Negotiating Too Easy

[Deleted User - 1178646]

6400 I think? edit kekune says 6640, that's probably right.

No, they fall under the "limited" part of "capped/limited/decaying" At high-level tournament play orc production isn't sustainable.

2 battles paid of last week 35K and 71K orcs,
Go figure how many productions that are, absolutely unsustainable.

There are sweetspots than people can use/abuse 3000 points? thats not much? thats only 11 provinces
but yeah you can build easy peasy low level accounts, but none of those follow the path of a "normal" player.
the outlyers arent the rule. also 99% of those account are fed for goods by a big account as thats a pain to produce yourself.


Wait untill I am done with my tourney killer, it will be 12000-20000 points (if I can ever unlock enough provinces lol, go timeboosters and coin rains)
I already got the goods production done with 0 factories and I can make all the t1,2 and 3 I need

It's just a matter now of triggering the 90% discount on a town build on a limited amount of space with limited reseatch and no wonders to get the cheapest possible negotation costs with the maximum production.
Aka ultimate formula abuse, and seeking the edges of possibilities

 

[Darielle]

you can fully clear the spire and pull way more than your share of a 10 chest tourney, every week, setting up your city for pure negotiator, as a 20k city.... and with little downtime.

You can't even come close to doing that as a fighter or mostly fighter hybrid.

This game currently is designed around taking the easy route, even if so many of you can't see it. If you want to fight, then fight... like i do usually... but it's by design an inferior way to play in terms of reaching rewards faster and doing it with the least downtime.

The answer is balancing... like all games have to do... in this case... nerfing the easy route.

The people who actually are against such nerfing and pretending the game is nearly perfectly balanced that way, are either just not knowing how to set up for such an imbalance, or they are trying to keep the devs from ruining their gig.

When you have people planning out FA's by ripping up their cities to prepare for a few flag pulls, i really don't expect many such people to understand the giant pink elephant that is right in front of their faces, concerning the giant advantage pure negotiating has.... even if you yourself can't figure out how to set up your city to do it.

I think the devs are suffering from a case of too many yes men patting them on their heads, blinding them to gaping holes in this game.

The game is not even close to being perfectly balanced fighting vs negotiating, unless you city is NOT set up for negotiating then it feels like it's roughly the same. Negotiator setups rule this game... it's not even close.

I'm not complaining... it's just a simple fact and an odd way to create a game considering all the fighting content they created.

"this isn't true".... yeah, and the world was flat

If you are talking about a chapter four city, it's possible, with enough planning, to do that. If you are talking about a chapter 12 city, then you obviously don't have a chapter 12 city. And if a chapter 12 player manages to do both spire gold and 3000+ on tourney fully catering everything, then they have just done a hell of a lot of work and deserve that reward. It's certainly not a piece of cake, and they will certainly have to rebuild their goods stash. I've done that, but not every week consistently. I fight tourneys and cater spires (generally) just to keep from destroying my goods levels. I have to admit, it's more fun to cater.

 

[CrusaderMichael]

I like how when facts don't work out for certain people, they change the narrative to "mid to late game see yer wrong i'm right". And even then, they are wrong.

Some people just have this unquenchable desire to argue like they are in a debate class.

Regardless.... like it or not, the game is not balanced at all fighting VS negotiating. The facts have already been given... creating new scenarios where you might be right with wonders and MA items boosting you etc, will never make you right.

And no, there is no little plastic trophy for your debate performance playing devil's advocate on such an obvious issue... so don't bother. At least with me.

DEVS... please balance the fighting in this game thanks.

Or maybe rename your game "Elvenar: Avoid Fighting Unless You Like Doing Things Slower And With More Downtime"

All out negotiator cities are just too good.

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

I like how when facts don't work out for certain people, they change the narrative to "mid to late game see yer wrong i'm right". And even then, they are wrong.

Some people just have this unquenchable desire to argue like they are in a debate class.

Regardless.... like it or not, the game is not balanced at all fighting VS negotiating. The facts have already been given... creating new scenarios where you might be right with wonders and MA items boosting you etc, will never make you right.

And no, there is no little plastic trophy for your debate performance playing devil's advocate on such an obvious issue... so don't bother. At least with me.

DEVS... please balance the fighting in this game thanks.

Or maybe rename your game "Elvenar: Avoid Fighting Unless You Like Doing Things Slower And With More Downtime"

All out negotiator cities are just too good.

Thats the only part thats correct in your whole story.
Negotiations are much more difficult than fighting.

so the rest of your story is BS. if you can show me 1 player in the current top of the tournaments thats does not fight then we can start talking.
When it does happen in the future then is this a special formula abuse edge case with a thousand caviats to make it possible. if not we can talk again.

Untill that time you should not attack us for telling you the cold hard truth.
YOUR WRONG!

 

[helya]

Negotiating requires a different game strategy than fighting, but it is not easier. It's often quite expensive. Troops are basically another type of Good in a game where space is a commodity and you're required to have a Barracks and Armories. So any player that has decided to never fight and only cater is actually at a disadvantage. They're not using one of the goods they have at their disposal.

That being said, there are no plans to rebalance the fighting vs the catering formulas, they are uniquely designed for different types of players.

 

[hvariidh gwendrot]

i mostly fight spire and tournaments .. if down time means lots of spare time between fights to do other stuff in my cities then sure

 

[SoggyShorts]

I like how when facts don't work out for certain people, they change the narrative to "mid to late game see yer wrong i'm right". And even then, they are wrong.

Dude, you made a thread with a blanket statement that catering should be nerfed. You have only the perspective of your new little chapter 4 city whereas those who tried to give you more information have experience with the game at several levels.
Examples were given as to why exactly your blanket statement lacked data.

If you want to change your original statement to read "Fighting is harder than catering in chapter 4" then fine, in fact several of us have made the same observation that until you unlock better units there is a tough spot for fighting in chapters 3&4, but if you stick with your "Devs please fix catering is OP" general statement it's just wrong.

Did you check out the top 20 on your server as suggested? You don't even have to message them, just look at their wonders.
If the top results on every single server in every region in the world come from players who fight more than cater and zero players at the top are pure caterers, does that still point to "Catering should be nerfed"?*

Some people just have this unquenchable desire to argue like they are in a debate class.

You're new, perhaps consider that there could be things you haven't seen yet or experienced in the game.
Maybe, just maybe people who have played longer might have more information than you do.

There's no shame in adjusting your worldview based on new information.

*Note there are cities coming soon who will work the new system to max by having a zero relic boost, but that's not here yet.

EDIT: I just timed myself doing the Spire from start to finish pure auto-fight. Managed to clear it in under 12 minutes. I challenge any pure caterer to complete a convincing mini-game every 15 seconds for 48 encounters.
Edit2: got it down to 11 minutes on my second city.