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    Your Elvenar Team

Help Skipping Squad Size Upgrades


I have a lovely new member in my FS who recently asked me a question about skipping particular items in the research panel. I honestly don't know because I haven't ever skipped any- didn't realize it was possible until now. Anyways, she asked me if she were to skip squad size upgrade 5 in chapter two- would it effect squad size upgrade 6? I'm just seeing now that that research is hanging up on it's own and I suppose it indeed does not need to be researched at all.

She also said she skipped city expansion one. Which wouldn't have any effect- she could just go back to it later if she wants since we all know how hard it is to get expansions once you progress. Well, assuming she can go back to it once passing through chapters?

Anyways, anyone have any answers on if skipping a squad size upgrade has any effects?


Enevhar Aldarion

Well-Known Member
This has been talked about a lot in other threads. Basically, the more Squad upgrades you do, the easier it is to fight and complete provinces, but the harder it is to fight in tournaments. Or not so much harder, but more costly in number of troops lost. Catering in tournaments also gets more expensive, the more upgrades you complete.

And yes, you can always go back and complete a research that was skipped.

But I am like you and have never skipped a research. I do not believe in leaving anything behind and I will adjust my play style to compensate.


Well-Known Member
No problem with skipping any optional tech, she can always complete them later.

In terms of chapter 2 and squad sizes though it can be crippling if she plans to combat on the world map. If she is getting goods from the fellowship so she can cater then it will have no impact on her.


Well-Known Member
No problem with skipping any optional tech, she can always complete them later.
The caveat to this being the ones in the guest race chapter may require guest race goods, so if you think there's a chance you might want them later, make enough extra guest goods to cover them. Otherwise you might have to rebuild (and maybe even level) the portal and buildings to finish it.


Thanks everyone for the responses. I have seen the debate over the squad size upgrade making the tournaments more costly etc, which I still don't fully understand why since my focus has been primarily to make sure I can complete provinces.


Yes, could someone please explain the differences. I prefer to cater, but do do some automatic fighting if I think I can get the right combination of troops.


Well-Known Member
Difficulty in fights is more the most part based on your squad size in the fight compared to the enemies squad size, not this is not number of units.

World map
More squad size techs increases the size of army you bring to a province. The enemy squad size is a function of your scouting strategy. So the more squads you have the easier the fights.

Catering on the world map is a function of the cost of scouting and the distance from town. Certain resources required at certain stages.

Difficulty is fixed as enemy squad size is a ratio of your own squad size.

Catering is a function of squad size tech (as advised by inno). So the larger your squad size the more costly to negotiate

The cost of combat is seen in terms of the time to replace the units lost. For example if a certain difficulty fight will see me lose 10% of my troops a person with 100 units per squad will lose 10 units while the person with 1000 units per squad will lose 100 units. If both are in the same chapter with identical set-ups the person with less squad size can replace those 10 units faster than the person needing to replace 100 units.


Well-Known Member
My short answer -- never, ever take a squad upgrade that can possibly be skipped over / passed up and still let you continue on the tech tree.

Longer answer --
In theory, map battles are unlimited. Though after clearing 457 map provinces one doesn't get additional city expansion plots. Your squad upgrades help you for those 457 x 8 battles (less any you choose to cater). So 3600, give or take, battles that are made easier / winnable. Continuing to scout and clear is still a very good idea, since you get KP and relics, as well as the completed provinces helping various wonder bonuses.

The real kicker -- those irreversible upgrades have a negative impact on tourney play in the current system. Loss rates, as Mykan beat me to describing, are pretty stable, regardless of squad size. The difficulty is the replacing troops lost while the tourney timer counts down. More losses = less troops = fewer battles = fewer goodies / points. In addition, the larger squad size adds to the catering costs, even if one doesn't battle much this quickly becomes unsustainable amounts of goods.

It isn't out of the realm of possibility to get to the point where one can comfortably do 16, or more, tourney provinces a week to various rounds. Will use 10 for round numbers and easy math. 10 provinces x 4 battles x 5 rounds = 200 battles a week ... every single week. In about 5 months, your battles will have caught up to the total on map.
In a year or so with consistent tourney play, even figuring in the different number of troops (since tourney squads aren't usually a full squad size) you will have passed up the troops used on the map battles.


I don't think you can skip them. All techs need to be finished in a chapter to advance to the next.


Active Member
The difficulty is the replacing troops lost while the tourney timer counts down. More losses = less troops = fewer battles = fewer goodies / points.
Agree this can be problematic. It comes down to your strategy especially in tournys - do you cater or fight? My personal preference is to fight. So, I have 4 armories and only focus on upgrading AW that support military - needles, martial mon, flying acad, etc. etc. I can swiftly replace troops. I haven't skipped any research and don't really see where's it hurt me at all. Again, everyone has their own way to play and there isn't a one size fits all.