Changes to the Ancient Wonders Rewards coming with game version 1.52

[Jackluyt]

This change came to the Beta World on 11 April 2018.

There have been persistent complaints that if one donates Knowledge Points to a friend's Ancient Wonder, and the Wonder completes all the KP required and pays you a bonus – if you are offline or asleep, the inflow of KP will fill your KP Bar, and you will not gain your normal hourly KP until you come on line and empty it.
Here is the solution at last!
The bonus you gain will now be paid out in Ancient Knowledge Instants, that will go into your Inventory and not fill up your Knowledge Bar.
The downside is that you can only give these Instants to an Ancient Wonder – yours or a friends – you cannot use them on the Tech Tree.
To compensate for this, the Developers have whopped up the number of people who gain a bonus, and the number of KP! (For higher-level Wonders only).

I personally am very happy with all those extra KP.
This will not affect players who do not regularly donate lots of KP to their friends' Wonders – because you have to put in a whack to have a chance of winning a bonus!
There will be unhappy players – but to me who upgrades all my Wonders aggressively, it seems fair that a prize won from Wonders should go back whence it came.

This picture is an example I took from my city – my Shrine of Shrewdy Shrooms level 12 now gives 7 bonuses not 6 – and greater bonuses to the top players too!

For the full InfoTip and a bigger picture, go here:

https://bit.ly/2GQl763

 

[Pheryll]

I was wondering when this overhaul would occur. It made much more sense to give the AW prizes as AW KP, than for the tournament.

 

[Ashrem]

While it's probably going to get ignored, these recent changes seem like they might be intended to decrease (not remove) the value of pushing, by making it easier for everyone to get their AWs higher and higher. With latest change, AWs now pay out about 50% more KP, all of which has to go back into AWs so will provide even more KP. I think there will be a significant increase in the use of AWs. That will also have the side-effect of reducing reliance on other buildings, which will take some pressure off the need for bigger and bigger cities. Inno gets a hard time for a lot of their choices, but it looks to me like they are taking active steps to improve the game experience in a positive fashion.

 

[qaccy]

Those increases look about as significant as the tournament increases. I'm a self-leveller but I'm still looking forward to this change because it now means I'm able to get more 'free' help from my FS members due to the larger rewards they receive back. Going from 80 KP rewards up to 140 for a level, as in the example above, is a potential 60 KP less I have to spend on a level compared to before!

@Ashrem Remember that while it does make it 'easier' for AWs to level, pushers are going to benefit from it just as much as anyone else because the push accounts will be receiving increased KP rewards as well. Heck, the problem they'll end up running into is a lack of builder slots or AWs to contribute to because they'll be spending more time upgrading than actually being able to receive KP.

 

[Ashrem]

Remember that while it does make it 'easier' for AWs to level, pushers are going to benefit from it just as much as anyone else.[/USER]

I specifically said decrease, not remove. In absolute terms, they will benefit just as much. As a percentage of total KP invested in AWs, the non-pushers will gain on them. Adding 500 to 5000 is less than adding 500 to 3000.

 

[HJK84]

Well, I like it!
In many threads we've talked about the power of AW's, compared to other buildings... Maybe people will take another gander at it all

I have to figure out a way to create a AW donation system... cause FS doesn't really have one

 

[DeletedUser1108]

Well, I like it!
In many threads we've talked about the power of AW's, compared to other buildings... Maybe people will take another gander at it all

I have to figure out a way to create a AW donation system... cause FS doesn't really have one

In my fellowship we have 3 donation threads, 5, 10 & 20 kp; all of them get frequent daily use. You donate to the person at the top of the thread and post a message that tells what the next person gives to you -example- 10kp to Aramina's golden abyss, my Mountain halls please. It works quite well, everything you spend, you get right back and the rewards when someone levels up as well.

Our threads are labeled ex: 5kp AW sharing, Do Not Delete (If someone accidentally deletes their copy of the thread, you will have to start a new one to re-include them - also after 150 to 200 responses they get slow and you will want to kill the thread and start anew.)

 

[DeletedUser17001]

i dont have room for what I want to build. if they want to make the wonders worth while.....compete with the buildings I want to use the space for, because even gems of knowledge only identifies one as a no brainer

 

[HJK84]

In my fellowship we have 3 donation threads, 5, 10 & 20 kp; all of them get frequent daily use. You donate to the person at the top of the thread and post a message that tells what the next person gives to you -example- 10kp to Aramina's golden abyss, my Mountain halls please. It works quite well, everything you spend, you get right back and the rewards when someone levels up as well.

Our threads are labeled ex: 5kp AW sharing, Do Not Delete (If someone accidentally deletes their copy of the thread, you will have to start a new one to re-include them - also after 150 to 200 responses they get slow and you will want to kill the thread and start anew.)

Having trouble understanding this, sorry. I read it many times. Either I'm having a "brain fart" or worse, lol

i dont have room for what I want to build. if they want to make the wonders worth while.....compete with the buildings I want to use the space for, because even gems of knowledge only identifies one as a no brainer

Wanting to build something, doesn't always mean you need to build it.
Therefore Imo. for ppl who want something, but they don't need it, I'd say; pay for it (doesn't need to be $, but other ways also)

If you have opinions on new Ancient Wonders, and some cool features one might bring, make a thread and let us know about it

 

[qaccy]

@Ashrem I still disagree. If the same rewards are available to everyone, I'm failing to see how 'normal' players are going to somehow receive more benefit than the pushers are. Perhaps I'm missing something or simply misunderstanding what you're saying?

 

[Ashrem]

@Ashrem I still disagree. If the same rewards are available to everyone, I'm failing to see how 'normal' players are going to somehow receive more benefit than the pushers are. Perhaps I'm missing something or simply misunderstanding what you're saying?

My math skills are somewhat intuitive, so I rarely do a good job of conveying my point. Normal, individual, players will not see enough of a benefit to feel there's been an improvement, but the absolute value of all extra KP in the system as a result of reward chests will be higher for the aggregate of normal accounts, and the total impact of pusher KP on the KP-in-AWs for the server-as-a-whole will be reduced.

To pick wild numbers out of a hat based on 10% cheater accounts, 100 cheater accounts will get an extra 40kp/AW level, but 900 non-cheater accounts will get an extra 40kp/Aw level.

 

[DeletedUser1108]

Having trouble understanding this, sorry. I read it many times. Either I'm having a "brain fart" or worse, lol

Lets' say I start the fs wide thread with the above message, i.e. I give 5kp to Aramina and ask for donation to my Mnt Halls, the next person gives me 5kp to my hall and asks for Monastery, person 3 gives to that monastery and asks for shroomy shrooms, person 4 donates to the shrooms and asks for whatever...whomever is on top gets the donation and you place yourself on top....it's like a chain letter

 

[Jackluyt]

Having trouble understanding this, sorry. I read it many times. Either I'm having a "brain fart" or worse, lol

Here is the low-down on the Knowledge Point swap clubs: https://bit.ly/2qoTXZL

 

[DeletedUser16361]

I think this is a good change by Inno.

I would like to hop in on the math debate here though.

I disagree with your aggregate analysis leading to a conclusion that this is somehow tips the scales away from pushers. My math indicates the complete opposite.

The extra 40 KP means --> Everyone gets to level AW's faster. Yes.
I think what you're saying is there is more KP coming from bonus' now so that dimishes some of the hourly gains a pusher may have.
But, those bonuses are given in equal amounts to the pushers who will get their own bonuses so it's a wash there.

Pushers effects though are amplified... They have multiple accounts... not just one. So, it amplifies their gains with no additional effort required.
Tipping the scale further in their favor not less.

 

[Ashrem]

I think what you're saying is there is more KP coming from bonus' now so that dimishes some of the hourly gains a pusher may have.

Well, I wasn't saying that, but actually, if they were getting 400 from tournaments and hourly gains and 100 from bonuses before, now they are getting 400 and 150, so yes, hourly gains KP is a lower share (both absolute, and percentage) of the total KP available.

But, those bonuses are given in equal amounts to the pushers who will get their own bonuses so it's a wash there.

As percentage of KP, it's unchanged (per my original comment) As an absolute share of all KP available to go into AWs, unless there are more pushers than non-pushers, the KP going into the AWs of non-pushers has increased more than the pushers.

Pushers effects though are amplified... They have multiple accounts... not just one. So, it amplifies their gains with no additional effort required.
Tipping the scale further in their favor not less.

They are amplified per the individual, not per the aggregate of all players. The percentage share remains the same, the absolute value of all KP entering the system is shifted toward the non-pushers (again, unless there are more push accounts than non-push accounts.

Inno can't put a lot of effort into balance for the individual. Their goal has to be to benefit the overall economy. Their options for doing that are not endless. Making it so that more non-pushers are leveling more AWs, more often, should have the effect of reducing the impact to the overall economy of pushing.

Remember, I'm talking about "recent changes" not solely this one change, so I'm looking at the aggregate of more bonus KP for AWs and redirecting tournament chest KP from general "funds" to AW leveling. The latter had zero effect on pushers, since that was always their only choice for using it, but now a bunch of non-pushers are being forced to redirect KP that they might have put into the tech tree so it all goes into AWs. This additional flow will also amplify the affect of the newest change, because pushers aren't going to be directing more of their available tournament KP into winning chests (with associated prizes), while non-pushers are, because they have no choice.

 

[Deborah M]

In my fellowship we have 3 donation threads, 5, 10 & 20 kp; all of them get frequent daily use. You donate to the person at the top of the thread and post a message that tells what the next person gives to you -example- 10kp to Aramina's golden abyss, my Mountain halls please. It works quite well, everything you spend, you get right back and the rewards when someone levels up as well.

Our threads are labeled ex: 5kp AW sharing, Do Not Delete (If someone accidentally deletes their copy of the thread, you will have to start a new one to re-include them - also after 150 to 200 responses they get slow and you will want to kill the thread and start anew.)

This is how they work in my FS. We have 3, 5, 10, 20 & 30 kp threads. I haven't started participating yet because in a prior FS I didn't end up getting any chests so it seemed like a waste of time. I'm planning to try it again in a few days when I'm done Elementals. Worst case I would break even anyway so why not? I think they have such larger # kp threads because of tournament kp.

I was also in a FS that did a rotating list of players. Everybody participating donated 5 kp to the same player each day. Theoretically you should break even on the day it was your turn. It occurred to me that with players who didn't play daily or took a break it was doubtful you would break even unless you consistently got chests. I did not think this was a good system.

 

[HJK84]

Here is the low-down on the Knowledge Point swap clubs: https://bit.ly/2qoTXZL

Thanks for the help.
Although, I can't seem to find it. Probably cause I don't have a Facebook account, and aren't interested in getting one

 

[samidodamage]

Probably cause I don't have a Facebook account, and aren't interested in getting one

Me, either!
Try this link to a youtube video about the same thing (but done by a different person I think)

edit: Well, I meant to just include the link, not the whole video, but I can't make it work, so I'll leave it.

 

[SoggyShorts]

i dont have room for what I want to build. if they want to make the wonders worth while.....compete with the buildings I want to use the space for, because even gems of knowledge only identifies one as a no brainer

Many wonders are "no-brainers"

• the ToS, EE, PT are each better than a workshop at making supplies, and provide other benefits on top.*see below
• the GA gives more pop than a house if you are in chapter 6+
• the Mt hall gives more goods per square than factories do, and gives pop on top
• the Blooming trader gives you more guest race goods which for most players means moving through the chapter 6% faster even at level 1

and that is true for all of those wonders even if you put zero KP in them. If you actually level them up ,they crush normal, event, and even premium in space efficiency.
If you are using a military for the tournament, map, or both

• the SSS and bulwark are both better than making a third armory, and give you free troops on top
• the Monastery/sanctuary gives your troops a very good boost, and is considered by many the best military wonder
• the Needles lets you exceed the training speed limit of your barracks and increases the damage of light ranged units

Those are just the ones I'm confident calling "no brainers". Depending on your playstyle, almost all wonders can improve your city compared to other buildings.

*The "Why pass?" section on Gamers gems for the ToS,EE,PT is misleading. Everyone needs supplies, if you don't need more supplies, replace a workshop with a wonder that is better to save space and get the added bonus that comes with it.

 

[Jackluyt]

Thanks for the help.
Although, I can't seem to find it. Probably cause I don't have a Facebook account, and aren't interested in getting one

I will mail it to you if you give me an address!