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    Your Elvenar Team

Spire frustrations ~

quin629

Well-Known Member
No, if anyone can do it, then there would be 200 fellowships getting Gold in the Spire every week on every server, instead of maybe 20 per server. Do you know how to look in-game to see how many achieved Gold on your server once the Spire ends for the week? I don't remember if you can even see this in the mobile app, but in the browser version, you click on your rank number, which opens up the Rankings screen. Then you click on the Spire tab, go to the first page of fellowships, and then see how few get the 1330 points for Gold.

I play in browser so I do see the numbers. But 10-chest FSs used to be seen in exactly the same way - impossible, near-mythical - until enough players decided to make it happen, and found they could. Maybe they had to revamp their style of play, or what/how they produced. Their choice. When more and more players chose to emphasize tourneys, 10 chests became very common. Players can choose to do the same with the Spire, or choose not to.

And, again, gold spire FSs seem to be recruiting just as much as all other FSs - that is, pretty much all the time. Not from some Spire-related burnout. Just from pesky real life getting in the way of our gaming. So the opportunities exist to join a FS that is already gold. And even more opportunities to join FSs that are close to gold and are asking for more like-minded players to join.
 

Darielle

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, and Buddy Fan Club Member
@muffy. Tackle it from a different angle.
Maybe try looking at it in reverse? For example "What things would my city be missing if the Spire and everything that comes with it went away tomorrow?" Assume everything that is either only available in the Spire or greatly enhanced by rewards gotten in the Spire went away or were severely reduced:
#1 Diamonds (lol, @crackie): Spire is what lets everyone get a premium city without spending a dime. <I stole that line from someone else on here, but now I don't remember who :rolleyes:
It's the diamonds given as both individual rewards and FS rewards as well as other rewards that allow more of other activities (like crafting) that also have diamonds given as rewards.
#2 Crafting supplies: way fewer Spell Fragments and Combining Catalysts. On SF's players would be limited to Moonstone Library, disenchanting, or the tiny amount of these given as event rewards. CC's are as limited if not more so than SF's. Most players already produce solely CC's in their MA's even with other sources. Those other sources (some event bldgs, AW's) For those who struggle with having enough pet food: think about not being able to craft it when it does show up because you don't have the needed ingredients for the recipe.
#3 Magic Houses and Workshops: You may not be getting many, but these going away as direct rewards added to the disappearance of diamonds directly from Spire. Couple with less crafting so fewer Mystery Object chances at diamond rewards and the only way you'd get a premium city without waiting a decade would be by spending real money.
#4 Temporary Military Boost Bldgs: no more Dwarven Armorers, but also less ability to keep crafting the other military boost bldgs resulting in more expensive tournaments/map encounters for fighters as well as for the more common hybrid cities who mix cater/fighting in a variety of ways. For me, this also translates to fewer supplies. I tend to use these bldgs as additional 'supply instants' after they expire. It's usually to push through a few more troops, completing the vicious circle, lol! I expect vicious circles; it's fun trying to work them into standard game play, lol!
#5 Teleport Spells: Way fewer of these; just a few from event rewards if there were no Spire. These allow me to play the game in a way that fits for me, my schedule and my life. Being able to swap bldgs back and forth from inventory based on my needs: wonderful. Being able to mold the game to fit my life instead of the other way around: priceless!
I could go on, lol! Cities just reaching the guest races need those extra PP's and the Trading Station that makes them; they don't get any until they unlock Ch6, so no stockpiles available. They are booby prizes to me: I think I have enough to get through any guest race chapter for the next 5 chapters at least...
With cities running on no houses, I've recently smiled when I win a coin rain in the Spire, lol. The coin rain purge of the July 2022 FA convinced me I never have enough coin rains! I spent hundreds of them, and even though I've got hundreds left, I'll not take them for granted, no sir, lol!

Edit to add: Consistency is key afaic. I've been tracking my diamond winnings since March 2022. 2 cities, one in weekly Gold Spire FS, the other in a Silver that's now getting Gold every 3-4 weeks. Some weeks/months have been slim, some have been outrageously high. The week of 7/18-7/25/22 for example I won 3245 diamonds. The ~1month from 6/15-7/11/22 I won not much more than that one week at 3870. The average monthly diamonds won as of Aug 23rd is 5583/month. Split equally between cities, that would be 2791 per city, but obviously the Gold Spire one actually generates more diamonds.
Thank you for making this list. I couldn't agree more.

Muffy, I know it's difficult when you hit a dry spell, but I don't believe it has anything to do with your level. I'm nearing the end of Chapter 17 and I won a magic residence just a month ago. I've hit my dry spells too, but what made me realize just how much I was gaining, even when I wasn't hitting the "big" prizes, was writing everything (and I do mean EVERYTHING) that I won in the spire for an entire month. I don't write what I spent because I virtually never spend diamonds in the spire. I just fight or negotiate without spending diamonds except on the big boss ... and only if I'm guaranteed to beat him with 25 diamonds. (Yeah, I'm cheap, lol.)

If you're making it to silver each time, then a month's worth of diamonds is at least 700 and probably more, because you're bound to get some in the chests. I'd be surprised if you weren't making at least 900. And as Sami said, think of all the ccs and spell frags you'd miss if you never spired. The MA orb gets filled and you get a lot of stuff with those. At the end of the week, you're getting tons of 5-hour time instants, too. They come in really handy.

Like I said, total up everything you won over the course of the month, including the 900 diamonds or more, and then ask yourself, "Do I REALLY miss the goods and the troops I lost? If I could buy them back with the 900 diamonds and all the stuff I won in exchange, would I do it?" I can bet my bottom dollar that you wouldn't. You might not even remember the goods or troops, and you probably wouldn't miss them.
 

crackie

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, Buddy's #1 Fan
When more and more players chose to emphasize tourneys, 10 chests became very common.
It only became more common because they changed the tournament in Oct 2020. EN server gets to be live guinea pig for a lot of major changes first (they're getting chap 20 first too). My 2nd city, which is on EN, was enjoying the new changes for several weeks before my main city so I was lamenting that little street urchin of a city was collecting blueprints before my more effective main city, which only got 8 chests. Once the new format came, we were able to get 10th chest here too. The new system made it easier to get 10th chest for everyone. Just look at the FS overall graph on Elvenstats and find Sept 2020. You'll usually see an uptick to mid-Oct 2020.

And people on the forum, and the Facebook group, seem to make it like Gold Spire fellowships are easy to find and make and that there are hundreds of them per server, when that it very far from the truth. Even after the addition of the Perks, the US Arendyll server still averages under 20 fellowships making Gold in a given week, there were 19 last week, out of hundreds of active fellowships. What is worse are the ones who somehow got into Gold fellowships on multiple servers and then act like anyone can do it. And worst of all are the few players who have alts in the same Gold fellowship, stealing spots from other legit players.
Alts aren't stealing anything because nobody is entitled to anything. Can't steal what was never yours. ;)

Gold Spire FS are always recruiting, just like everyone else. If someone really wants to get into a Gold FS, just start knocking on doors, even if it looks full. I get recruited all the time and when I look up their FS, it's got 25 players. Hmmm, right? Someone's always leaving or they have alts to move. Make yourself known that you want to join. Get yourself an impressive Elvenstats profile that no one can turn down. Or...start your own Gold FS from scratch, like I did. I don't think it's that hard to start a Gold FS from scratch. I tested my thesis and I was right. It only took me 2 months and that was on EN where I didn't know anyone. I think it'll be easier if I tried it in the US because I wouldn't have to raid the prenatal ward for as many recruits since I know a lot more people here with established cities.
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
Alts aren't stealing anything because nobody is entitled to anything. Can't steal what was never yours. ;)

Gold Spire FS are always recruiting, just like everyone else. If someone really wants to get into a Gold FS, just start knocking on doors, even if it looks full. I get recruited all the time and when I look up their FS, it's got 25 players. Hmmm, right? Someone's always leaving or they have alts to move. Make yourself known that you want to join. Get yourself an impressive Elvenstats profile that no one can turn down. Or...start your own Gold FS from scratch, like I did. I don't think it's that hard to start a Gold FS from scratch. I tested my thesis and I was right. It only took me 2 months and that was on EN where I didn't know anyone. I think it'll be easier if I tried it in the US because I wouldn't have to raid the prenatal ward for as many recruits since I know a lot more people here with established cities.

I would rather not join a fellowship that is already willing to cheat by having alts in them. People willing to cheat in a game like Elvenar are sad people with empty lives and I hate to think what they do in things that really matter in life.
 

TomatoeHu

Sheets of Color
diamonds.png
 

crackie

Chef, Scroll-Keeper, Buddy's #1 Fan
I would rather not join a fellowship that is already willing to cheat by having alts in them. People willing to cheat in a game like Elvenar are sad people with empty lives and I hate to think what they do in things that really matter in life.
I don’t have any alts, but I don’t let people who do bother me. For the most part, the prizes are subpar and sometimes laughable, so if you go all out for anything, it’s rarely about the prizes. Second, there is no equal footing in this game anyway. If you are a chapter 3 city, you are thrown into the same ranking pool as the big dogs in chapter 19 in both overall rank and tourney rank. That’s not an equal fight! Then if you go by leagues, it’s down to who has the most diamonds to spend. Some people need to be king of the charts or win everything to be motivated to play and that is good on them. Some of them keeps the lights on to maintain their crown and that is good for me. But whatever they choose to do doesn’t impact my city because the only person I am competing against is always just me. Even group events like FA. I am still only able to contribute what my city can contribute so don’t fret what the other guys are doing. Figure out what is the largest shantytown I can build. If other people’s alts made me work harder, then I just got even better as a player without using them.
 

MaidenFair

Chef - Head Philologist
Now the past 3 weeks you are lucky to get a DA . You don’t get a Magic anything unless you are newer to the Spire .. and the same with the teleports …fewer and fewer are seen. Which to me is really really insane … we are coming upon another FA..people need those to have room to play it
I'm sorry you're feeling frustrated, muffy., but it is just the randomness of the rewards. :) I've gotten either 2 or 3 purple chests this week and got teleports out of all of them, and I have 6 Dwarven Armorers in my inventory from this chapter alone, which I've only been in 4 weeks. (Of course, I don't need that many teleports and DAs just rot in my inventory, so those are not the rewards I would have chosen, but them's the breaks.) I got a Magic Workshop and a Residence (...or was it two?) in my last chapter.
I guess I just don’t see the point in making something to help people be successful then take it away.
I mainly play the Spire for diamonds, although I've also been able to evolve several really useful buildings, and my city is entirely blue thanks to the Spire. Rest assured, they haven't taken anything away. You'll start getting those things again soon too.
 

SummerAmbrosia

Active Member
I don't have a problem with the spire at the moment.
However, when I do decide to go up a level I'm going to be in trouble. I don't expect to reach the top.
I've been used to getting to the top, but I'm going to be troubled about my choice to park and be a merchant/trader when I level up.
What's happening now is that I have major good luck, most of the time. This time though, I got one chest. It's very unusual for that to happen. I usually get all of the chests.
Actually, all along my journey I've had incredible luck.
To the OP you probably know more about this game than I do, but as Maiden Fair said you'll start getting good things again.
I hope that you do.
Much luck to you:).
 

tiG23

Active Member
for anyone thinking a gold spire FS wouldn't even think about you, if you can already do to the Frog Boss and play the tourney, you are just moments away from being able to reach the top. Last year I had 2 chap 4 cities in gold spire fs and made another not long ago and did the same thing. Now 4 cities under Woodelves in gold.
I knew what I could do, I told them when I applied and just left it in the air. Many more will give you a chance than you think. I will warn AMs and players too, the glitches in Elvenstats are starting to really matter.
 

muffy.

Chef - Scroll-Keeper - Chandelier Swinger - EAA
Thank you everyone …. Awesome words of encouragement…. You guys are the best !!!!
I relayed all your info to my peeps …19 outta 25 played … 8 topped…I even got a Magic House at the Gateway :oops: lol **inserts foot in mouth** :eek:
But for reals …your encouraging words made all the difference. Not just for me but for entire FS. Thank you so much !
From this day forward I will never lose faith in the Elvenar Gods again ~
… just when I thought I could stop going to EAA ~
~*~ lights a candle
 

Cleo7311

Active Member
I only hit the spire hard for needed artifacts - It could be ages before bear artifacts appear again - has anyone counted up just how many event building artifact types there are? I have over 20 in one city that I haven't sold off yet. With six week rotations, we may never see the list start over again. Most of my poor bears are stuck at about L4.
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
I only hit the spire hard for needed artifacts - It could be ages before bear artifacts appear again - has anyone counted up just how many event building artifact types there are? I have over 20 in one city that I haven't sold off yet. With six week rotations, we may never see the list start over again. Most of my poor bears are stuck at about L4.

The original Bear artifact has been in the crafting rotation for a long time and the Autumn event starting next week has the usual conversion recipe of two new bear artifacts for one old one.

As for the Spire rotation, after about another 8 months, every artifact we have seen, including upcoming ones between now and then, will have been in the Spire. helya has hinted that changes are coming, so maybe it will change from single artifacts to Tomes that have multiple artifacts to choose from.
 

Genefer

Well-Known Member
Edit to add: Consistency is key afaic. I've been tracking my diamond winnings since March 2022. 2 cities, one in weekly Gold Spire FS, the other in a Silver that's now getting Gold every 3-4 weeks. Some weeks/months have been slim, some have been outrageously high. The week of 7/18-7/25/22 for example I won 3245 diamonds. The ~1month from 6/15-7/11/22 I won not much more than that one week at 3870. The average monthly diamonds won as of Aug 23rd is 5583/month. Split equally between cities, that would be 2791 per city, but obviously the Gold Spire one actually generates more diamonds.

Wow!!! I've never tracked my diamonds, but now I think I will, because that is incredible. Do you include only the climb and FS rewards or diamonds from genies too?

I totally agree the Spire is a resource same as the Tournament and it is to the players advantage to participate.

I have observed waves of specific rewards and then months with nothing particularly special, but not at the same times in each city.

I just realized I have been playing this game for 22 months. I have 3 cities that I actively play, and between the 3 I have won 41 Magic Buildings.
 

samidodamage

Buddy Fan Club member
Do you include
I include everything. I started by tracking my diamond expenditures and it's evolved into both incoming and outgoing diamonds. Everything except Goddess of Wishes and the occasional diamonds from the daily gift on mobile connects back to Spire in some fashion anyway. My total diamonds won would be severely curtailed if those were the only 2 sources of free diamonds in the game anyway, lol. Genies are won there; crafting ingredients are won there as well. There is a consistent, essentially guaranteed gain of 400 diamonds/week for me (275 for the Gold FS; 125 for the Silver). Most of the balance comes from the Mystery Object in Crafting. There is a huge caveat, though:
I don't think I'm the average player.
I was playing the Spire from the original launch. At that point you could win an unlimited number of copies of the Moonstone Set. I saw the rationale about how the Spire is the tool that allows you to have a premium city without spending real money and understood it (even if I was still gob-smacked about what I saw as an exorbitant cost at the time). So, I collected loads of Moonstone Sets as I learned the Spire and the symbiosis between it and Crafting. Both cities have 10+ full sets placed and both cities have more of all the bldgs in inventory. I have the space for them because I've gone to a 'no houses' arrangement using high pop/square event bldgs. That same strategy also means I carry the max culture bonus without using culture spells. Both cities run fine with 2 Magic Workshops; I use supply spells once or twice/wk.
Those Moonstone Set bldgs generate excessive amounts of fragments and CC's that allow me to craft anything I want anytime I want. I'm carrying inventory of 1.5 million+ SF's and 1200+ CC's in both cities. During FA's I craft everything that doesn't take BP's/diamonds/etc. for all 4 recipe rotations daily. In the Silver FS (in Gold we usually do one path to the flag - done, but I still take that week to craft everything I see) I use Sips of Clarity regularly during FA's to get even more recipes. During that week I usually flip the Mystery Object for a chance at 500 diamonds ~10-12 times per city. There was one FA where I saved them all up to the end and got a big fat zero diamonds from one city, lol, so there are definitely poor reward streaks, lol! I flip the MO less often most other weeks, but it's still likely higher than many cities can sustain.
Note that my tracking began after they changed the Mystery Object reward windows and reduced the overall probability of getting diamonds as a reward. I really wish I'd known what it was before that happened...
 
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