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    Your Elvenar Team

Winter Magic Event Feedback

  • Thread starter DeletedUser4194
  • Start date

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
I don't see any reason to keep it since I have level 10 Panda which is almost the same. T2 inventory is pretty ho hum anyway.

Panda is a 48-hour collection cycle and Gingerbread is 24-hour, but I have both out. :)

And maybe tier 2 is not a big deal where you are located for trade on your servers, but where I am on Arendyll, the tier 2 goods are the hardest to get of the three tiers, and past events that people seemed to like more, such as the one with the Krarak and Kirit set buildings that give tier 2 goods, were not nice to me at all for getting those set buildings, so crystal and scrolls have always been the lowest of my nine goods. I am happy to have one Gingerbread at level 10 and another at level 6, eventually to be level 8 after the next FA. I really wanted them for the crystal production, though scrolls are not a problem now that I have four almost complete Moonstone Library sets from the Spire. :)

And I am looking forward to whichever event later this year will have the evolving building that does the same thing for tier 3 goods that the Mermaid does for tier 1 and Gingerbread for tier 2.

I do also have to say that if these buildings did not include population, I would have a much harder time keeping them around. The pop is what makes them into "worth having" to me.
 

Crow Last Elf

Well-Known Member
...I doubt we will ever see a "skip quest" option, as they will probably claim it would mess up the coding for the reward system or something.

Maybe they could do something "radical" like have an option on the Scout, Research and the more time-consuming of the MA quests to collect the three reward chests from visiting your neighbors, which can be done by every player, even within a day or two of creating a city. ..@Fairy Dust If you think the devs would be interested in this idea, could you pass it along? :)

Using the 3 reward chest from visiting neighbours is a good idea. It also involves planning/strategy and impulse control for those of us who like to give NH at the same time everyday.

The normal quest line that helps you progress through the chapters allows you to cancel, maybe the coding for the event would not be too different. Whatever the approach, it's the idea of eliminating quests that are extremely time-consuming or resource-consuming for a particular player rather than having the developers eliminate the quests that are extremely difficult for some but not all to complete with reasonable effort/resources.
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
The normal quest line that helps you progress through the chapters allows you to cancel, maybe the coding for the event would not be too different. Whatever the approach, it's the idea of eliminating quests that are extremely time-consuming or resource-consuming for a particular player rather than having the developers eliminate the quests that are extremely difficult for some but not all to complete with reasonable effort/resources.

Sort of. There are maybe one or two story quests per chapter that have the option built-in to cancel, but to cancel any of the rest, you have to fully complete the research for that chapter and complete the first research for the next chapter before cancelling becomes an option for the rest of the story quests. And the repeating quests, and the old FA quest system, were built to let you cancel because each quest will come around again if you keep cancelling. I don't know if that could be ported into the event system, especially with the "random" quest design. Plus, something like this would take away from their diamond sales to those impulsive and impatient players who cannot wait. Those players are the source of a large amount of income for any free-to-play/pay-to-win game.
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
Pro - even without a huge amount of effort, I collected 14 artifacts and 13 buildings, so 27 grand prizes total. Qualifier on use of time - I am in chapter 15, so when I am sitting around for a few days waiting to collect the sentient goods needed to complete research or upgrade buildings, I had plenty of time to put into the event quests. I am sure the same is true for anyone in chapter 12+ and working with sentient goods.

Con - this new system definitely did what they wanted in limiting people getting too many of a daily prize. I do not think I got more than two of any single daily prize, maybe three in the first week once, when I was still on the normal quests and had a lot more ribbons to spend. And of the daily prize buildings I really wanted at least one of, I managed three out of the six or seven I really liked. In the previous system, I would have probably gotten one of each. And between the two days of wishing wells, I think I got a single well.

Pro - I look at the big events as a challenge to either complete the building set in past events or to complete at least one of the evolving building in more recent events. And starting with the Phoenix event, they have given me that challenge, which I have complete to varying levels since that first one.

Con - the shuffle system. I may have averaged one shuffle per day of the event, maybe. I know I had days, even before reaching the lower ribbon awards of the bonus quests, where I did not get a single shuffle, and a couple of days I got two or three shuffles. This goes with my previous Con of the limit on the number of a daily prize we can win. Either the system needs to be modified to auto-shuffle after you get the daily prize or they need to reduce the number of prize boxes from 16 to 10 or 12 for better odds at both the daily and the shuffle.

Pro - the event is over, so now I can start ignoring the threads about it and not have to see all the complaining and griping and whining. And yes, I do voice complaints, but I keep them reasonable, not hysterical. The fastest way be ignored by the mods and devs is to go ballistic or overreact about something.
 

DeletedUser2870

Guest
If you had a meaningful number of hammers (say, 100+), 1.65 average would be extremely low if all 3 outcomes are equally likely; I'd be pretty unhappy about that. Given that draw results are coming from a server, it is theoretically possible that probabilities are adjusted based on player profile, but I have no personal experience with that. Not in this particular case at least.
Define 'meaningful number of hammers'.
I managed to get my building fully evolved, so I needed 17 grand prizes to reach that 9th evolving artifact, at 50 ribbons each.
It took me 204 hammers to get there (So ok, my average is 1.67, but I like working in units of 5, 0.5, 0.05 etc). Granted, I had a pretty large number (37) of those bloody reshuffles which basically grants a free hammer, but it meant that even with the special event building granting additional ribbons each time I collected I was WELL into the 'bonus' quests before I hit that 9th evolution.
And yes, I am extremely unhappy about that average, but it's not unexpected. I've got spreadsheets going way back with event results and with the exception of 2 events I ALWAYS score significantly lower than pure chance would have it. It's one reason I just HATE it when everything is random. It's why one won't find me in a casino playing slotmachines or roulette, but may find me playing blackjack or poker for instance.
 

Dominionofgod

Thinker of Ideas
I actually liked a good bit of this event. The new prize system was a little bit interesting. More or less like a lottery scratch off. Which is a lot easier then having to pay attention to the currency number on each of the three chests every round like in the last several events. It was also a lot quicker if your using all your currency on a single day, which is a big bonus to me. The only issue on that was having to click for the bricks after that. That completely killed any time saved.

As for the quests, i see mostly the same complaints. Some of which are unfounded. Ppl arnt a fan of the random quests. Which i understand myself, it is annoying since we are used to being able to prepare ahead of time thanks to beta testing. But i also recognize that beta testing was never meant to give us a cheat sheet on the live servers. And the randomization is a way to try and counter that fact.

The quest repitition is also annoying, but understandable when you think about it. There were a lot of quests the ppl wanted taken out. From scouting, to 1 and 2 day productions, and many others. ( i cant recall all of them off the top of my head. Iv typed them out for last events feedback tho. So its floating around somewhere). But removing all those quests means the pool of quests left are much smaller. - Then there addition complaints reguarding time productions and the random quest factor. Again, understandable. Can be annoying waking up and getting a 'produce 9h' quest. Or when its time to log off for the night, you get a bunch of 'produce 15 min' quests. So i do get that. But as such, the main quest line had no time prodctions. It was altered simply to produce xx amount of goods. - When you combine the fact that a bunch of quests were removed, and that all the 'proced xmin or xhours' became a single quest, the remaining pool is incredibly small. And it makes sense that the less there is in the pool, the more repition we are going to see. There are only so many little things that they can add for quests to try and balance it out.
 

Dominionofgod

Thinker of Ideas
I also want to add that last event i made the request of changing a quest slightly. It was the 'solve 5 encounters or 25 tourney encounters'. While a understandable quest, i felt that 1 encounter to 5 tourney encounters was problematic. I felt that 1 encounter should = 1 tourney province or more specifically, solve 1 encounter or solve 4 tourney encounters.

A seemingly small and simple change, 5 to 4. But it really made a difference to me. I did not have the same problems i was having when it was 5. So thank you for changing that!
 

WolfSinger

Well-Known Member
I also want to add that last event i made the request of changing a quest slightly. It was the 'solve 5 encounters or 25 tourney encounters'. While a understandable quest, i felt that 1 encounter to 5 tourney encounters was problematic. I felt that 1 encounter should = 1 tourney province or more specifically, solve 1 encounter or solve 4 tourney encounters.

A seemingly small and simple change, 5 to 4. But it really made a difference to me. I did not have the same problems i was having when it was 5. So thank you for changing that!

I pointed that one out a couple of times last time as well - with a full explanation of why a 4 to 1 ratio was the better way to go because of the tourney and the spire layout. I was thrilled when I got the first related quest this time and saw that change had been made - kudos to the devs for listening to the players on this one.
 

DeletedUser3468

Guest
And I am looking forward to whichever event later this year will have the evolving building that does the same thing for tier 3 goods that the Mermaid does for tier 1 and Gingerbread for tier 2.

This is the only part of your post that I disagree with. Where I am, we have a glut of T3 goods. Nearly all of the worlds I play have far too many T3 goods for trade, including an extremely large amount of cross tier ones. The rest of what you said is spot on! Totally in agreement about the lack of T2 goods (I also didn't fare well with previous events that gave T2 goods) and with keeping event buildings because of population.
 

Deborah M

Oh Wise One
@Enevhar Aldarion It is pretty well known that I do not play a totally practical game. The Panda's pretty outweighs the difference in the Gingerbread house. Sold the Gingerbread house already anyway. I also do have a distinct advantage being in a Great Fellowship where we rarely have shortage in anything but sentient goods. That is mostly because almost everyone started the new chapter at the same time. Also, for me the pop in the evolving buildings is not really of interest either. I am stretched on pop right now but I know that will quickly pass so I can put out "disposable" event buildings until I get the Spring of Youth AW and can sell off what I don't want.

I do completely agree on the research/scout quests. I get really frustrated when those come up. For me either one is at least 4 days now. I am not a fan of "winning" time boosts in the event just to be forced to use them on the same event. I find that discouraging.
 

DeletedUser9984

Guest
I agree substantively with most of the largely negative feedback about the Winter Event-- if not with all of the over-the-top, presumptuous characterizations of inno and/or other players. So I don't want to pile on or be unnecessarily negative, but I really did feel like every facet of this event was less fun, less fair, and less motivating than any event I can remember--very disappointing imo. So I guess I'm just adding my own two cents with the hope of being constructive and insightful, and ultimately, tbh, to just get some stuff off my chest lol. Everyone's got their personal peeves and gripes, but for me the totally randomized prize collection system discouraged me the most. Its removal of all choice or control we previously had to prioritize, save up for, gamble on, and (hopefully) stock up on what prizes we really valued combined with the (new) equal chance of winning utterly "worthless" prizes in their stead, really sucked the fun and enthusiasm of the event out of me.
I'm hesitant to use the word worthless--obviously everyone has their preferences and favorites based on chapter, style/focus in playing, etc.--but the equal chance of opening a gift containing a valued daily prize (however one defines that) or one that contains 1 KP! or a single spell or rune shard? among several others just seems absolutely outrageous to me.
There were some interesting twists that might have been cool: 2x, Shuffle, the Magnifying Glass, but there were just too many terribly lackluster possibilities and too little individual choice at every turn for me to actually enjoy this event. Our personal agency and choice was further limited by the fact that once the 16 gifts (too many!) in a new round were shuffled (hidden), it was virtually impossible to remember what we were even playing for--gambling on-- (besides the daily prize). If, e.g., we revealed a Shuffle, we might want to open it next or not depending on what else we might still want to try for (I love time Instants, e.g.), but who can remember each of the original 16 possibilities? That is what I liked so much about the previous chest system: I could decide how much to wager for (ostensibly) a better chance at the daily prize while also considering for myself my progress toward the grand prizes while also knowing I'd at least get 1 out of 3 or four prizes, the values of which I could also deterimine for myself and factor into my choice of chest. And again, those "alternative" (somewhat selectable) prizes to the dailies were infinitely more desirable and less infuriating/insulting than getting 1 or 3 KPs or that stupid Winter Deer--repeatedly--in this event. It is inevitable... ya win some, ya lose some, and to be fair, most of us may probably feel "cheated" at some point no matter what. But the process and the results of this one felt particularly unsatisfying, to me, and to a great number of us apparently.
I really hope the previous chest system makes a comeback, or at least the number of options per round is reduced and made more customizable, with the more mundane, easily attainable prizes in-game removed from the equation.
As for the grand prize(s) and the system of obtaining them, again, I preferred being able to base my chest choice partly on how enthusiastically I was going after the grand prizes vis a vis my odds of winning the limited prizes in any given chest. It seems to me that the artifact-collecting process should be different in events that offer just one (this one, mermaids) evolving building vs three (phoenixes, bears). Besides my personal opinion that the phoenix and bear grand prize buildings are a lot more interesting and worthwhile than the other two, I feel like those artifacts should be easier/more frequent to earn to allow a real chance to be able to place them all at appealing levels. I'm sure many of us know a fellow, or maybe ourselves, who got 2-3 fully evolved mermaid buildings while they and/or we struggled to fully evolve 2 or certainly 3 of the distinct, unique phoenixes or bears. I just don't understand the point or fun of eventually offering a second building except as an excuse to keep offering otherwise useless--especially to those of us who didn't need the first one--artifacts.
The hammers were OK, I guess, a bit tedious, and maybe I missed it explained somewhere, but was the number of bricks earned (ostensibly) random or were we supposed to be able to affect the outcome?
Sometimes I swore I discerned a pattern lol. Either way, if inno keeps anything like this system, it'd be nice to know if anything we do affects the outcome, and maybe not make us sit there to click 100s, 10000s of times if it doesn't?
And in general, maybe a little more variety and uniqueness for the grand prizes would encourage more participation and even money spending, instead of recycling and cycling through basically the same old event buildings event after event.
As for the questing system and changes, I don't have much complaint there.
I personally don't have a problem with the "random," tiered quest lines; as one who goes all-out in events, I really appreciated the past change to unlimited quests to keep earning throughout an event. But maybe I'm also in a position, due to resource preferences and style of play, to be better suited to manage them than others. I think a lot of player feedback about repetition and length/difficulty of quests is so subjective and dependent on so many independent factors that there will always be some that are not happy. But I must say that declaring that they're addressing past complaints of multiple, repeated quests in a row--eliminating that possibility--then creating like 5 new "unique" quests all asking for supplies just with different amounts and descriptions seems pretty disingenuous. And I honestly don't have a problem, to cite just one example, with getting 3 "2 Toolbox" quests each separated by only one other in between--that's 3 out of 5--but please don't tell me that you're making the quests more varied or spread out. And the 20 ribbons per Bonus quest seemed incongruous with a reasonable formula for these events--especially given that in the end our choices and chances of winning more of what we want than not was so severely curtailed.
I don't presume to ascribe dishonorable intent to inno or their motivations behind the decisions and/or changes they make on the game. And I have no clue as to the technological, logistical, or financial considerations given to maintaining the game or their business. I actually really appreciate their active willingness to communicate and cooperate with heir players, and I have had positive interactions with he support team he several times I've contacted them for a variety of reasons. But whatever their reasons, I, like so many here, in my FS, and around ElvenarWorld found this event to truly fall short in a number of areas.
For me anyway, what makes the events enjoyable and rewarding and satisfying is strategically planning and spending for our favorite goodies, taking calculated risks to get em, seeing how it plays out, and being able at the end of the day to have real, tangible rewards to see, like a good number of a certain building or two in my inventory or a nice, fully stocked compliment of time instants--whatever one's thing is. However different the odds, processes, and outcomes actually were in this event from those in he past, it didn't feel gratifying, it didn't look right, and ultimately it made a lot of us feel taken advantage of and taken for granted. I look forward to seeing what comes next.
Wow, I finished...
Thanks for reeading!
 

WolfSinger

Well-Known Member
t seems to me that the artifact-collecting process should be different in events that offer just one (this one, mermaids) evolving building vs three (phoenixes, bears). Besides my personal opinion that the phoenix and bear grand prize buildings are a lot more interesting and worthwhile than the other two, I feel like those artifacts should be easier/more frequent to earn to allow a real chance to be able to place them all at appealing levels. I'm sure many of us know a fellow, or maybe ourselves, who got 2-3 fully evolved mermaid buildings while they and/or we struggled to fully evolve 2 or certainly 3 of the distinct, unique phoenixes or bears. I just don't understand the point or fun of eventually offering a second building except as an excuse to keep offering otherwise useless--especially to those of us who didn't need the first one--artifacts.

THIS - One Hundred Percent This.

If only one evolving building is offered - how about instead of every other Grand Prize being an artifact - make it every third prize. That would slow down winning multiples. - for example artifact, wishing well, carting library, artifact

If two evolving buildings are offered - then make it every other Grand Prize - like the current system

If three evolving buildings are offered - then make it 2 out of every 3 is an artifact - for example - artifact, artifact, wishing well, artifact, artifact, carting library, and so on.

I understand INNO wants to make money - needs to make money if they want to stay in business. But the easiest way to get people to spend money is to make the events at least look like it's possible with a little luck to win the grand prize. When it at least looks like it's possible to win - then players are more willing to spend when it gets close and they are only a few "points" away from winning that grand prize. Having awesome Daily prizes also lends to spending as players may decide to buy extra event currency because they just have to have that extra wishing well or 'whatever' it is that catches their fancy. Once they but that extra currency - they may even be willing to buy more.
 

CHANDY

Member
I don't mind that they have reduced te number of ribbons for the bonus part.
But I do think it would have been wiser if they started with 57 ribbons and then gradually lowered it to 20 so that there is a natural flow instad of a shock moment to go from 57 back to 20.

I expect the "whining" to be a lot less with such an implementation.
Why drop the ribbons at all? It's not as though we are getting incredible prizes, I primarily use my ribbons to cut production times or get kps. Why drop the ribbon payoff back to 20. I find this to be terribly petty on Inno's part, I'm certain I'm not alone in this belief.
 

qaccy

Well-Known Member
I like that Inno's keeping events restrained, and has done so pretty much since Elvenar's release. Power creep is going to happen regardless, but I like that it's a very slow process here. I'm actually coming around to liking that new event prizes aren't necessarily strictly better than everything that came before it, as it makes things more unpredictable and keeps me watching event prizes to see what comes down the pipe.

If anyone would like to see an example of what the 'better' events being proposed here are like, I have to ruffle feathers and mention checking out FoE. A lot more instant gratification over there and events that practically play themselves, along with every new event's prize being an incremental upgrade over the previous event's prize. Very low-effort, high reward, but it also just feels like a revolving door where everything I just won is going to shuffle right back out of my city when the next event starts. Oh, and people still complain about events over there not being 'good enough' too lol
 

chgobob33

Member
Are you kidding?? FOE is SO MUCH BETTER event wise!!! That's the point!! They keep making things worse here!!! The Winter Event there was SO MUCH BETTER there versus our Garbage!!! FOE is wonderful, why are you ragging on it being player friendly?????? I've been playing both for years BTW. The only screw-up there was the Ark.

Also FOE does the Morally Right thing has a set quest list and if you complete you get a fully evolved Building, as it Morally should Always be!!!

I like that Inno's keeping events restrained, and has done so pretty much since Elvenar's release. Power creep is going to happen regardless, but I like that it's a very slow process here. I'm actually coming around to liking that new event prizes aren't necessarily strictly better than everything that came before it, as it makes things more unpredictable and keeps me watching event prizes to see what comes down the pipe.

If anyone would like to see an example of what the 'better' events being proposed here are like, I have to ruffle feathers and mention checking out FoE. A lot more instant gratification over there and events that practically play themselves, along with every new event's prize being an incremental upgrade over the previous event's prize. Very low-effort, high reward, but it also just feels like a revolving door where everything I just won is going to shuffle right back out of my city when the next event starts. Oh, and people still complain about events over there not being 'good enough' too lol
 
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chgobob33

Member
You seem to be playing FOE totally wrong, no need to shuffle stuff out of your city. If you play there for any length of time you have PLENTY of one ups and Renovation kits and store buildings right? Things we BEG for here! FYI, I currently have 70 Store Building, 14 One-Up (ie one chapter), and 46 Renovation Kits (bring an old event building all the way to current Age/Chapter in Elvenar terms even if it was Chapter 1 to Ch 15).

I like that Inno's keeping events restrained, and has done so pretty much since Elvenar's release. Power creep is going to happen regardless, but I like that it's a very slow process here. I'm actually coming around to liking that new event prizes aren't necessarily strictly better than everything that came before it, as it makes things more unpredictable and keeps me watching event prizes to see what comes down the pipe.

If anyone would like to see an example of what the 'better' events being proposed here are like, I have to ruffle feathers and mention checking out FoE. A lot more instant gratification over there and events that practically play themselves, along with every new event's prize being an incremental upgrade over the previous event's prize. Very low-effort, high reward, but it also just feels like a revolving door where everything I just won is going to shuffle right back out of my city when the next event starts. Oh, and people still complain about events over there not being 'good enough' too lol
 

chgobob33

Member
But YOU miss the point the quests SHOULD NOT be random, who cares who the 1 or 2 idiot low level Inno folks think??? If it pisses players off it's BAD FOR BUSINESS! Even you must have the HATED Random, It's software NOT Rocket Science. For given player pull from the random list and EXCLUDE repeats until done, it's like 2 lines code. I could help them regardless of language, it's simple! Repeating fixed.

I actually liked a good bit of this event. The new prize system was a little bit interesting. More or less like a lottery scratch off. Which is a lot easier then having to pay attention to the currency number on each of the three chests every round like in the last several events. It was also a lot quicker if your using all your currency on a single day, which is a big bonus to me. The only issue on that was having to click for the bricks after that. That completely killed any time saved.

As for the quests, i see mostly the same complaints. Some of which are unfounded. Ppl arnt a fan of the random quests. Which i understand myself, it is annoying since we are used to being able to prepare ahead of time thanks to beta testing. But i also recognize that beta testing was never meant to give us a cheat sheet on the live servers. And the randomization is a way to try and counter that fact.

The quest repitition is also annoying, but understandable when you think about it. There were a lot of quests the ppl wanted taken out. From scouting, to 1 and 2 day productions, and many others. ( i cant recall all of them off the top of my head. Iv typed them out for last events feedback tho. So its floating around somewhere). But removing all those quests means the pool of quests left are much smaller. - Then there addition complaints reguarding time productions and the random quest factor. Again, understandable. Can be annoying waking up and getting a 'produce 9h' quest. Or when its time to log off for the night, you get a bunch of 'produce 15 min' quests. So i do get that. But as such, the main quest line had no time prodctions. It was altered simply to produce xx amount of goods. - When you combine the fact that a bunch of quests were removed, and that all the 'proced xmin or xhours' became a single quest, the remaining pool is incredibly small. And it makes sense that the less there is in the pool, the more repition we are going to see. There are only so many little things that they can add for quests to try and balance it out.
 

DeletedUser3220

Guest
Don't ask for my thoughts unless you want the truth of how I feel. So, since you asked...well, not crazy about any of the last few events that take up the time on a slot machine format. First we have to hunt and work for items, work to turn those items into some other items just to use on a slots game to achieve more items. Although, the artifacts seemed to be easier to acquire and I did get what was needed to evolve the building this time it took a lot of my resources to receive them while appearing to be worth it.

So, if you were trying to stop the reasons we're still here by having us waste our “time” working to use resources for something we think needed and not be able to enjoy the cities and friends we have met…good job. Do you realize you are running off the one thing that this game requires to make money…players? I understand why players with jobs and/or families to care for are all but stop playing. I’m sure they are mostly the ones that can’t achieve getting all the artifacts. What fun is it to pay to take a step forward and then two steps back unless you’re on a dance floor?
 
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