• Dear forum visitor,

    It looks as though you have not registered for a forum account, or are not signed in. In order to participate in current discussions or create new threads, you will need to register for a forum account by clicking on the link below.

    Click here to register for a forum account!

    If you already have a forum account, you can simply click on the 'Log in' button at the top right of your forum screen.

    Your Elvenar Team

Behind the Scenes: Battle Redesign discussion

DeletedUser4779

Guest
Count me as another unhappy player whose losing interest in the game due to the battle system... weeks and countless troop build costs spent trying to achieve the goal of simply winning three battles (finally got to 1 of 3!).

I have tried dozens of provinces, then thought research would help so waited, build & grew -- but larger squad sizes and new troops are still trampled, even when carefully choosing troops and strategies to optimize vs opponent strengths and weaknesses.

Please fix the system or remove the battles in favor of some other play. Keep your active players!

(and yes, my other primary issue is the same as everyone else... let us redesign villages!)
 

mura32

New Member
@Vaza Demonto
Are you referring to the little tasks they throw at you "complete a province" "collect four relics" "fight and win 6 encounters"? I simply decline those. I am now preserving my army to try and advance into the next chapter or to fight in tournaments for knowledge points and relics.

@LrdEloric
There is nothing wrong with making money. You just have to be creative about it - perks, intensives, VIP tournaments like in Gardens of Time, a special character walking the streets... I would love to have a few screen savers, too, so charge me a couple of diamonds, fine (heavy into fantasy, here *chuckle*). Maybe offer a few diamonds for just a dollar - easier on our wallet, but it all adds up on their end, right? Don't make the game impossible to play, especially changing rules smack in the middle of it for those of us who are playing for several months now.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

DeletedUser

Guest
@LrdEloric
There is nothing wrong with making money. You just have to be creative about it - perks, intensives, VIP tournaments like in Gardens of Time, a special character walking the streets... I would love to have a few screen savers, too, so charge me a couple of diamonds, fine (heavy into fantasy, here *chuckle*). Maybe offer a few diamonds for just a dollar - easier on our wallet, but it all adds up on their end, right? Don't make the game impossible to play, especially changing rules smack in the middle of it for those of us who are playing for several months now.


Might and Magic V: Eastern Tribes (or just any of them, expansion wise), the Elven faction (Rangers) city (the great tree) was my favorite; entering the city has the camera panning around this gigantic tree the elves would build around and upon... beautiful. Just saying this because ye like the fantasy. Now wouldnt that be a better place to build cities on?
 

Buttrflwr

Well-Known Member
I don't know why they want us to have less to do in this game.

Indeed. The more engaged you are in a game, the more likely you are to spend those hard earned dollars to play it. Who wants to spend money to watch paint dry? Which is where many of us are, as we can't move beyond where we were at the update. I have only been playing since 9/11/16, but have sunk a "few" dollars in, at the beginning, before the update, and before I realized everything was on a sliding scale upwards. I am talking about city expansions on that one, started at around 450 diamonds or so, now they want 1k up. I won't buy another expansion, but I would have spent more on culture buildings, etc. IF I could still really play. Now I am reduced to gathering supplies to buy my way forward, as I CAN NOT win a battle. I was winning the majority of them before (not the ones where I was outnumbered 8 squads to 5, those I negotiated) even if I only made it out with one unit alive, I at least had the satisfaction of winning, and advancing. I LIKED THE BATTLES! I liked the strategy; now, there is no strategy that will suffice. I DIE. Every.single.time. I even have sorceresses now, doesn't make much difference. I DIE, every single time. And I am starting to understand that I won't be able to negotiate beyond a certain part because of something called orcs. ;) I will need orcs to negotiate. I am almost through with Chapter 3, 5 techs left, working on workshop upgrades now, and haven't fought and won a battle since the second tier of Chapter 3.
AND, if they don't want us to progress beyond a certain point at a certain time...THEN THAT POINT SHOULD BE LOCKED, until such time. Don't let us progress past where they think we should be, then penalize us for it. Just sayin...
 

mura32

New Member
Multiposting, next time, use the edit feature to add to your posts.
@Byrune
Totally agree! :D
I keep staring over the edge at the mountains and the sea below (here, at Elvenar)... would love to go down there and explore! =)~

And so, there we go with the money question again. Why not charge a few diamonds for a particular landscape? Design 5 or 6 and sell them. Who is the brains behind the money-making machine at Elvenar, I wonder, a five year old?

I feel like I need to start billing them for the ideas ;)

What is happening with the game? :eek: This is not the game I signed up for!!!
Shimmering elf-mages? o_O What's next, sparkling vampires? :confused:
 
Last edited by a moderator:

DeletedUser4219

Guest
My Archmage ask me to post this for him!
Screenshot_6.png
 

DeletedUser2870

Guest
Pffff....I waited for the release of last wednesday to see if the new units would make it less impossible to actually win a battle. Happily a tournament is a place where you can test units against some opponents without needing the number of units to make full squads in the provinces.
THEY DO NOT IMPRESS ME.
The cerberus is decent against archers and mages, true, but the production time is grossly out of sync with all the other units. Even with the traininggrounds upgraded to lvl 4 (max) training one slot of cerberusunits takes about as long as training any 4 other slots together. And that for a unit that's decent, but not exactly great.
Droneriders are mostly fun to look at. They're new. But they're not exactly great. Actually, I feel they're weaker than my sworddancers. Pretty weird for a unit that's only available so late in the game.
The blossommage same thing. I doubt this unit is doing much better than the sorceress that already was available. Well, it might now that they effectively dismantled the sorceress. She may have been overpowered, but the reaction to completely render her useless instead of downgrading her a bit is an overreaction.
So....part 2 implemented. Battles are still impossible to win. Meaning that :
A - I'm NOT going to spend money on diamonds anymore...in any world
B - I'm going to play less and less frequently
C - I'm going to look around outside inno to see if there is a game that I may change to of this is not adressed in a reasonable time
 

DeletedUser2651

Guest
Looking for another game also :) not much to do with elvenar but wait for productions to be done with orcs...days and days to be able to open tech and now with no way to fight for expansions :(
i wont leave elvenar because I love the people i play with :) will keep helping with visits and trades but thats all what is left for me to do in this game...sit down...put factories to work, make goods and...either look at the screen like an idiot...or close the game for 3 or 9 hours and do laundry..or go for a walk..or complete a puzzle...ty devs for taking the fighting like u did, now i have the time to finish forgotten crafts here at home :)
 

dikke ikke

Well-Known Member
I must be in a goldilocks zone, until now the new battle system hasn't have that much impact on my progress in the game. Some troops I used in the past a lot are now less powerful and therefore less used now, but with blessed paladins I still win a lot of battles. A fight for ring 9 provinces costs me between 1 or 2 squads of paladins this means I can do 2 to 3 battles a day if I am not playing tournaments. In tournaments with good planning I can complete 2 provinces completely and 4 provinces to 4 stars. I can also see that the die hard premium players who had huge scores in the tournaments before now have maximum twice my score, no longer 4 or 5 times my score in tournaments. Tonight or tomorrow I can test the master crossbowman, if they are good I will use archer more again.
 

DeletedUser2963

Guest
I can test the master crossbowman, if they are good I will use archer more again.
Since the update, light ranged units have become my go to. They work really well against magic users and heavy melee. Have not found a use for my light melee however. Sometimes I throw one in as bait, but that seems to be the extent of their usefulness. Love the term "goldilocks zone"
 

DeletedUser2870

Guest
I battled my way ahead through this game.
Now I find I am stifled. On the US server I have only 1 world I play in. I can't advance anymore because I only am at the start of the fairy-chapter and so cannot negotiate anymore because I need orcs. I also cannot battle anymore so there is no way to advance.
I had resigned myself to the problem of the orcs, the fighting got steadily worse, but with a lot of effort it was doable and there were the tournaments to keep me occupied.
After about 6 months the fairy units were finally released and they are worthless. The droneriders are less valuable than the swordacrobats. The mage is less valuable than the sorceress.
And where trainingtimes have been greatly reduced for all those units they introduce the cerberus with a ridiculously high training time.

With the new system I can fight about half the amount of tournament battles I used to before it gets completely impossible, so that is pretty much out now as well. What the heck is left of the game? Collecting goods. Wow.
My main world (on the dutch server) I'm in the woodelves chapter. Battle is way beyond impossible. Even when I do find an encounter where there are only 5 or 6 opposing units they are so ridiculously overpowered I don't have a chance. Last try was against mostly heavy melee. The opposing knights were hit my my mageunit, limiting the damage they would do. And yet with only 1 strike, that one knight unit killed over half my squad of treants which were supposed to shield my archers...right.
There simply is no way to win. This is not balancing the game, this is stomping down on the players who have invested much time, effort (and in many cases diamonds) on the game. It is a gross disregard for their customers and I am beyond enraged.

Lets see, a short recap on the battle system and how it affects my play.
I spent most of the last week producing units and trying them in different combinations, mostly to no effect. There just is no way to win anymore. Meaning that all that is left to do for the next months is waiting and collecting goods.

I need about 1160 more KP's before I get to the end of the fairychapter, then nearly another 300 to unlock the orc-armouries so I will be able to breed orcs to negotiate.

All in all about 1460 KP's. None of those will be coming out of battles since the battles I face I'm unable to win. With the way it is now, I may be able to get about 40 kp's from a tournament, which helps a bit, but hardly enough and certainly not as much as before. Meaning that by far the most KPs will have to come from the hourly gift. With a Tome of Secrets wonder that makes 25/day. Let's add another 5/day as the tournament results, but then I'm really pushing it. 1460/30= 48.67 days. Say 7 weeks. Since I can't play every day, I lose at least one day a week, so let's add another week to compensate.

Great! That means that even in the most favorable situation I can look forward to 8 weeks of doing nothing but collecting goods, which is about as exciting as watching grass grow.

To make it even better I took a look at my dutch city. I'm the woodelven chapter there, but also no luck (or rather, no chance to win) with the battles. I have no reason to assume it will get much better here, so after those 8 weeks of doing nothing but collecting goods I can have the joy of 1 week time spending all those goods negotiating provinces and opening them up to finally get some expansions, but by then I'll already have all the ones in the research tree so I will only need them for the ridiculous amount of mushroom-factories one needs to get through the extremely boring orc-chapter.
Probably by then I will be able to win some fights due to greater squads, but even so, after that I know I'm going to be stuck again after doing a week, or 2 at most, of battles.


Now what in the name of Hades is balanced about this?

This is what I see about the units...
Swordacrobats: best as cannonfodder to distract other units. I often used them that way, so not much changed there except they do less damage to opposing units now and seem to be able to take less hits so they die even sooner.
Elite archers: reasonable against mage units, but hardly strong. The damage against heavy melee is much, much less than I expected. And any other unit that even looks at them crosseyed makes them drop dead of fright.
Treants: just so much tinder now. By the time they come into action they are always decimated since opposing archer-units are so huge they are lucky to even reach any oppponent. And even if they do they hardly do any damage at all. And taking waaaay too much damage from opposing light melee units.
Granite Golem: Arguably the best unit before the change. Now at best decent against light units. Too vulnerable to everything else. Can't stay out of reach of the heavy melee due to their shorter range.
Sorceress: Another candidate for the best unit before the changes. Now there's not much left. Her high initiative is a laugh because it means she will be before her own troops which are needed to shield her. And if you do put her in front you're lucky if she gets in 2 hits before she's slaughtered. Most success I have had with the new version was by having her skip her first turn. But then what good is that high initiative? Except making her the prime target for even more opposing units.
Cerberus: Good against archers and mages. However, the trainingtimes are way out of sync with all the other units. And though opposing cerberus1 units seem to be able to gobble up my treants without too much trouble due to the huge numbers in their squads my own cerberus units are good only for a quick first strike against their target units and then end up dead after their 1 attack.
Drone-riders: ??? Less powerfull than the swordacrobats. Whyever would such a unit only be available so late in the game. And what does it add to the game? It's nothing more than another version of the light-melee unit so it doesn't add anything except that it looks nice.
Blossommage: same deal. Comparable to the sorceress. Can't see any reason for it being a late-game unit. Can't see any real reason for adding it since it doesn't do anything really different.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

DeletedUser1174

Guest
Why can INNO GAMES not just modify their new battle system to at least make the battling a little more fair:
perhaps reducing the difficulty a little?
reducing the enormous amounts of goods now required to negotiate? they have gone through the roof since the updates.
adjust the rebalancing? some of us feel that now it's worse than before the rebalancing ow appears to be even more unbalanced.
Elven players feel they have been sent up the creek without a paddle and are finding it increasingly difficult when faced with Human race enemies that far outweigh their own forces. you seem to have gone from one extreme to the next on this one.
All battles should be winnable to a certain point not have the odds stacked in the enemies favour 4:1 in the tournaments at least give new and old players a chance at fighting.
now with the new changes to the auto battle system its actually more like an auto slaughter system i know that i now loose around 80% of my forces regardless of the set up or types i use where as before it would be around 25% losses with the same forces.
why have the different special effects been "tweaked" so much on some of our units and only half as much or actually increased on the enemy forces?
why are we fighting units that are miles ahead of our own on the research tree in the tournaments let alone in the provinces i get your explanation about is being way too advanced and all but is it necessary to have the same units in the tournaments?
Players are jumping the sinking ship and new ones see what they are in for and head for the hills
im sure that INNO GAMES had not intended to have this effect on players old or new but it would seem that this has been done in the process and more will leave unless you address some of these issues instead of burying your heads in the sand and ignoring your customers and putting it into the too hard basket or warning and/or banning members for speaking out is not the way either we are not being nasty or vindictive we are merely trying to have our voices heard on some of the issues and let you all know how some or most of us are feeling and that we do have a voice and what is the point in having a forum and discussion if your told what you can and cant discuss here?
Kind regards
Mage IW PHOENIX POWER, ARENDYLL
 

DeletedUser43

Guest
Can't we just get the difficulty on these battles ratcheted down? We have the scouts to block progress. We don't need the fights to be the blockade. So many people are miserable. Every update is like a sword hanging over our heads. If the beta players hadn't thrown a bloody fit, the wholesaler debacle would have brought here. Oh gee...lookee over there...yet another war building to add to my city. Ho hum. Can't do anything with it for a FEW YEARS.

How about ending the war on your most loyal players?
 

Maz Mellor

Well-Known Member
Oh gee...lookee over there...yet another war building to add to my city. Ho hum. Can't do anything with it for a FEW YEARS.

How about ending the war on your most loyal players?

Agree. I know this is not what the devs intend. But it is the result, and when the devs show no desire to mitigate that result, their original intentions begin to count for a lot less.
 

Tauriel Dragonwood

Well-Known Member
I am so disgusted with this new Battle System and the Q&A session recently held on Facebook to address questions about this new Battle System.

Timon went into a battle to help us learn which units are better against other units. The battle he used was a Tournament Battle. He should have gone into a Province battle. The problem with this new Battle System is you need to acquire Provinces in order to advance in the Chapters. You can't advance if you can't defeat the enemies in the provinces. They are too powerful!

This is an example of how difficult the Province battles are now with this new Battle System.


These are the enemy units I had to defeat: 1 squad of 58 Enchantress II, 1 squad of 80 Enchantress II, 1 squad of 82 Enchantress II, 1 squad of 82 Enchantress II, 1 squad of 293 War Dogs II and 1 squad of 69 Steinlings. First turn I was attacked by 302 Enchantresses. They first attacked and killed off my Archers II, then went after my Sorceress, then my Sword Dancer II, my Golems and my Treats II. All my units were killed off. This is so unfair!
 
Top