"a FS" or "an FS"?

[SoggyShorts]

So here's the thing:
I know that we use "an" when the next word begins with a vowel sound.
I know that "FS" is pronounced "eff ess"
So it should be "an FS"

however...

I always instantly translate "FS" to "Fellowship" Making it read as "an Fellowship" which is wrong.

Am I alone in this? If you were reading it aloud to someone would you say "an eff ess" or "a fellowship" (they take the same time)

This post brought to you by: random thoughts trying to distract from the upcoming FA... oh man I just realized I don't translate "FA" at all,
so what I like is: an FA, a FS... no consistency for you!

 

[shimmerfly]

Ha ha What if you pronounce it " ph " like in phonograph?... No "an".
Or would you say oops I just "an farted" ?? ( of course I would never say that...)
eff ess or eff ehh that was the question
We love ya Soggy

 

[EnchantedEnder]

Well, you are not alone. I have pondered this very same question. According to various experts I researched, using a vs an depends on how the following word sounds, not necessarily whether it begins with a consonant or vowel. For instance, "a university" is correct even though university begins with a vowel. On the other hand, "an undergraduate" is correct since the "u" sounds like u and not like y as it did in university. In any case, I think the correct version for the phrase you mentioned might be "an FS" since technically, you have written it as the abbreviation. This is just one person's perspective.

 

[DeletedUser3977]

This post brought to you by: random thoughts trying to distract from the upcoming FA...

 

[DeletedUser2768]

You must be bored Soggy.

I read "FS" as fellowship and "FA" as FA. As for which way it should be written (typed), I don't really care, as long as I can get the gist of what the person is trying to say.

 

[SoggyShorts]

using a vs an depends on how the following word sounds, not necessarily whether it begins with a consonant or vowel

Exactly correct.
I think part of my issue is that Fellowship is one word, so FS is an imperfect abbreviation.

English has some strange abbreviations where some only make sense either written or spoken, not both. Take "www" for example: it takes way longer to say "Double yoo, double yoo, double yoo" than "world wide web" For writing (typing) it clearly makes sense though, and by now your brain just ignores it anyway.

You must be bored Soggy.

hehehe yep.

 

[DeletedUser8946]

English has some strange abbreviations where some only make sense either written or spoken, not both. Take "www" for example: it takes way longer to say "Double yoo, double yoo, double yoo" than "world wide web" For writing (typing) it clearly makes sense though, and by now your brain just ignores it anyway.

The W itself is weird. Sound out every word of the English alphabet, all 26 of them, and it's 28 syllables. Why? The W is three syllables. I have some non-native friends that come from countries that don't have anything LIKE the letter W in their alphabet, so they pronounce words like "vhere?" I think they might be on the right track. W is sneaky and deceptive.

I've always said "A FS" as I've said "A Fellowship" "An FS" always sounded wrong too me, until you bring up its technical pronunciation, and now I WANT to say "an FS". Thanks for that, Soggy.

 

[SoggyShorts]

Thanks for that, Soggy.

Hahaha anytime I can fix something that isn't broken, let me know

 

[DeletedUser3507]

FA better be fixed or I am not participating...

 

[SoggyShorts]

FA better be fixed or I am not participating...

Define "Fixed"

 

[samidodamage]

FA better be fixed

Unfortunately jp, what Soggy said was

I can fix something that isn't broken

The FA is definitely broken, so doesn't look like he can be of any help there...

 

[DeletedUser2768]

Hahaha anytime I can fix something that isn't broken, let me know

Why can't I like this comment? It made me laugh.

 

[EnchantedEnder]

English has some strange abbreviations

It sure does, Soggy! How about all the abbreviations that have become words, ie. Laser (no one actually says "Light Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation" ), Scuba (Self-Contained Underwater Breathing Apparatus) or Zip Code (Zone Improvement Plan). And there are lots of other examples. We forget that these words were actually abbreviations. One additional argument for "an FS" (even though it does sound off to Elvenar players because we immediately substitute fellowship for FS), some one unfamiliar with the abbreviation we use would pronounce it as "Eff Ess" and therefore the indefinite article "an" would be correct.

 

[SoggyShorts]

Zip Code (Zone Improvement Plan)

I didn't even know that one Granted we have "Postal Codes" up here but still, I've heard it plenty and just never gave it a thought.
BTW (now that I've googled it) the explanation for ZIP codes is ridiculous. "If you put this code on your outgoing mail it will get there faster- i.e. it will zip along"

 

[Laochra]

@SoggyShorts : You must have been deprived of some cake for a few days....here, let me help!

 

[DeletedUser3507]

Yummmmmmm.....................

 

[ajqtrz]

It's not the letter at the beginning of the word, it's the sound at the beginning of the word. The distinction is between the soft vowel sounds at the beginning of the noun, a consonant, or a hard vowel. "eff" begins with a soft "e". University starts with a "hard U" (actually it's more akin to the "y" beginning "yew"). The confusion is, naturally enough, in the distinction between using "fs" rather than "fellowship" as the term to describe our teams. "FS" is a word -- a special kind of word called an abbreviation, but grammatically a word nevertheless. Thus when we "translate" it to "fellowship" we need to translate the grammar with it. So it's "an FS" and "a fellowship" because the act of translation is translating the grammar as well as the word.

Language is fun and English the most fun unless it's not your first language as then it's no fun.

AJ

 

[SoggyShorts]

@ajqtrz Yep we all know the "rule", but that doesn't change the fact that "an FS" both looks and sounds wrong to many because we don't see "FS" we see "Fellowship"

So the sound of FS is actually not "eff" like it would be if we were discussing an FBI agent.
a FS (seen and pronounced: a fellowship)
an FBI agent (seen and pronounced an eff bee eye agent)

Normally this isn't the case. For example: if we are discussing "an MMO" there is no problem because you do not see "Massively Multiplayer Online (Game)"

Basically, FS acts more like an acronym than an abbreviation like how we say a MADD member

The true beauty of English is that all of its rules seem made to be broken.

 

[ajqtrz]

It's an interesting conundrum since some readers "see" the graphic content and other readers "hear" the graphic content. A letter or word may be either or both "read" and "heard." So when I read I "hear" the sound "fs" as "eff ess" and the "translation" to fellowshi comes a split second later, if it comes at all. Some people expand the letters without hearing them or give preference to the expanded version over the abbreviations -- this is, I think, related to the metaphoric mind (think left brain if you want the stripped down version of "metaphoric mind") while others who "leave" the "fs" unexpanded (or 'transalated') haf a metonymic mind -- think right brain. I"m an artist for the most part in my approach so "fs" is usually not expanded into "fellowship" since, to me it stands in the place of "fellowship" and means the same thing. To me it's become a synonym rather than an abbreviation. Seeing is more right brain and hearing more left brain so how your respond to the grammar depends on your brain orientation.

Now just because I can I'm also going to note that grammar itself, as a mental process, is both right and left brained. The grammatical flow of a sentence is determined by the left brain - the "left brain interpreter" but the placement of phrases, especially in written discourse, is graphical and hence, right brain dominant. Grammar, like so many human endeavors, tries to bridge two different methods of knowledge (See Roman Jakobson on the poles of understanding) and if you perform a corpus callosotomy (the cutting of the corpus callosum) you can find each side of the brain understands one of these two: metaphor (left); and metonmy (right).

Now wasn't that fun?

LOL

AJ

 

[EnchantedEnder]

Basically, FS acts more like an acronym than an abbreviation like how we say a MAAD member

Soggy, with your latest update, I've changed my position. You've convinced me of the validity of "a FS" with your "a MADD" example. I now agree that at least within the Elvenar community, "a FS" would be correct. But I would still think that outside the Elvenar community where an individual would not immediately convert FS to fellowship in their minds that "an FS" would be correct. Can both "a FS" and "an FS" be correct depending on where FS is used?