Scrolls Issue

[mikeledo]

I have discovered I am the main problem of the excess scrolls issue. Guys like myself in their quest for CC spells build many Moonlibraries. I figure I make 100K+ scrolls per day on this complex, not counting anything I might be getting off an evolve building somewhere. With an AW giving us CC spells for completed crafting, I might be able to ween myself off the Moonlibraries, slowly placing them back in storage. I don't think INNO anticipated folks placing more than one or two libraries. Between the new limited availability and hopefully folks removing them as they build up their AW to replace them, we may get back to normal.

 

[Alram]

I disagree. Most people just will keep all their libraries AND have the new building too.

 

[mikeledo]

I am looking to ween myself off to be a team player. It is not all about me.

 

[samidodamage]

My Ch16 crystal boosted city is a perfect example of this. I have 10 library sets out for 10CC's/day. I use those CC's a lot during the FA's especially for the residue badges and they also give me Druid Staffs. I'm not going to sacrifice being a team player in the FA; I'll keep my library sets. The AW that gives CC's is not available until the end of Ch17. It doesn't give 10 CC's until it's lvl 21 and you only get them when you open a mystical object in crafting. Then, I'd have to produce 100 Vision Vapors/day to match my current Ch16 production even after I got it to lvl 21! For me, it probably won't be worth the13,600kp, and the 3 million sentient 3 goods to get it to lvl 21. I'll probably pass on that AW.
How I've handled not becoming part of the problem in trading is to just ignore how many scrolls I have in inventory and not try to trade them for anything. I still take scrolls for my crystal from FS members boosted in scrolls. I do the same for neighbors that are scroll boosted, but I won't take them from players that are not scroll boosted. It does mean I'm slower to pick up neighbor trades unless they're ones that have been around for a couple years and I already know they're scroll boosted. I'll take the tiny scroll trades from new cities without looking first, but not large scroll trades.
That does mean I'll reach 40 million scrolls tomorrow morning when I next collect those sets, but I figure they're not hurting anything just sitting there. Same with having reached 1 million spell fragments in that city from the same set bldgs; they're not hurting anything. I did have to get used to the inventory looking so skewed, though! ~6million each of crystal/silk makes 40mil scrolls look really odd in the T2 lineup, lol.

 

[StarLoad]

Yes, on my main account (Arendyll) I have 6 Library sets out and 4 more in storage, the CC are nice and well above what I could make in the MA, but the Scroll and Tree Gum imbalance is now running 3:1 over the boosted items.
On my secondary account (Elcy) 2 sets running and 7 in storage, but here I am boosted in Scrolls and Tree gum so its more imbalanced and sitting at 5:1 and growing. I have cut back on the MFG as a result.

 

[Iyapo1]

I am also part of the problem. I have a scroll boosted chapter 7 city with 4 library sets out. My libraries are staying put until I have a healthy pile of CCs and Frags. Then I will carefully teleport them out for space. I think we all agree they are fabulous...and they really suck! I am trying to offset my contribution by growing a BTG.

 

[mikeledo]

I have shifted down from 9 to 8 and another has 7. The question is CC sustainability. At my levels, my spells are 200-300 inventory range. Certainly, I don't need to go above that. I also know at 1 library my inventory of spells drops quickly. I am thinking about 4. I don't craft CC spells in the MA. That is for MM for sentient goods.

 

[NightshadeCS]

Somewhere there is a thread about fitting in more Moonstone Libraries with fewer Endless Scroll buildings. I think you can get full connections on 4 ML with just 1 ES. That will at least decrease the scrolls you are getting from all those sets.

 

[crackie]

I am also part of the problem. I have a scroll boosted chapter 7 city with 4 library sets out. My libraries are staying put until I have a healthy pile of CCs and Frags. Then I will carefully teleport them out for space. I think we all agree they are fabulous...and they really suck! I am trying to offset my contribution by growing a BTG.

Would you be making enough scrolls relying on the libraries alone at Chap 7? I have a scroll boosted Chap 6 city with 7 libraries and 0 scroll manus out. The moonstones aren't making enough for me to be self-sustaining on them alone, but I think it's because I won the libraries really early (some in Chap 3) and they're taking forever to upgrade. The reason I'm playing with no scroll manus is more because we have a bunch of big cities in the FS that are scroll boosted and I didn't feel like competing with them for crumbs trying to get silk/crystals when everyone is full after eating their large scroll trades. I'm asking because I'm wondering at what chapter would I be able to sustain my T2's on libraries alone?

 

[Iyapo1]

Would you be making enough scrolls relying on the libraries alone at Chap 7?

No, I have 3 manufactories and 4 library sets, and it's not enough, I am having a siesta at the end of faries waiting on enough RRs to pull them up but even then it wont be enough. I cater and I am a spire junky, I go through a lot of goods!

 

[samidodamage]

I'm asking because I'm wondering at what chapter would I be able to sustain my T2's on libraries alone?

I think it depends on your playstyle. Since I prefer combat and use it 100% in the Spire and 90% in the tourneys, I have less need for the goods than someone who has a more balanced approach. For primarily combat cities, I don't know what chapter it starts. My scroll boosted city is Ch15. I have 2 Ch12(Elementals) and 4 Ch13(Amuni) libraries out and all my scroll factories are in inventory (with the hope they'll eventually do something about the scroll glut and I'll need them again). I won't waste RR's upgrading my libraries because I have them for the CC's and the scrolls are just a byproduct. I have a couple event bldgs that give T2 goods that help with crystal/silk, but I'm doing fine without the scroll factories.
My inventory of CC spells right now is 437 (it was ~550 before the FA started). I got it that high because another peculiarity of mine is I stay between chapters a long time (months). During that time, I had 9 more library sets out in the guest race space. In addition to developing a huge inventory of CC's I also developed a huge inventory of scrolls. There are also FS members there who take my scroll trades when I need more of the crystal/silk. That city has 16million scrolls to the ~3million crystal/silk sitting in inventory.

 

[ajqtrz]

I'm in chapter 16 and am scroll boosted. I have 8 moonstone sets out and a lot more endless scrolls. I have no scroll mfrs because I don't need them. I produce a small to medium surplus of scrolls and just sell them off at a discount....usually between 15 and 25 percent. To me that's just adjusting to market conditions. It works well enough for me that I seldom have an imbalance in my T2 at all.

So we each find a way to "fix" the imbalance that suits us, don't we?

AJ

 

[OIM20]

With an AW giving us CC spells for completed crafting,

Just FYI, @Sprite1313 actually suggested a new craftable/event-then-craftable building set with CCs being a part of the rewards. It was forwarded to the devs. Details: https://us.forum.elvenar.com/index.php?threads/new-craftable-set-building-s.26706/

I think I'd rather a building set than an AW, but I'm curious as to how an AW would work in this instance. Would it work similarly to the Tome of Secrets or Endless Excavation, gradually building to a cap of 6 per [limited event]*? And if so, would there be an additional benefit? Both of the aforementioned AWs give supplies based on a percentage and the level of the AW. Would this AW be more focused on whatever chapter 2x's (I read in some thread they have up to chapter 21 planned out already - I'd have to dig for it, and I can't remember which of the regulars mentioned it) intended introduction material is? The "ascended goods" that now show in the main hall relics page?

Just asking questions 'cause I'd like to know what you had in mind. I supported the above-linked thread and would definitely be interested in a path to CCs that didn't rely on the RNG and me hoping that everyone else in my FS who can decides to play Spire that week. ('Cause the MA is slow and manufacturing CCs just to spend them on time boosters to then spend those to manufacture more CCs is incredibly counter-productive.)

*[limited event] for Tome of Secrets is daily, for Endless Excavation is per province. You mentioned crafting, so would the limiter be based on the same 100 VV that is required to open the chest in the MA?

--Not trying to hijack your discussion on scrolls production, just focused on a different part of opening post. Please continue.

 

[Deborah M]

I am looking to ween myself off to be a team player. It is not all about me.

Exactly how I feel I have zero library sets and most in my fellowship also don't have them. I get/make enough CC that I'm fine without it. I wish I felt like I could go back to picking up more scroll trades for FS & neighbors if I don't have extra scrolls coming from the set. I'm thinking that maybe Elvenar will come up with more use for scrolls to work the accumulations down. That would be an easy way for them to adjust the imbalance.

 

[samidodamage]

Just asking questions 'cause I'd like to know what you had in mind.

would the limiter be based on the same 100 VV that is required to open the chest in the MA?

He was talking about the AW that has already been developed and the tech to activate it is at the end of Ch17. You can find the details in the Wiki at: Dragon Ark
Basically you get CC's when you open a Mystical Object in crafting. It starts by giving 2 CC's each time at lvl 1 and maxes out at 14CC's per Mystical Object at lvl 35.
Chapter 18 is in beta testing now, the new goods are able to be seen (but locked) in the relics tab of your Main Hall in live cities, along with the goods for Ch19 and Ch20. The AW's they'll give at the end of each of those chapters when released have also already been developed. So any AW suggestion we might come up with would not be implemented before the end of Ch21. With a new chapter release happening on live ~every 6 months or so, we're looking at ~18months before the release of Ch21 if Ch18 is released live soon.

 

[OIM20]

He was talking about the AW that has already been developed and the tech to activate it is at the end of Ch17. You can find the details in the Wiki at: Dragon Ark

Oh! Thanks! I feel like this is a doh! moment, but also not since I learned something.

 

[Darielle]

I have four moonstone libraries, all in storage. I prefer having a ton of gates, mana plants, gum trees and endless scrolls out for full boosts. The mana and seeds I get from these, in addition to the few scrolls, are worth a lot more to me than the libraries' output, since you get a lot more from a 4x4 square of those, strategically placed to get full boosts, than you do from a 4x4 library. Per square it makes sense to me. But despite the few endless scrolls in the mix, I sometimes run low on scrolls and have to trade my boosted silk for it. That works out great for scroll neighbors and it's fine with me. I never have my silk trades last very long when I ask for scrolls, so it works for me.

 

[The Fairy]

Somewhere there is a thread about fitting in more Moonstone Libraries with fewer Endless Scroll buildings. I think you can get full connections on 4 ML with just 1 ES.

Like this?

I too, have a hate-love relation to my library set. I love it for its mana, seeds and catalysts. But hate it for destroying it for especially scrolls/gum/bismuth players

I have tried to optimize my set to give as few of the unwanted goods as possible, but it still give huge amounts of scrolls All my buildings should be at max set bonus:

• 36 mana plants, chapter 10+12 (they should be at least chapter 9 such that they give mana)
• 40 gum trees, all in chapter 11 (the only chapter where they give seeds!)
• 5 moonstone gates to max out the set bonus for gum trees and mana plants (4 in chapter 11 giving seeds, 1 in chapter 12 giving moonstone - I can replace that one with a chapter 10 if moonstone turns out to be a problem but it doesn't look like it so far, they should be before chapter 14 so they don't start producing bismuth)
• 8 libraries, chapter 11-12. I have those for the catalysts. Unfortunately they also give a lot of scrolls
• 2 endless scrolls to max out set bonus for my libraries.

The only buildings I would like to chapter upgrade are my mana plants if I start struggling with mana. I am currently in chapter 14.

Maybe we should suggest that it is possible to chapter downgrade buildings - that could solve the gum/bismuth problems and I find that e.g. gum trees are a lot more useful when they give seed instead of gum!

 

[Darielle]

Maybe we should suggest that it is possible to chapter downgrade buildings - that could solve the gum/bismuth problems and I find that e.g. gum trees are a lot more useful when they give seed instead of gum!

I really wish we could do that. I'm lucky I didn't accidentally upgrade the wrong thing the other day, when I would have gone from seeds to moonstone. I agree; seeds are so much more useful.

 

[crackie]

I used to just replace old ones when I thought they were permanent fixtures in the Spire. Now that I can't replace them anymore, I'm in a predicament because my baby city won a bunch way back in Chap 3. Even though I'm keeping them mostly for the CC making, I figured I ought to get some pop back for the space they take up and Chap 3 anything is woeful as you continue to chapter. They also give enough culture that they're one of the buildings that always get polished if they get upgraded, which is another bonus. As they get more current, I'm also hoping it'll help with my zero T2 experiment too. Since it's taking forever to get enough RRs to upgrade 7 libraries though, I've not even thought that far ahead about what I'm going to do with my gum/mana/gate/endless scrolls. So y'all are saying it's worth it to get the accessory components to mana/seed stages too, but stop there before it turns to gum and bismuth?