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    Your Elvenar Team

User Interface Second archmage

Legilost

Member
So I'm sure its been asked before but don't you think there should be two arch mages for a fellowship and only because if one flakes out then the group won't lose all the fellowship perks they worked so hard for if they have to start a new fellowship?
 

defiantoneks

Well-Known Member
couple of thoughts…

how often does this happen? meaning, totally flaked not saying a word or passing the torch to an existing Mage?
and if you're part of a FS where you suspect the AM is a flake… RUN!
 
A good Archimage(AM) and mages could get poached if a FS got whiny & disfunctional enough. I've seen it in FS chat where someone joins just to recruit and then leaves and goes back to their home FS. I would think a bigger and more common problem would be an AM that goes totally inactive. Either way it is probably time to find a new FS.
 

crackie

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, Buddy's #1 Fan
I think inactive archmage issue is probably quite common. Anyone can start a FS as we all know it's a player's market. There are more fellowships recruiting than players needing a fellowship. I just looked on Ceravyn. There are 573 pages of FS to scroll through with 8 FS a page. If I scroll to page 200, there are still tons of 1-person fellowships. So that's probably over 50% of FS are 1-person FS. How many of those are inactive? Probably a lot.

But no, I don't think you need 2 archmages to deal with this. Just contact support or find a different fellowship.
 

Darielle

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, and Buddy Fan Club Member
Aw ... I'd like to offer a different alternative to finding a different fellowship. Case in point, my fellowship, Thornwood. We're a great group, and the archmage really loves us. She's ill, and she asked me to be her second in command, to choose the course in her absence. Yes, she could have made me archmage, but she built this from scratch in 2018 and she can't bear to let go. She keeps thinking she'll beat this disease. I don't blame her; before she got ill she would fall on a sword for the group. I would rather keep her as AM and just run the place in her absence, and I've got a terrific team of mages to help toward that end. We can do anything any other group can do, and in many ways we do it better. We always get our 10 plus chests; we always make silver in spire and sometimes gold, and we finished 4th in the FA. Plus, our spire gold parties, during steel tourneys, are the most fun bash you can have, with kp prizes for songs, stories, and of course, making gold! Each mage has their own task and they do it well, from News Mage to Tourney Mage to AW Thread Mage to Spire Mage and more. Everyone does their job and everything runs smoothly.

We're recruiting for one more member now, and yes, I do worry about that black triangle next to the AM's name being a deterrent for many people. But I defy anyone to find a better, more welcoming, more well-run group than ours. We have 24 ACTIVE members. That's hard to find. So while I can understand the advice saying to find another group, I would also say that there are exceptions to every rule.

Some day, I may decide that enough is enough, and that we've waited all we can. But we are a LONG way from that now. For now, I hope my dear friend gets better and shows up one day to say, "I'm baaack. Let's get this show on the road!" I'll gladly give up the reins when that happens. Until then, I'll keep trying to fill that last slot with the right person, and hope that people give us a chance despite the black triangle. I make a good substitute for AM ... I live here, lol. I'll work my little heart out to make sure the group runs like clockwork. So anyway, like I said, there are always exceptions to the rule.
 

ajqtrz

Chef
Perhaps the problem could be addressed by simply having the AM appoint a "fall back" AM who would be the one to take over once the AM was gone for X amount of days (30 or 60 seem about right). The AM would simply lower all the Mages to "fellow" and then the first one he/she raises to Mage becomes the Second in command AND heir to the thrown, so to speak. He/she could then raise all the other mages back up and it would be done. To implement this the code would only need to note when the mages were raised to their mage level and in the event of the AM being gone, take the oldest mage and make them AM automatically while lowering the AM to Mage. No need to kick anybody, no need to contact support and no real harm done unless the first AM returns and wants the AM job back and the new AM refuses.

AJ
 

samidodamage

Buddy Fan Club member
That part I did not know about. I thought you couldn't get support to do that. Is it difficult?
I don't think so. They have a time frame the AM needs to be MIA before they'll replace, but that's about it. You submit a support ticket and they'll check the account activity and let you know what else you'll need to do.
I'd give them as much info as we had on the support ticket: how long we haven't seen the AM, who the Mages are and the player the group agrees should receive the extra work honor of the AM title. ;) :)
 

Lelanya

Scroll-Keeper
What an interesting thread this is.
Backstory: I am an Archmage of long standing. I have founded a few FSs in my time, run some for others, and opened one ( does it Ever stop at one?) - well let's call it the one - my heart home.

Share??
 

ajqtrz

Chef
I've been gaming for over twenty years and almost all the games I've played are city building with guilds, alliances, fellowships and the like. It appears to me that there is a certain personality that ALWAYS seems to get the joy of leading. I remember one game in which I was the second smallest player but, being willing to communicate a lot, constantly being there, AND having a vision for the team, I woke up one morning and found I had been raised to the leadership. Then everybody waited to see what I would do! I'm not sure if it was a joke due to my "bubbly and chattty" nature or they were serious. It took about a year to go from rank 69 to 1. LOL. My current fs worked the same way. I showed up. Got involved, got picked to handle the AM role while our AM had RL issues, and then....she came back, stayed a couple months, and left...me in charge. That was at least 3 years ago.

So, in my sometimes humble opinion, if you want to lead just be communicative, present and have a vision of where you want to go. If you lead they will follow.....sort of....well, like cats...if you have the right cat food and can run just fast enough the smell of said cat food might drag them along... ;)
AJ :D ;)
 
Aw ... I'd like to offer a different alternative to finding a different fellowship. Case in point, my fellowship, Thornwood. We're a great group, and the archmage really loves us. She's ill, and she asked me to be her second in command, to choose the course in her absence. Yes, she could have made me archmage, but she built this from scratch in 2018 and she can't bear to let go. She keeps thinking she'll beat this disease. I don't blame her; before she got ill she would fall on a sword for the group. I would rather keep her as AM and just run the place in her absence, and I've got a terrific team of mages to help toward that end. We can do anything any other group can do, and in many ways we do it better. We always get our 10 plus chests; we always make silver in spire and sometimes gold, and we finished 4th in the FA. Plus, our spire gold parties, during steel tourneys, are the most fun bash you can have, with kp prizes for songs, stories, and of course, making gold! Each mage has their own task and they do it well, from News Mage to Tourney Mage to AW Thread Mage to Spire Mage and more. Everyone does their job and everything runs smoothly.

We're recruiting for one more member now, and yes, I do worry about that black triangle next to the AM's name being a deterrent for many people. But I defy anyone to find a better, more welcoming, more well-run group than ours. We have 24 ACTIVE members. That's hard to find. So while I can understand the advice saying to find another group, I would also say that there are exceptions to every rule.

Some day, I may decide that enough is enough, and that we've waited all we can. But we are a LONG way from that now. For now, I hope my dear friend gets better and shows up one day to say, "I'm baaack. Let's get this show on the road!" I'll gladly give up the reins when that happens. Until then, I'll keep trying to fill that last slot with the right person, and hope that people give us a chance despite the black triangle. I make a good substitute for AM ... I live here, lol. I'll work my little heart out to make sure the group runs like clockwork. So anyway, like I said, there are always exceptions to the rule.
Nice to know there good stable FSs out there. Hope your AM gets to return and enjoy the FS she built.
Good leadership, that is AMs & Mages, really does make or break a FS, IMHO. The Forum and Wiki can help, but you have to know enough about the game to ask the right questions which newbies don't. The game should reward or at least acknowledge those that have kept it actively moving forward and mentored the new players.
I would suggest an honorary title of Alumni AM (or Senior Mage?) should be added for AMs that have been around for years and have reached minimum chapter ## but need or want to retire. The Alumni would retain their nonAM /normal Mage abilities and would be the automatic default/backup AM should the new AM step down, leave the FS, or go inactive for more than a few months (at least a month for vacations, etc, ...). Eventually a stable long lived FS could have 2 Alumni AM swapping the acting/active AM position if they wanted to.
The new Alumi AM would have earned the right to elevate a Mage to AM as a replacent. No support requests involved.
 
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Lelanya

Scroll-Keeper
Nice to know there good stable FSs out there. Hope your AM gets to return and enjoy the FS she built.
Good leadership, that is AMs & Mages, really does make or break a FS, IMHO. The Forum and Wiki can help, but you have to know enough about the game to ask the right questions which newbies don't. The game should reward or at least acknowledge those that have kept it actively moving forward and mentored the new players.
I would suggest an honorary title of Alumni AM (or Senior Mage?) should be added for AMs that have been around for years and have reached minimum chapter ## but need or want to retire. The Alumni would retain their nonAM /normal Mage abilities and would be the automatic default/backup AM should the new AM step down, leave the FS, or go inactive for more than a few months (at least a month for vacations, etc, ...). Eventually a stable long lived FS could have 2 Alumni AM swapping the acting/active AM position if they wanted to.
The new Alumi AM would have earned the right to elevate a Mage to AM as a replacent. No support requests involved.
Good suggestion, thanks. I haven't seen this proposed in a couple of years now, so it's past time to revisit this.
 
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