Event Building Rewards

[Myne]

We request a temporary hiatus on building rewards that generate 3rd tier goods. Instead, we request that the rewards the event buildings produce be predominantly 1st and 2nd tier goods.
The current trend of buildings producing 3rd tier goods has created an imbalance in quantities that is forcing cross tier trading for 1st and 2nd tier goods that is unsustainable in the long run.

PROS:
This will bring the supply of 1st and 2nd tier goods back into balance rather than players having the large quantities of 3rd tier goods they are trying to get rid of.
This solution will bring trading back into some sort of balance, rather than opening the trader to see only 3rd tier goods offered.
This should also stimulate participation in the events, as different good producing buildings will be seen.


CONS:

 

[Myne]

I would like your input and suggestions. I could not think of anything much in the way of cons. I am sure you all can help with that. Also, let's talk about revising it some more so it is strong.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

This would only matter for the small number of buildings that always give the same goods regardless of chapter. For all the rest, just don't be in chapters 6-8 when you get them and they won't give you tier 3 goods. If people stopped hanging onto those old buildings after they are past chapter 8, or upgraded them with RRs to higher than chapter 8, there would be a lot less tier 3 out there.

 

[StarLoad]

This would only matter for the small number of buildings that always give the same goods regardless of chapter. For all the rest, just don't be in chapters 6-8 when you get them and they won't give you tier 3 goods. If people stopped hanging onto those old buildings after they are past chapter 8, or upgraded them with RRs to higher than chapter 8, there would be a lot less tier 3 out there.

Most of the Bldgs I have were secured after chapter 6 and only a couple give out T2 goods and until the Pilgrim set it has been mostly T3 goods and above in evolving and event bldgs. The big exception is the Gingerbread Mansion and glad I got 2 of them.

Ed

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Most of the Bldgs I have were secured after chapter 6 and only a couple give out T2 goods and until the Pilgrim set it has been mostly T3 goods and above in evolving and event bldgs. The big exception is the Gingerbread Mansion and glad I got 2 of them.

I would have to catalog mine, but I do have more buildings giving tier 1 or 2 than tier 3. We just got a recent building set that gives a lot of tier 1 and the other recent set that unfortunately does give a lot of tier 3. But I also have a chapter 19, level 10 Aureate Phoenix that gives me about 100k tier 1 goods every two days. And several other evolving buildings that give tier 1 or tier 2 goods. But then, I also have the Tavern set, or whatever it is called, that has one building that gives all three tier 3 goods.

But I was specifically talking about all the stuff that changes what it gives, depending on chapter. Like how orc nests or mana sawmills give tier 3 goods in chapters 6-7 or 6-8, and all the event buildings that change the same way, like the mana producers that give tier 3 in chapters 6-8, until you upgrade them to chapter 9 and they switch to mana. I have a small city on Beta that is now in chapter 6 and I am not keeping a single one of these buildings there that make tier 3 goods. They are a waste of space and contribute to there being too much tier 3 goods in the Trader.

 

[crackie]

Bring back the old tourney format where you need a lot of the good of the tourney type to the point that we don't see any in the trader for a week at a time when the tourney is happening. Then everyone will need all of each good in balance...unless this has the consequence of creating a glut of dust and scrolls because those two tourneys are mean.

 

[StarLoad]

I would have to catalog mine, but I do have more buildings giving tier 1 or 2 than tier 3. We just got a recent building set that gives a lot of tier 1 and the other recent set that unfortunately does give a lot of tier 3. But I also have a chapter 19, level 10 Aureate Phoenix that gives me about 100k tier 1 goods every two days. And several other evolving buildings that give tier 1 or tier 2 goods. But then, I also have the Tavern set, or whatever it is called, that has one building that gives all three tier 3 goods.

But I was specifically talking about all the stuff that changes what it gives, depending on chapter. Like how orc nests or mana sawmills give tier 3 goods in chapters 6-7 or 6-8, and all the event buildings that change the same way, like the mana producers that give tier 3 in chapters 6-8, until you upgrade them to chapter 9 and they switch to mana. I have a small city on Beta that is now in chapter 6 and I am not keeping a single one of these buildings there that make tier 3 goods. They are a waste of space and contribute to there being too much tier 3 goods in the Trader.

Thank you for the clarification, and yes the Pilgrim manor set, I have 3 makes 86K total of each T1 approx every day in ch 16.

Ed

 

[Myne]

I would have to catalog mine, but I do have more buildings giving tier 1 or 2 than tier 3. We just got a recent building set that gives a lot of tier 1 and the other recent set that unfortunately does give a lot of tier 3. But I also have a chapter 19, level 10 Aureate Phoenix that gives me about 100k tier 1 goods every two days. And several other evolving buildings that give tier 1 or tier 2 goods. But then, I also have the Tavern set, or whatever it is called, that has one building that gives all three tier 3 goods.

But I was specifically talking about all the stuff that changes what it gives, depending on chapter. Like how orc nests or mana sawmills give tier 3 goods in chapters 6-7 or 6-8, and all the event buildings that change the same way, like the mana producers that give tier 3 in chapters 6-8, until you upgrade them to chapter 9 and they switch to mana. I have a small city on Beta that is now in chapter 6 and I am not keeping a single one of these buildings there that make tier 3 goods. They are a waste of space and contribute to there being too much tier 3 goods in the Trader.

Bring back the old tourney format where you need a lot of the good of the tourney type to the point that we don't see any in the trader for a week at a time when the tourney is happening. Then everyone will need all of each good in balance...unless this has the consequence of creating a glut of dust and scrolls because those two tourneys are mean.

Thank you for the clarification, and yes the Pilgrim manor set, I have 3 makes 86K total of each T1 approx every day in ch 16.

Ed

@Enevhar Aldarion fortunately you are in a better position than most players. The stuff that changes what it gives by chapter is annoying imho. But my trader is jammed with 3rd tier offerings for 1st tier demands..I play on Harandar and Elcysandir.
@crackie I don't know if that would help at this point. Everybody wants to get new buildings, but those buildings are offering 3rd tier just like the old ones. I have 0 3rd tier factories at this point and still keep an inventory of 400-500k of 3rd tier goods.
@ed1960 I agree the pilgrims manor set was an excellent offering, but most players are unable to manage to get 3 sets.

Can anyone think of any cons to the proposal of a hiatus on 3rd tier stuff?

 

[StarLoad]

No cons that I can think of Other than every time that INNO plays with the "economy" there are unintended results. @ajqtrz could explain it better than I could.

Ed

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

One thing that is still a problem, and has nothing to do with the event buildings, is that tier 3 factories are worth more ranking points than tier 1 or 2 factories of the same level, so there are still some players out there who have nothing but tier 3 factories and then post a bunch of trades offering those tier 3 goods. I don't know how common that still is, but before that last couple of years of event buildings, people doing that were generally the culprits, and nothing Inno may do to event buildings will change those players. So if you see someone with a bunch of cross-tier trades offering tier 3 goods, go and check out their city and see if they are doing it with factories or event buildings.

 

[Myne]

No cons that I can think of Other than every time that INNO plays with the "economy" there are unintended results. @ajqtrz could explain it better than I could.

Ed

yeah we have no way of predicting that or influencing it.

 

[Myne]

One thing that is still a problem, and has nothing to do with the event buildings, is that tier 3 factories are worth more ranking points than tier 1 or 2 factories of the same level, so there are still some players out there who have nothing but tier 3 factories and then post a bunch of trades offering those tier 3 goods. I don't know how common that still is, but before that last couple of years of event buildings, people doing that were generally the culprits, and nothing Inno may do to event buildings will change those players. So if you see someone with a bunch of cross-tier trades offering tier 3 goods, go and check out their city and see if they are doing it with factories or event buildings.

I will do that. I know my people aren't doing that, but will check on others. This 3rd tier for 1st or 2nd tier SEEMS to have become a problem within the last 6 months or so. I believe that is the correct time frame.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

I will do that. I know my people aren't doing that, but will check on others. This 3rd tier for 1st or 2nd tier SEEMS to have become a problem within the last 6 months or so. I believe that is the correct time frame.

More 6 years, than 6 months, but maybe just your neighborhood has gotten bad recently, since standard goods are not traded server-wide. Also, all the movement of cities to pack the active ones together could make the problem worse for some areas.

 

[samidodamage]

I agree with @Enevhar Aldarion this has been an issue for years. Just searching this Ideas/Suggestions sub-forum for cross trades pulls up posts with ideas to filter out cross trades as far back as 2016. Discussion and Help sub-forums have even more. After the trader star ratings were changed to the current ratios, many players said now cross trades are ok. Veteran players warned of the consequences of everyone building T3 (whether factory or event bldgs doesn't matter. I haven't used factories in years and have millions of T3 goods from event bldgs) to trade downstream for T1/T2 (if everyone did this who's going to have the T1/T2 to trade?). Such warnings were either ignored or the poster was chastised by other players for their failure to understand and participate in an 'open' market. FS's who continued to maintain the rule of 'no cross trades' were lambasted as being 'leftovers from the old era' as well as having ridiculous rules that unfairly kept newer players out of some of the top FS's (for tourney/Spire).
It's always been a problem, and ideas/suggestions have been offered over the years. Most of them have been to have a way to block seeing cross trades. Inno has been pretty consistently opposed to the idea of filters that filter things out other than trader fees. Yes, the FS only filter, for example ends up filtering out the non-FS member trades. But the purpose is not to 'block' seeing trades, it is to prioritize FS member trades. Other filters with the purpose of filtering in things like type of goods offered/demanded are also allowed.
When presented with ideas to filter by star rating, they responded by having the star ratings display sorted by highest star first.
The problem, as I see it*, is the company is highly unlikely to agree to filter out cross trades. That's if you could even get the idea past voting here with some of the staunch defenders of 'free markets'. Developing an idea to filter in 'same tier' trades I think would be better received, but I also think the work to do that may be much harder than to filter out cross trades.
Perhaps it will be easier to get the devs to modify the rewards in event bldgs that add to this problem. Still, I'm pretty sure many players will just switch from event to factory bldgs. And get a huge bump in their ranking scores for doing so! It's just all around easier and cheaper to make T3 and trade downstream for the other goods. As long as players take downstream cross trades, they'll see no reason to change their behavior until there's no one left making T1/T2 who are willing to trade it for useless T3 outside their FS (like me ). Within the FS, it's a way to help one another when needed.

*These are my thoughts only. I have little knowledge of software/coding. I could be completely off base on both the resistance to filtering out trades as well as how hard it would be to filter in trades.

 

[Myne]

Thank you both for your insight!

 

[Deleted User - 849994935]

I agree with @Enevhar Aldarion this has been an issue for years. Just searching this Ideas/Suggestions sub-forum for cross trades pulls up posts with ideas to filter out cross trades as far back as 2016. Discussion and Help sub-forums have even more. After the trader star ratings were changed to the current ratios, many players said now cross trades are ok. Veteran players warned of the consequences of everyone building T3 (whether factory or event bldgs doesn't matter. I haven't used factories in years and have millions of T3 goods from event bldgs) to trade downstream for T1/T2 (if everyone did this who's going to have the T1/T2 to trade?). Such warnings were either ignored or the poster was chastised by other players for their failure to understand and participate in an 'open' market. FS's who continued to maintain the rule of 'no cross trades' were lambasted as being 'leftovers from the old era' as well as having ridiculous rules that unfairly kept newer players out of some of the top FS's (for tourney/Spire).
It's always been a problem, and ideas/suggestions have been offered over the years. Most of them have been to have a way to block seeing cross trades. Inno has been pretty consistently opposed to the idea of filters that filter things out other than trader fees. Yes, the FS only filter, for example ends up filtering out the non-FS member trades. But the purpose is not to 'block' seeing trades, it is to prioritize FS member trades. Other filters with the purpose of filtering in things like type of goods offered/demanded are also allowed.
When presented with ideas to filter by star rating, they responded by having the star ratings display sorted by highest star first.
The problem, as I see it*, is the company is highly unlikely to agree to filter out cross trades. That's if you could even get the idea past voting here with some of the staunch defenders of 'free markets'. Developing an idea to filter in 'same tier' trades I think would be better received, but I also think the work to do that may be much harder than to filter out cross trades.
Perhaps it will be easier to get the devs to modify the rewards in event bldgs that add to this problem. Still, I'm pretty sure many players will just switch from event to factory bldgs. And get a huge bump in their ranking scores for doing so! It's just all around easier and cheaper to make T3 and trade downstream for the other goods. As long as players take downstream cross trades, they'll see no reason to change their behavior until there's no one left making T1/T2 who are willing to trade it for useless T3 outside their FS (like me ). Within the FS, it's a way to help one another when needed.

*These are my thoughts only. I have little knowledge of software/coding. I could be completely off base on both the resistance to filtering out trades as well as how hard it would be to filter in trades.

I don't no if its relevant or not but I think the new tech tree kind of encourages little cities to trade t1 & T2 for t3. Even tho I've unlocked t3 manufacturing I dnt have the pop, space & resources for t3 production yet & given I can't do tourney or spire & my relic level is low I'm better off trading for t3.

 

[Salator]

Well, I am sure I do not have the technical knowledge to give authority to what I have to say....all I know is that it is a real problem for me to get tier for tier trades. I have a small fellowship run by my alter ego in which I am thinking very seriously that I need to ban all cross-tier trading. Although, the issue of event buildings contributing to a need for cross-tier trades makes me hesitate to do that. Also......After reading input in this thread, I am considering banning the building of only T3 buildings....IMHO, that only acerbates the problem immensely. I will have to check my FS to see if anyone is doing that. This game is really becoming much like work. Sigh.

 

[actualfantasy]

In the event now ongoing, I received the building to do tier3 goods. I was disappointed since all I see in our trading area is Tier 3 goods being put up for cross-tier trades. I have a lot of Tier3 and lack or could use more Tier 1 and 2 goods. I am in the S and Dragon chapter. I have kept the building because I do not know what is ahead and feel that the game gave me that one for a reason. Now I do know I don't get what I need on a regular basis, so I question if I should save this building. Cross trading has become more than was expected in my Fellowship. We never allowed cross trading but with so much of it, Our Archimage is allowing it. Once again, it seems each FS is going to have to decide what is best for them. If the game developer can find a way to balance the goods, it would be great. no easy answer? Maybe not. Just do what is best in your Fellowship and for you for now.

 

[Myne]

I don't no if its relevant or not but I think the new tech tree kind of encourages little cities to trade t1 & T2 for t3. Even tho I've unlocked t3 manufacturing I dnt have the pop, space & resources for t3 production yet & given I can't do tourney or spire & my relic level is low I'm better off trading for t3.

You have the opposite problem. Most folks are trying to get rid of t3. lol In my baby city, my crunch seems to be t2 stuff

 

[Myne]

Well, I am sure I do not have the technical knowledge to give authority to what I have to say....all I know is that it is a real problem for me to get tier for tier trades. I have a small fellowship run by my alter ego in which I am thinking very seriously that I need to ban all cross-tier trading. Although, the issue of event buildings contributing to a need for cross-tier trades makes me hesitate to do that. Also......After reading input in this thread, I am considering banning the building of only T3 buildings....IMHO, that only acerbates the problem immensely. I will have to check my FS to see if anyone is doing that. This game is really becoming much like work. Sigh.

This is really a game of patience. You are having the same issue many are having. It is aggravated by the t3 imbalance