Open | Confirmed Buff/Debuff Rounds Incorrect

[Darielle]

I autofight too and have lost more than I seem to recall I should. I don't keep records but even with 1 ELR, 1 DA, and 1 MMM and my Fire chicken and twilight my troop count seems to be going down faster than I like/expect.

AJ

I had another person report the same problem to me ... losing troops where we never lost them before. It's mind-boggling to me that I would lose troops on the very first province with the number of 5-day buildings I have (a total of 7) and a fire fed.

 

[crackie]

This should actually be a top priority issue.
Players will only notice when they fight manually AND pay close attention, but it is safe to assume the same happens in auto-fights where there is no way to check it at all. So anyone who fights using the app has no way of knowing.

With the already pretty lousy performance of troops in autofight it really becomes an issue if multiple special abilities of a player's troops are not functioning /not functioning correctly, resulting in extra losses. It also means that the supposedly best line-up of troops may not be the actual one.

It's like losing a whole promotion on your units. Finally unlocked those 3* troops? Haha, just kidding. They don't really have buff/debuff abilities.

I only autofight but is anyone noticing the fights harder on the tourney this week? I even lost a few (supposedly more powerful) troops in the first province on round two, despite having a fed fire, 1 DA, 2 uuu, 2 light range, and two mage multi buildings out. I also have a level 26 Martial Monastery. That just seems insane to me to lose troops on the first province. I know not to put a weak guy against a strong and all that. So anyone else notice anything?

This bug is over a year old so any sudden changes to the perceived difficulty of tourney, if true, cannot be related to this bug.

 

[Glandeh]

Last week and the week before, I felt that way too, but this week seems to be OK for me, both auto and manu fights. Still I would love to see those pesky cheating mistwalkers banned from the game.

 

[ajqtrz]

I'd rather see those mist walkers suddenly switch sides! Wouldn't that be cool? You could have a "superior traitor" instead of a "superior trader" building I would have to cost a lot of course, but there are only two enemies I hate seeing. The mist walkers 'cause they get the first shot, and those dogs because if they strike before your troops (and they have the reach to do so) you are usually fighting 4 against 5 at that point. My blossom mages plus frogs are wonderful unless there is a dog in the enemies. Then I have to switch to something else or lose too many of my prize troops.

AJ

 

[Yogi Dave]

I was just looking for this bug report to see how it was resolved. After all, it was reported on May 22, 2022, but I'm not all that surprised that it's still listed as 'confirmed'. Of course, it's a bit scary to think someone will have to go into the fight'en code and fix it. How many other problems will that create? Who do they even have around that has a clue how it works? My guess is 0.

I checked on this for you again today, they have been able to reproduce it reliably and it looks like it might be happening with another unit. Fix is still ongoing. Buddy is not forgotten.

The above was posted Aug. 13, 2022. It sounds to me that Buddy just doesn't matter to them, whoever 'them' might be.

Maybe all the outstanding bug reports will be moved to discord - yeah right and I'll win the lottery 3 times this year.

My blossom mages plus frogs are wonderful unless there is a dog in the enemies.

Both the mages and frogs have a higher initiative than the dogs they bring to tourney and spire. 16 for mage, 8 frog and 7 for their dog. Now for world provs, sometimes they use the same dog as you do which has an initiative of 9.

 

[Darielle]

Can we get anyone @-Solaris- @Elovios to tell us how this was resolved, partially resolved, or ignored? Are they just going to forget about all bugs (that don't lose them money) from now on? Sometimes I get the feeling that we're on our way out the door, and I don't just mean the forum.

Actually, that might be a good thing for me. I might actually finish my next novel. But I would like to know what happened with this.

 

[crackie]

The above was posted Aug. 13, 2022. It sounds to me that Buddy just doesn't matter to them, whoever 'them' might be.

Def not fixed because I've still seen it happen in the current game. Remember, it affects other units too so it isn’t just about Buddy.

Can we get anyone @-Solaris- @Elovios to tell us how this was resolved, partially resolved, or ignored?

Helya told me they have confirmed it wasn't just a visual bug before she left. At least that meant they worked on it, but prob stuck for all the reasons @Yogi Dave surmised.

If you report a bug on the forum, it becomes public knowledge that at least one user is experiencing an issue. Many times I have seen someone else report a bug and experience it later myself, but I don’t bother submitting a ticket because I know it was already reported and no need to inundate staff with another ticket. Another user can also explain why it isn’t a bug, with future support ticket averted about that topic, taking the burden off staff again. It is also public record which staff confirms or denies it is a bug or not. In the case of it lingering with nobody answering it at all, then it also becomes public knowledge who ain’t doing their jobs and we are being ignored. Imagine that. Accountability. This one was a doozy of a bug, but at least it made it all the way up the chain.

 

[ajqtrz]

Def not fixed because I've still seen it happen in the current game. Remember, it affects other units too so it isn’t just about Buddy.

Helya told me they have confirmed it wasn't just a visual bug before she left. At least that meant they worked on it, but prob stuck for all the reasons @Yogi Dave surmised.

If you report a bug on the forum, it becomes public knowledge that at least one user is experiencing an issue. Many times I have seen someone else report a bug and experience it later myself, but I don’t bother submitting a ticket because I know it was already reported and no need to inundate staff with another ticket. Another user can also explain why it isn’t a bug, with future support ticket averted about that topic, taking the burden off staff again. It is also public record which staff confirms or denies it is a bug or not. In the case of it lingering with nobody answering it at all, then it also becomes public knowledge who ain’t doing their jobs and we are being ignored. Imagine that. Accountability. This one was a doozy of a bug, but at least it made it all the way up the chain.

Now the strategic method of "inundate" is one way to get something done. So, I'm not sure NOT reporting it, is as helpful as doing so, no matter if you know they know or not. When I ran a business the "multiple reports of...." always got solved before the "one person reported."

Just a thought.

AJ

 

[JackofShadows]

I have to agree with AJ - I do tech support for a living. The squeaky wheel is the one that gets greased. I would recommend that every player who experiences this bug write up a well documented ticket (screen grabs are great) and spell out the problem.

I would also include a link to this thread, particularly the post(s) where the problem was confirmed.

If there are people who use the Discord channel (I don't), I would make noise over there also.

I also agree with crackie that it should NOT have to be this way. A single well-documented report should be enough. But that isn't how tech support works.

tl;dr - Make noise. Open tickets.

 

[Killy-]

Hello, anyone here? Just remembered this bug today, still nothing happened with it or did I miss a change?

 

[TimeMachine]

Are they just going to forget about all bugs (that don't lose them money) from now on?

I must admit that it sadly seems to be like this somehow, at least from my point of view.

There are a few very old unfixed known bugs more that spontaneously are coming to my mind.

The report of this one here is going to celebrate its third birthday soon.
The "Special Features" regarding elvarian rounding have been reported first about seven years ago as far as I know.

It was just yesterday when I wrote a ticket although I had in mind to not report any bugs any more, since I had the impression that in some cases nobody seems to be interested in fixing those.
This one has been there for at least 3 - 4 years, since I started playing Elvenar, it is that Wonky Walters issue most humans and elves know about here on this forum I guess.
Getting the Wonky Walters with stats from Chapter I when solving the corresponding quest in Chapter IV.

Nearly every time one of my cities arrives at that point of the game I wrote a ticket to support and they usually are giving me a "correct" Wonky Walters with stats of Chapter IV.

I could write down some more but I don't feel like it anymore. Anyway I've asked myself for so many times why this and that isn't or wasn't already been fixed.
I've even experienced Elvenar Team in another country arguing bugs away or simply reacting with "cannot reproduce" even when I was able to reproduce those reported bugs.

Might be because they maybe didn't feel like passing it on, or even worse they react with "cannot reproduce" because they maybe know that this won't be fixed anyway.

Bad tongues would maybe even say that this, I would like to say, well known "bug" maybe never was a bug because it was maybe intended right the way it is in game. Buffs and Debuffs should maybe disappear after one or two rounds? To make fighting a little harder?

But if that shoud be the case regarding this issue, they shouldn't have had confirmed this as a bug.

In my eyes The US Team has done everything in their power and although I never wanted to write anything like this down again, it seems like @InnoGames should rethink their communication regarding their own error culture.

Bugs are not the end of the world, they simply do happen, no problem.
But keeping quiet about these cases for years, where fixing them wouldn't benefit @InnoGames but the players does not make a good impression to me.

To me, It gives the impression that they either don't want to or can't

Spoiler

 

[Astram]

I will tag the CM's to see this and see if an update can be provided.
@Guess Whos Back ? @Elovios

 

[Guess Whos Back ?]

Hello,

I don't have an answer for this at the moment, I'll look into it.

 

[Dhurrin]

It's like losing a whole promotion on your units. Finally unlocked those 3* troops? Haha, just kidding. They don't really have buff/debuff abilities.


This bug is over a year old so any sudden changes to the perceived difficulty of tourney, if true, cannot be related to this bug.

However, it may have something to do with progress in the game. The further you progress, the harder the fights become, reaching a treshold may actually have a larger than expected effect. If that comes on top of this bug it could potentially become very noticable.

 

[Technomancer]

Might be because they maybe didn't feel like passing it on, or even worse they react with "cannot reproduce" because they maybe know that this won't be fixed anyway.

I'm not part of development or support, so I can't say what the support team does with their bugs. However, I wrote software for over 45 years (yup, I used punch cards and paper tape back in the day). I might be able to give some insight into "cannot reproduce."

First, debugging is the most difficult part of software any orders of magnitude more difficult. Systems like Elvenar are extra fun because the "program" is distributed across machines spread around the world.

Sometimes to get a bug to come out from hiding, the user has to do a lot of steps. Some steps may seem unrelated and yet it is those steps that cause the problem. What happens is some data values are set by one set of actions (setting the program state) and that state interferes with some other, unrelated action. The code is supposed to be segmented (modular and object oriented techniques) but weird things can creep in.

So, you do something and the bug appears. However, you may not report all the steps so the support person cannot force the system into the state to get the hairy bug to show itself. In theory, the system has lots of logging and other techniques to capture the state information.Since a program the size of this game will have millions of bits of data, it is impossible to capture all of the state information and state transitions. Therefore, the engineers capture what they can and hope it is enough.

There is always a set of bugs the just are very good at hiding, and thus you get the "can't reproduce" problem. Without being able to reproduce the bug, it is nearly impossible to fix it.

Using Beta is an example of causing weird state problems. I have seen bugs the showed up when I switched from Beta to my regular account. They were rare and difficult for me to reproduce, so I could never do a good ticket. However, I now use two different browsers (chrome for Beta, Firefox for live) and sometimes two different machines. The weirdness seemed to stop. I exit the app on my tablet if I am jumping between Beta and Live.

Anyway, enough engineering rambling.

 

[Yogi Dave]

However, I wrote software for over 45 years (yup, I used punch cards and paper tape back in the day). I might be able to give some insight into "cannot reproduce."

More than 45 years for me too - punch cards, paper tape, mag tapes, huge disc drives holding a huge 10 mb, etc. Still doing it, but much more modern approach. Yes, it is more difficult to find bugs today with how distributed the systems are, the variety of computer types, OSs, browsers, etc. they run on all complicate the issues. The age of code which is always evolving and the change of personal with different experiences exacerbates the situation. (More modern programmers may have difficulty understanding old code.) Still, damn it someone or someones should still be looking at it! Since it's 3y old, I suspect no one is. It got buried in the backlog but should be resurrected. Fresh eyes often help.

Anyway, enough engineering rambling.

Ah, the stories we could tell, but won't except this: I kept an Exacto knife and Scoth tape around to change a punch card.