Blueprints

[DeletedUser4508]

I would like to request another way to 'win' blueprints, besides the 10th chest in tournaments. Only full, very active and highly leveled Fellowships can get to the 10th chest. This makes it an unfair advantage not available to a LOT of Fellowships, which is very frustrating. It seems that Elvenar is slanted more towards the higher level players. I started playing about 4 years ago; played for about 2 years on 2 worlds, took a year or two off for medical reasons, and just started again on a 3rd world. You have to somehow level the playing field. I buy diamonds, even though I am on social security/disability, this is my 'offset' for not going out to dinner, movies, etc. Not being able to reach some of these rewards can be very disheartening to players, especially the newer ones.
I need the blueprints to craft some RR spells so I can upgrade some of these buildings I have won. Otherwise, they are really just taking up space, which is a high commodity in this game.
Please do something to make this available to ALL active players, not just the higher leveled ones.
Thank You.
RedJo

 

[Henroo]

I agree with what you say. It is impossible for smaller, younger fellowships to get blueprints. However, you CAN win Royal Restoration spells without getting blueprints. There is one in chest #4, #6, #8, and #9. In particular, chests 4 & 6 are much more doable goals for most fellowships than chest 10. It will take longer, but you can build up Royal Restorations over time.

Another option is simply to win better buildings instead of upgrading the ones you already have. Almost every event has buildings which provide culture, culture/population, and culture/supplies. And really it is easier to win new buildings of these somewhat generic types after you advance a few chapters than trying to upgrade the ones you have. The best use of RR spells is to upgrade buildings you can't replace, such as evolving buildings or set buildings.

 

[ajqtrz]

Or, perhaps, smaller, less developed fellowships could earn blueprints earlier in tournaments. Here are some possible ways: 1) the determination of winning a blueprint is set to the highest chapter in the fellowship. So if your fs's highest player is in Chapter 8 then you all might get a blueprint for completing 8 chests. OR, another way, based upon fellowship ranking. Top 100 fellowships =10 chests. Next 100 = 9 chests, Next 100 = 70 chests. The numbers are not important, it's the concept that would work It might be1-200 have to get 10 chests, 201 - 400 have to get 9 chests and so on. Or, the total score even. Over 5,000,000 pts total you have to do 10 chests, 4,000,000 it's 9 chests and so on. Again, the actual numbers would have to be worked out.

In any case, the idea of either making blueprints winnable by smaller fellowships and/or earlier is a good one. I spent a lot of time waiting until my fs got large enough to do 10 chests (we do them pretty much every week now but it took us about 6 months of hard work to get there), and it would have been nice if we could have gotten to blueprints earlier.

AJ

 

[AtaguS]

Does the current system favor veteran players or have veteran players just gone through the challenges and worked to overcome them and grown their city to the point where they are at last able to earn valuables like RR spells and blueprints?

I mean, isn't part of the experience for a new player to look at what veteran players have achieved and work to solve the puzzle - meet the challenges - and find a stategy that will get them there some day too?

 

[ajqtrz]

Does the current system favor veteran players or have veteran players just gone through the challenges and worked to overcome them and grown their city to the point where they are at last able to earn valuables like RR spells and blueprints?

I mean, isn't part of the experience for a new player to look at what veteran players have achieved and work to solve the puzzle - meet the challenges - and find a stategy that will get them there some day too?

I agree that there should be some challenge in growing your city to the point where you are large enough to contribute enough to a 10 chest tournament run. However, you can't do it alone. You can't do 10 chests by yourself. That means earning a blueprint depends as much, if not more, on the fellowship you are in.

Each week, according to elvenstats.com about 40 fellowships on Khelonaar reach the 10 chest level. If there's an opening in all of them, which is not usually the case, that would mean 40 players could find a home where they could reach 10 chests and thus a blueprint. 40 players is, probably, a lot fewer than the number of players who wish they could earn a blueprint.

Of course, the option is to build your fs to the level and commitment needed. Having recently done this I can tell you it takes a lot more than just being a solo veteran player. It takes a few veteran players and a commitment to grow. To get there is not a solo job but one which takes the leadership skills of a few players and dedication of all players. And it means, in some cases, "weeding out" players who cannot or are unwilling to contribute their share. In the end then, what gets rewarded by blueprints is not if you are a veteran player, but if you are part of a veteran fellowship. Those are hard to come by in the overall scheme of things and thus, some players are, no doubt, at a disadvantage even if they have worked through all the challenges an individual player can face.

In the end it's more about finding and joining with other veteran players, and if that's something which should be held up as a "puzzle" to solve I guess it's a "puzzle" to solve. My view is that it's not, strictly speaking, a "game mechanic" or "puzzle" so much as a social one. If the devs intend that to be the way it works then we leave things as they are and recognize the lack of ability to earn blueprints might lead a few to leave. Or we can change the formula by which blueprints are awarded so that they reflect not the fellowship's strength/weakness, but the players.

Just some thoughts.

AJ




AJ

 

[BrinDarby]

@AtaguS ,
As a new player, but having played other games kinda like this, and D&D for longer than I can remember... I think there has to be a balance, sure the point of any game is to learn and grow, but if the older/highest players/FSs only get richer, then you create only an illusion that any player ... paying or not... can ""get there too"". You also severely kill off those Up-and-comming FSs, that are the only threat to the established order.

Because as I have read, Diamonds are not a commodity.... When players buy all they can, are they then discarded as a revenue source ?? If Diamonds were Traded, then old players could open up space on thier maps, dump the manufacturing, and let ""scrub"" new players do all the hard work for them, even medium players could supply them. This intern means, that Fellowships get stronger and there's more of them, thus any Tournament ( havent playd 1 here yet ) should be more of a challange to all the players because the Elite players's competition continually gets stronger.

Its no different for me, in terms of ""very hard"" provinces, where rather than being slowed down , I'm halted @ times... or the fact that that means I cannot explore more map, so I can better trade with ppl and meet them perhaps to Join a FS.

Yes Atagus, I see the point "some day" but that cannot mean "never" and it also cannot be "far after Im bored and quit" ....

For me a game like this is 3 questions :
1. Can a free2play player reasonably play ?
2. Can I get to a point , where the game becomes "Fun", before it becomes "boring and tedius ( quit ) ?
3. Is there a social aspect ?

I personally, I want to learn and solve stuff for myself... but there are things, that newer players won't just find in any "guide", that really do come from interection with other players. Some information, if not learned in the 1st 1-2 days before mistakes are made, causes players to just start over a few times, thus cluttering up the maps with abandoned cities. It also seems frustrating to the players I would assume.

I have already found Elvenar to be structured on paid upgrades, and no ingame econ... but ohh well... Sounds like @RedJo in many respects is facing a simmilar wall...You get a building that only really works well if upgraded, but the upgrades are near impossible to achieve , even for a seasoned/skilled player. So it is really wasted space , and also to me... a tease. Sure they kinda work, but ""Space"" is the most desired commodity... and who really wants to work hard to win a building, only to find its kinda pointless, after the facat.....iono...
BrinD

 

[AtaguS]

Of course, the option is to build your fs to the level and commitment needed. Having recently done this I can tell you it takes a lot more than just being a solo veteran player. It takes a few veteran players and a commitment to grow. To get there is not a solo job but one which takes the leadership skills of a few players and dedication of all players. And it means, in some cases, "weeding out" players who cannot or are unwilling to contribute their share. In the end then, what gets rewarded by blueprints is not if you are a veteran player, but if you are part of a veteran fellowship. Those are hard to come by in the overall scheme of things and thus, some players are, no doubt, at a disadvantage even if they have worked through all the challenges an individual player can face.

I've seen it done though. A fellowship - built on the idea of gathering new cities together and helping each other grow with only 1 or 2 - and not at the same time - cities over chapter 14 - come together and get 10 chests in a tournament. I am not trying to suggest that only veteran players can and should be able to achieve blueprints. You are right, it takes a lot of work and commitment. And rather than weeding out players that can't achieve it, I've seen players choose to leave fss because the focus isn't where they want to be.

I spent a lot of time as a new player checking out the larger cities around me and in my fs...seeing and learning what they had and how they got there. Then I had to make some choices about how I wanted to play the game and what aspects of it were more important to me. Because there are many ways to approach the game depending on what you most like about it.

Is it the community and fellowship? Then you seek out a fs with active chat and friendly players.
Is it help and support? Seek out one that focusses on building up their smallest cities.
Fighting? Get a fs with a healthy KP swap and get your AWs up to the task.
Beautifying? Find a mellow fs and do what you like an any pace it takes.
And on and on. There are many fellowships which can get you a solid combination of all these things as well.
Part of the game is fellowship, and part of being in a fellowship is having common goals. There is a fellowship in this game for any and every preference of play. If blueprints are valuable to a specific player that player is free to choose to join or build a fellowship that goes for those...however difficult or long it takes...it can be done.

Yes Atagus, I see the point "some day" but that cannot mean "never" and it also cannot be "far after Im bored and quit" ....

It does not mean never. It just means it takes a long time and lot of commitment and making the choices that will get you there.

 

[Kekune]

Part of the game is fellowship, and part of being in a fellowship is having common goals.

I can't like this comment enough. This is what a lot of folks struggle with. No group can meet every need of every playstyle. Successful fellowships know what they want (and what they don't), and they focus on getting and keeping people who want the same. If your fellowship isn't aligned on your goals, you have to decide which is more important to you.

Almost two years ago, I inherited a tiny fellowship when I was one of the biggest players - with a whopping 8k points. I'd been playing for maybe 4 weeks. It took a year and a bit of luck for us to make 10 chests the first time. We were certainly not huge, at that point. It took a couple more months before we could do it regularly. Now we're what most players would call a "big group" and 10 chests is a cakewalk. But we've been very clear all along what we were going for. It takes time, yes, but nothing in this game is fast - why would this be different?

 

[T6583]

I agree with @AtaguS and @Kekune. You need to find an FS that aligns with your goals. It is possible for a young FS to achieve it if all players have the same goal in mind. The average needed for 10 chests is 1600 points in tourney which can be accomplished by getting as little as 8 chests to 5 stars. Yes this is harder for smaller cities to do due to resources and troops available. But keep in mind that newer cities have a lot more access to things that us older veteran players didn't have when we first started playing. This actually gives you a bit of an advantage in moving through the chapters faster and the ability to get to the point where you can easily reach your tourney goals. If you want to get into a 10 chest FS make sure your tourney average is 1000-1600 points per week. I run a top 20 FS that gets 10 chests a week. Like Kekune it took me almost a year to get my FS to that point after I took it over. I’ve taken Chapter 3 and 4 players. I care less about a players chapter and more about their tourney score and boosts. I usually won’t accept chapter 1 and 2 players because of the high amount of turn over with players in those chapters who decide to quit the game on top of the fact that most chapter 1-2 players can’t meet the demands of our FS. I know with help that a chapter 3 player can in my FS. If your tourney score is good try reaching out to some of the 10 chests FS. Some have openings even if they appear full, some have waiting lists, some have a sister FS that they then move players up from when they have an opening. Also what is your reasoning for acquiring blueprints? Is it to craft RR spells or to upgrade magic buildings. If it’s to craft RR spells you can acquire those on lower chest levels. Also keep in mind that with all of the events it’s often times easier and better to just replace old event buildings with new ones with better stats. It can get very expensive to constantly use RR spells to upgrade event buildings. I suggest saving them for very special or rare buildings and or buildings that you absolutely love.

 

[LisaMV]

Or, perhaps, smaller, less developed fellowships could earn blueprints earlier in tournaments. Here are some possible ways: 1) the determination of winning a blueprint is set to the highest chapter in the fellowship. So if your fs's highest player is in Chapter 8 then you all might get a blueprint for completing 8 chests. OR, another way, based upon fellowship ranking. Top 100 fellowships =10 chests. Next 100 = 9 chests, Next 100 = 70 chests. The numbers are not important, it's the concept that would work It might be1-200 have to get 10 chests, 201 - 400 have to get 9 chests and so on. Or, the total score even. Over 5,000,000 pts total you have to do 10 chests, 4,000,000 it's 9 chests and so on. Again, the actual numbers would have to be worked out.

In any case, the idea of either making blueprints winnable by smaller fellowships and/or earlier is a good one. I spent a lot of time waiting until my fs got large enough to do 10 chests (we do them pretty much every week now but it took us about 6 months of hard work to get there), and it would have been nice if we could have gotten to blueprints earlier.

AJ

THIS is a brilliant idea. Thank you!

 

[Henroo]

As has been mentioned above, to get chest #10 a fellowship with 25 members would have to average 1600 points each in the tournament. And the hard part of this is not getting the 1600 points. The hard part is finding 24 other people who are also able and willing to do it.

 

[michmarc]

As far as individual effort, there is not much of an advantage for veteran cities in the tournament as the difficulty of the tournament scales based on your size. The one thing working against very small cities is the lack of having all five troop types available and the one thing working for veteran cities is the combat boosts provided by ancient wonders and the ability to "feed" goods to small cities to "buy" tournament score for less than it would cost them to earn it themselves.

I have been doing 2000+ every week since Ch6 or 7. Our (10 chest) fellowship currently has a Ch7 player that averages 2100 points and two Ch6 players who average over 1600 points. And one member that has stayed at Ch2 that pulls in almost 3000 points.

It is entirely possible for a group of 25 Ch6 players to get to 10 chests. Even 20 Ch6 players (need 2000 pts each) could do it. If you're in a FS that won't do it, look for one that will: if they have an opening and you show them that you're serious about doing your share, I would think that most FS would welcome you with open arms.

[If you're a serious tournament player interested in blueprints on Khelonaar, please apply to 'Nice Fellows Finish First' as we have an opening for someone serious about tournaments.]

 

[Barklay]

Well ten chests is not easy but it is very doable, and your right bigger more powerful groups do hit every week. Its hard to study what you do not see. How do you get to 10 chests, the key is you fight for it. think wide not tall do an experiment go 30 wide and 2 tall 10 thru 30 will give you 100 KP and you will score points. once you get a few people on board your chest count will go up. it takes 4 or 5 players hitting hard to pull a group to 10 chests once they start scoring the rest will follow somewhat. We make it every week and five players have less than 300 points. Believe its possible the 1600 point thing is another example of how the war can also be won good luck.