What Do You Consider the Best Use of Population and Culture?

[DeletedUser20951]

So, I was ruminating about how frequently I come across references to players having too many workshops, manufactories, and armories, then it occurred to me that I'm a wee bit puzzled over what's considered the best to put your pop and culture towards. Unless someone asks that I take a look at their city, I pay very little attention to the cities of others, and even while hunting for a culture building to polish, I don't really see what else is there.

 

[Ashrem]

Never give them a thought except for when there isn't enough of one of them. They are a resource I require, like mana and supplies. The price I have to pay (in space and coin) for getting the troops and goods I want.

 

[DeletedUser20951]

I feel like I'm missing something huge, like the forest for the trees, but perhaps I'm underestimating the space allocations for future guest races? I only build the Wonders that I believe are most beneficial for my own style, yet those don't need pop/culture. *taps chin thoughtfully*

There are the set buildings, which I haven't gone after at this point in the game, but they're another that only require room.

Wait, is it as simple as how spendy the late stage upgrades are?

 

[Ashrem]

Space is the only limited resource. If you have the patience to stop every now-and-then to focus on leveling wonders, they can have a huge effect. Put a couple of months of KP into a golden abyss, and you can half a 3x3 giving thousands of population without a culture requirement. If you can get into a FS that does lots of tournaments and does KP swap threads, those snowball, as each other person's AW you pump KP into instead of your own increases the chance of getting a bunch of extras back.

From my point of view, Population and Culture are not desirable, they are a drain. They are the price I pay to do what I want to do, and I begrudge them every square they take, constantly looking for higher efficiency.

 

[DeletedUser20951]

If you have the patience to stop every now-and-then to focus on leveling wonders, they can have a huge effect.

Leveling Wonders is probably my (second) favorite part (hoarding goods would win out if I had to pick one or the other), and contributes to my constructing the bare minimum of guest race structures, since I now look forward to stalling in the tech tree and pumping KP into them.

 

[Kekune]

So, I was ruminating about how frequently I come across references to players having too many workshops, manufactories, and armories, then it occurred to me that I'm a wee bit puzzled over what's considered the best to put your pop and culture towards.

I'd say something is "too many" when it causes you to be short on something else you need. A lot of that is about play style, but everything is a trade-off. If you tell me you can't make enough t2 goods and you've got t3 out the wazoo, I think you have too many t3 factories (or event buildings).

I also see players who won't sell things off to make space for upgrades, so they're stuck with a lot of inefficient little buildings rather than fewer upgraded ones. I've sometimes referred to that as "too many", but that's a different problem.

Leveling Wonders is probably my (second) favorite part

I've begun to enjoy this, too.

 

[bkbajb]

Every chapter gives you a different challenge when it comes to, what you need. As I have grown (In chapter 11) I have reduced the number of residences and workshops because of AW's and event buildings. I agree with Ashrem, leveling your AW's does help, and I have built them all through chapter 10 except Enar's. That one too me does nothing because I have over scouted to gain expansions and it will not provide me with anything at this point. Coins are not an issue, I buy KP daily. Supplies and Mana are my biggest although devine seeds will be taking over shortly.

 

[SoggyShorts]

perhaps I'm underestimating the space allocations for future guest races?

20 expansions will get you though guest races 8-14, far less if you ignore the quests and use portal profits.

I come across references to players having too many workshops, manufactories, and armories

Let's break this down a little

Too many workshops:
1. The wholesaler gives very low returns so if you are consistently dumping excess supplies there to buy goods, you'd be better off selling a workshop and building another factory to make the goods directly.
2. Many players think that they "don't have room" to place the Endless Excavation, Tome of Secrets, and Prosperity Towers. This is because they don't understand that in almost every case* these wonders at level 1 actually produce more supplies per square than workshops since they don't require any culture or pop.
3. I suspect that very few players use as many PoP spells as they could sustainably use. Yes, a stockpile of spells is useful for the dragon abbey wonder, and or perhaps for disenchanting, but there are plenty of players(inc myself) who have 1,000+ PoP spells in the bank and don't use any PoP despite getting 10-30 every week from the tournament. A workshop with a PoP has the production of 3 workshops but only has the pop&culture costs of 1. I think PoP are very underutilized and many players would be better off (efficiency-wise) using a few each week and dropping a workshop)

Too many factories:
1. If a player has non-boosted factories they could replace those with boosted and end up with fewer total factories with higher total production. This does require trading partners though.
2. There is a point where a player can use so much space for factories that they can no longer fit many chapter buildings into their city. These players are generally producing far more goods than needed to progress through the tech tree, but wish to maintain ranking and tournament ability both of which would decrease by allocating more room for guest race buildings.

Too many Armories:
The main purpose of armories is to allow you more time between log-ins before your barracks completes training and sits idle. Orc production is usually a secondary concern and square for square craftable orc nests are better at it.
Really it is impossible to know if another player has too many unless you know how often they log in. Personally, I like to maintain a 12h training queue so I use this handy little calculator to figure out what combination of armories, SSS and DB wonders I need to maintain it. www.tinyurl/trainingcalc

*special cases:
The ToS isn't better than a worshop if your scout times are much longer than 2 days(unless you levelled the ToS)
The PT isn't better than a workshop if you only collect from it once a day
The EE isnt' better than a workshop if you make 1h bread 24 hours a day
None of them are better than a workshop with a PoP active

 

[dikke ikke]

I guess 2 WS for every armory, give you enough supplies to play the game, if you use time instants to speed up troop production, you will also need some supply instants from time to time. I cannot say i have too much of anything, only that i have not enough space. Every level there are 2 new AW's, but in the later levels you only get 1 extension in the tech three and I am maxed out for free expansions (hit the 458 border) so i have to save as much diamonds as i can to 'buy' extensions and that goes very very very slow

 

[DeletedUser20951]

Ah, excellent replies (I understand 'em, I think)! Since I struggle with mathematics and numbers (give me a pen and paper and I can figure out equations, but it takes total, ridiculous focus on my part), most of the more advanced strategies go right over my head and I was worried I was blind to a giant game aspect.

 

[SoggyShorts]

I guess 2 WS for every armory, give you enough supplies to play the game

I don't understand this- your consumption of supplies per day for military is based on how fast your barracks is and is not affected by your number of armories,.
If you mean for orc production, orc nests are far more efficient for that purpose.

 

[dikke ikke]

To keep up with the 'big dogs'in the tourney, i try to make 4000 points in the tourney every week, giving me between 200 and 500 points in general score. I can not make all the troops i consume for that only with armories, orc nests ... I need to use time instants, producing troops takes supplies anyway but when i use time instants i use more supplies and playing the game for over 3 years now learned me that 2 WS for every armory together with 16 factories (4 t1, 5 t2, 4 t3, 1 t4, 1t5 and 1 t6) keeps things more or less balanced. In the future when my bulwork AW has been upgraded enough, i might drop 1 armory and replace 2 WS by AW's that produce supplies. This will also allow me to have less residences, everything to save precious space

 

[Kekune]

I suspect that very few players use as many PoP spells as they could sustainably use.

Thanks for pointing this out. I've always felt the need to stockpile them for use "in a pinch", but that's really less of an issue now. Instants are common, I'm not building as frantically as I did when my city was smaller, and I get more in the tourney than I used to. I think I'll try this. I've been planning to sell one and build the EE but was annoyed about having an odd number of workshops, so I'll sell 2 and make up the gap with PoP.

 

[SoggyShorts]

To keep up with the 'big dogs'in the tourney, i try to make 4000 points in the tourney every week, giving me between 200 and 500 points in general score. I can not make all the troops i consume for that only with armories, orc nests ... I need to use time instants, producing troops takes supplies anyway but when i use time instants i use more supplies and playing the game for over 3 years now learned me that 2 WS for every armory together with 16 factories (4 t1, 5 t2, 4 t3, 1 t4, 1t5 and 1 t6) keeps things more or less balanced. In the future when my bulwork AW has been upgraded enough, i might drop 1 armory and replace 2 WS by AW's that produce supplies. This will also allow me to have less residences, everything to save precious space

All of this makes sense except that there is no connection between armories and workshops as you describe.
Armories do not consume more supplies when making troops, regardless of whether you use instants.

In other words, if you added 5 more armories your supplies would not change unless you use the armories to make orcs.

The fact that you have 4 armories now and find 8 workshops to fit your city is pure luck, the 2 are not related.

 

[SoggyShorts]

. I've always felt the need to stockpile them for use "in a pinch"

I have far too many instants of ALL kinds that I'm saving for a rainy day that will never come.

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

I have far too many instants of ALL kinds that I'm saving for a rainy day that will never come.

BRB, starting a new fellowship "Hoarders United"...

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

Too many workshops:

Soggy didn't mention quest cycling. I know, some people don't like it, but it's a part of the game mechanics (for now), so one can choose to use it or not. With repeatable 200K coins/2x 3hr WS productions generating 13K supplies you can cover all your supplies needs with a dozen L1 workshops that would take tiny amounts of space, pop and culture comparing to the quest production. And you can even tear them down and rebuild as necessary, because L1 doesn't require any material build time.

I wouldn't recommend going pure play L1 WS only, for variety of reasons. Unless you're doing some hardcore build But augmenting your core leveled up WS with cycling allows you to get by with far fewer such core WS. This probably works better a bit later in the chapters when you can consistently get multiples of 200K coins every 3 hours. Cycling requires a lot of clicking tough, so can get annoying.

I still haven't build Prosperity Towers because I am consistently capped on supplies, and that's with accelerated L25 Barracks working 24/7 (among other things)

 

[SoggyShorts]

Soggy didn't mentioned quest cycling.

Aside from being the digital equivalent of dragging your junk through broken glass, yes, cycling quests by choice is an option.

 

[Deleted User - 3932582]

Aside from being the digital equivalent of dragging your junk through broken glass, yes, cycling quests by choice is an option.

You mean, comparing to getting 50 beverages for a single badge in the Fellowship Adventure? Got it

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Aside from being the digital equivalent of dragging your junk through broken glass, yes, cycling quests by choice is an option.

Much quicker and less painful to cycle if you play on mobile.