnessed the struggle of players who have a different style than myself. To preserve their sanity, many end up choosing between the Spire and the tourney. This keeps them out of either a Gold Spire or a 10 chest tourney FS that has weekly minimums depending on their choice. They certainly won't be able to carry their own weight in an FS that is both. They have chosen a hard enough path that it seems especially unfair to hobble them even more.
 

Iyapo1

Well-Known Member
The amount of seeds from the Trader depends on the number of AW levels; the more AW levels, the more seeds with each collection. Choosing to have fewer AW levels will hamstring a player
Right. But the forum is filled with:

but even by mid-game, if you've placed too many expansions and/or invested too heavily into AW's, you're just completely screwed in both the tournaments + spire play.
I think the above is very misleading. Your regular average player does not go out far enough in the tournament or up high enough in the spire to get chewed up.
 

GlamDoll

Well-Known Member
To preserve their sanity, many end up choosing between the Spire and the tourney.
I am such a player, now, except that I do a little of both. My days of rocking the spire & tourny are long gone. Thankfully, my FS has no requirements, but I still like playing all the content in the game...I have placed more than a few expansions & have invested enough in my AWs & tech to see that I would never be able to get my six library sets now (If they were still in the Spire)...I spent about 5-6 months rocking the Spired for my sets. In short, it's the only way I can still participate some & sustain the losses between goods/troops/mana/seeds & sentient goods.
 

Alram

Well-Known Member
I was wondering why I even placed this phoenix.... hmmmm.... mana I guess but the other two bonus productions the 4000 royal velvet (I am boosted on velvet) and the one KP, meh... too bad we cannot hide the darn bird! I should've thought about it better lol
I am liking the 2kp and I can't wait for the next event and the extra currency. Sweet!
...are we there yet? are we there yet?........ How about now?..
:)
 

Deborah M

Well-Known Member
@GlamDoll I completely agree. I'm not throwing the baby out with the bath water for the sake of Spire or Tournament. I now have all but one AW (sold 1 for space :eek:) and some are high level while some are not. That is an aspect of the game I refuse to give up. I also have all expansions including the 3 new ones. Again, I refuse to hold back on terribly needed expansions. I've already made plans for chapter 18 and already started rearranging, storing & selling extra buildings. I just don't see the point of putting my city at a standstill. I'm only doing 2 levels in the Spire most weeks and only doing around 3,000 in the tournament. We get 10 chests so there is no reason to wipe out my resources doing more IMO. This week I did adjust how I get there. 15 provinces for first 2 rounds so I still get some of the above 10 KP and 10 provinces the other 4 times. I finally took a serious look at the graph and realized that will get me a whole lot of relief. Hopefully, the net effect of improvement from AW's vs punishing effects of recent changes will close the gap at least some. Hence, I'm still going for KP besides buildings when I do events.
 

The Unbeliever

Well-Known Member
I think the above is very misleading. Your regular average player does not go out far enough in the tournament or up high enough in the spire to get chewed up.
In Ch.9, my 5th fight in spire is already *over* 1k troops/slot. My actual SS is only 765.
That is beyond pants-on-head slowed that my expansions + AW levels are borking me that hard by just the 5th damn fight. (and no, not the 5th gate, the 5th actual fight as in, just past the first gate on floor 1!! o_O)

Mostly I am forced to negotiate the spire while saving my troops purely for tournaments... but yet again, I am prevented from really trying to go beyond the 10th province as again, the tournament SS even at just 1* is well above my *actual* SS.
And this is further compounded by the fact that being in only Ch9, I do not yet have access to even all 2* troops, let alone 3*, thus I am also forced to fight at an even further significant disadvantage due to the enemy now also having additional bonuses against my already outnumbered & inferior troops!

This isn't about chicken little-ing over not getting 200-300 extra kp/week.
This is the devs being a bunch of clueless morons who refuse to even entertain the idea that they'd fethed up and are actively hurting even just average players' ability to play the damn game! >.<
 

Iyapo1

Well-Known Member
well above my *actual* SS.
?
Why are you even looking at your *actual* squad size it is a meaningless number? It is not used at all to calculate tournament or spire encounters. It is only used on province encounters on the map and in event/FA quests/badges.


Edit: I think a few wonders use it too...
 

Alram

Well-Known Member
@The Unbeliever
You should start a new thread. I am sure a lot of players could help you redesign your ch 9 city so that it could go past 10 tents AND reach the spire laboratory.
 

The Unbeliever

Well-Known Member
?
Why are you even looking at your *actual* squad size it is a meaningless number? It is not used at all to calculate tournament or spire encounters. It is only used on province encounters on the map and in event/FA quests/badges.


Edit: I think a few wonders use it too...
The point is, if my current chapter has decided that my fighting is 'balanced' at 700-800 units/squad, then why do I suddenly need 1.5-3x (or more!) that number if I want to play beyond the first floor of the spire or 8-9 provinces in the tournament?

Is that not a sudden & huge imbalance if my costs are skyrocketing well beyond what my chapter's natural research progression is allowing?
 

Iyapo1

Well-Known Member
@Alram
To be fair the event is over and the thread is dead. Still we are way off topic and a it is a bad habit to get into. I will stop adding.
 
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Iyapo1

Well-Known Member
I love it! It is beautiful...but I only got 9 artifacts so....bring on the FA! 2 KP is better than 1!


Edit: Math bad! I only got 8 artifacts so my pretty bird is level 9.
 
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