Winning at combat

[DeletedUser1989]

Is there anyone out there actually winning?
Not just a stray site but regularly and working into provinces?
and I do not mean as often as before the change but maybe a few sites a week?

I see nothing but hopelessness in the comments here, from my fellowships and anywhere else

 

[DeletedUser4778]

I am and so are a few others. However, I have not "overconquered". "Overscouted" yes but not "overconquered".

Edit: I was always "overconquered" in previous chapters but the new battle system slowed me down a lot.

 

[DeletedUser3297]

Yes, I still fight and win most battles with minimal losses and will be 114/100 provinces complete by tomorrow. So I guess I am just a little overconquered

 

[DeletedUser4417]

Is there anyone out there actually winning?
Not just a stray site but regularly and working into provinces?
and I do not mean as often as before the change but maybe a few sites a week?

I see nothing but hopelessness in the comments here, from my fellowships and anywhere else

Yes. People are still winning and regularly.

What you see here, if you sit and take the time to read into them are the advanced players. They cannot win because they are too far ahead as with the changes to the game they have now over-conquered and over-scouted. This puts them into a negative bias for the most part and in that they lose objectivity. Some are too focused on what was and not what is.

Don't lose hope. Keep plugging along and take the time to figure out the battle pentagram. Form your own opinion and don't let other form it for you.

 

[DeletedUser2963]

Still winning here, I have two cities a ch2 and a ch6
https://us.forum.elvenar.com/index.php?threads/mykans-guide-fighting-guide.4205/
This is a wonderful guide to the new system. Early chapter players need to actually read the text below the pretty graphics. Late chapter players can just look at the pretty pictures Mykan made.

There does however seem to be a nasty imbalance with the battles in ring 4, chapter 2/3. Players in this area are currently being forced to negotiate allot. It evens out near the end of the third chapter.

Several of us started cities just so we could get into that area and give inno feed back so they can fix it.

 

[DeletedUser4329]

Yes. People are still winning and regularly.

What you see here, if you sit and take the time to read into them are the advanced players. They cannot win because they are too far ahead as with the changes to the game they have now over-conquered and over-scouted. This puts them into a negative bias for the most part and in that they lose objectivity. Some are too focused on what was and not what is.

Don't lose hope. Keep plugging along and take the time to figure out the battle pentagram. Form your own opinion and don't let other form it for you.

Not liking the changes isn't "biased" - it's just not liking the changes. Characterising someone else's perfectly valid viewpoint as biased, is in fact an example of bias! Way to shoot an own goal there champ.

I'm a new player and happen to think the changes are silly and unwarranted. How does that fit into your narrative?

FWIW, I've switched from fighting/negotiating to just negotiating and am still powering through provinces. This concept of "over-scouting" needs to go away - it's what the game encourages and expects you to do! Someone playing the game who doesn't read the forums would have no idea that they were "over-scouting" and would just keep on playing thinking the battle design is borked. It's a horribly contradictory and schizophrenic approach to game design, very much amateur hour stuff.

I expect to hit a hard wall when it comes to requiring Orcs for negotiating, and maybe that'll be the signal to stop playing. Who knows?

 

[DeletedUser2963]

I'm a new player

FWIW, I've switched from fighting/negotiating to just negotiating and am still powering through provinces.

Ring 4? Allot of new players are hitting a battle wall there, they cant win at all until near the end of chapter 3. Did you pay attention to troop mixes when you powered through?

 

[DeletedUser4329]

Did you pay attention to troop mixes when you powered through?

Very much so - I was initially excited by the battle pentagram because it brought some certainty and predictability to the table, as well as making the choice of troops for your team even more important strategically.

The reality unfortunately, was a big fat flop. The battle pentagram is still a great idea, but very (very) poorly executed. Once again, amateur hour stuff from the game designer.

 

[DeletedUser2963]

Pentagon, its a pentagon not a pentagram you heathen...Well a pentagon with a pentagram drawn in it, but for search purposes new players will get better results with pentagon.

I love the pentagram!!gon!! I use it to great effect! Limited in my chapter 2 as I only have two troop types! But in my chapter 6 city, that thing is wonderful. To be fair, I do not send new players to the pentagram/gon. I send them to Mykans guide, he broke it down by province.

 

[DeletedUser4417]

Not liking the changes isn't "biased" - it's just not liking the changes. Characterising someone else's perfectly valid viewpoint as biased, is in fact an example of bias! Way to shoot an own goal there champ.

I'm a new player and happen to think the changes are silly and unwarranted. How does that fit into your narrative?

FWIW, I've switched from fighting/negotiating to just negotiating and am still powering through provinces. This concept of "over-scouting" needs to go away - it's what the game encourages and expects you to do! Someone playing the game who doesn't read the forums would have no idea that they were "over-scouting" and would just keep on playing thinking the battle design is borked. It's a horribly contradictory and schizophrenic approach to game design, very much amateur hour stuff.

I expect to hit a hard wall when it comes to requiring Orcs for negotiating, and maybe that'll be the signal to stop playing. Who knows?

Guessing you did not catch on the part where I said 'negative bias.' Everyone has a bias when looking at an issue, everyone. Some are negative, some are positive. So no, not shooting my own goal but I did score.

The game expects you to scout to a point, yes, it also expects you to figure things out on your own to a good degree and provides all the tools to do so. People will and do eventually figure out that battles/negotiations are rough and expensive and that scouts are long but that once they unlock that Advanced scouting tech each and every time those things lesson by dramatic amounts. Enemy force numbers drop significantly, scout times go down as well as cost less and negotiating costs a lot less.

 

[DeletedUser2963]

once they unlock that Advanced scouting tech each and every time those things lesson by dramatic amounts. Enemy force numbers drop significantly, scout times go down as well as cost less and negotiating costs a lot less.

This is an excellent point. The key to sill winning battles is right there. Try not to scout to far over the number of provinces required to open the chest at the end of each chapter. Try to keep your scouts working inside the ring you "should be in". If you do this you will be in the "goldilocks zone". You will outnumber your enemies and be able to win. With the exception noted above...there is a six province block of nasty in chapter 2/3 ring 4 ( a good fellowship can pretty easily get you the goods to negotiate past this)

 

[SoggyShorts]

there is a six province block of nasty in chapter 2/3 ring 4 ( a good fellowship can pretty easily get you the goods to negotiate past this)

I'm STILL working on training enough troops to give ring 4 a shot with max chapter 2 army. I need to clear 6 of em, and I refuse to negotiate or manual fight. It's a Beta account, so I'm trying to treat it like the testing ground it should be =)

 

[DeletedUser594]

Refuse to manual fight? You insist on this AI making sensible choices?

 

[SoggyShorts]

Refuse to manual fight? You insist on this AI making sensible choices?

Just on Beta. I don't take that account seriously, and IMO the fights should be balanced so that when you are
1. under the next chest requirement for provinces cleared
2. have all available upgrades for your army
3. use the ideal troops vs what you are facing

you should be able to win most fights.

EDIT: I don't know what INNOs ideal version of difficulty is, but if I could wave a wand and magically balance the fights you'd lose
0.25-1.25 squads on manual playing smart, and
0.75-2.0 squads on auto
with the higher losses coming as you get closer to the chest requirements.
EDIT2: I'm used to having Beta accounts on other games where you are really just there to test things. Many games even wipe the Beta server once in a while so everyone can start a new thing on an even field , but INNO sells diamonds on Beta so that wouldn't be a great idea...but imagine how awesome the forums would be for a couple hours heheehheeh

 

[DeletedUser594]

The new system set so that you can win fights up until your squads are outsized by 2:1. I am in Orc tech and I have some territories open in multiple rings. Orcs would correspond to ring 11. Here's a picture with armies from rings 10-12. The squad size differential is listed along with the ring number. The difference in difficulty is vast. I can auto fight ring 10, work at a steady pace through 11 with low to moderate losses, and barely dent ring 12 with heavy losses.
This is all to say that yes you can fight- but you will hit the limits of your troops current squad size and will need to wait until your squads size goes up again before venturing further.

Spoiler: ss

(Enemy squad size (SS) * number of enemy squads)/5=Adjusted enemy SS
Adjusted enemy SS/ your SS= Differential

 

[DeletedUser1989]

Lyapo Thanks for the fighting guide. It will give me something to try.

My first forays in the system using the guide the developers provided were a disaster
Even the match ups they suggested did next to nothing against my opponents
The supposed best match ups only meant my units survived an extra hit or so
A week of efforts in trying different things resulted in me winning one site in a province

It was so much of a disaster that I gave up on fighting all together and i went off hardcore. I sold off my armories to develop more manufactories for negotiation
I do not mind the rebuild just to try again. That sell button is still there
Thanks for the renewed hope in the system
I hope it is worth it

 

[DeletedUser43]

This puts them into a negative bias for the most part and in that they lose objectivity.

As usual the player bashers pounce on anyone who dares to say they are not happy with the new system. Lose objectivity? How flipping rude! Why is this player bashing continually allowed?

Why are some people over speaking about this issue everywhere on this forum? They over speak and over analyze things they have under information about.

The new system set so that you can win fights up until your squads are outsized by 2:1.

I agree Varron, but o

nly the most experienced expert fighters have any chance of getting anywhere near that. I think the bar is set way too high. Most of our players are not expert fighters. Most are people who want a city builder and they shouldn't have to spend weeks studying some guide just to be able to have a little fun with the battles. OBJECTIVELY, the fights should be something that most players can do most of the time because it is a fun thing to do and this game should offer more fun things. If they wanted to put in even more blocks to expansions than they already had, there were many other ways than nerfing the fun out of the game. Remember, this is a game. For fun. To enjoy. And have FUN.

Welcome to the forum TheGreyman. FYI....these player pouncers don't speak for most players, and they violate the forum rules every time they attack anyone who graciously takes the time out of their day to offer valuable feedback to the company. There is a block feature. You just click on the person's name and click ignore.

Thanks for the renewed hope in the system

Don't get your hopes up too much. You can only win if you happen to be in a teeny tiny sweet spot where you have unlocked enough of the tech, but have decided to forgo your expansions because you sit on your hands and don't scout anything. Your choice is either to have a lot less room to build things in this city builder, or maybe be able to win a battle. But yes, you are much better off with the player's guides than anything the game has put out!!!

 

[DeletedUser4417]

As usual the player bashers pounce on anyone who dares to say they are not happy with the new system. Lose objectivity? How flipping rude! Why is this player bashing continually allowed?

Why are some people over speaking about this issue everywhere on this forum? They over speak and over analyze things they have under information about.

And as usual... no one is bashing players but yet BobbyKitty, ONCE AGAIN, fails to read... it's always "oh they are bashing the poor players again" when the evidence speaks strongly to the contrary... No one is bashing or has bashed players BobbyKitty, what we have however done is describe the system as it is now. Stop with the theatrics already, THAT is what is rude.

Under information about? We have the same information that everyone else has and yet you don't seem to understand no matter how many times it is explained and pointed out to you.

FYI....these player pouncers don't speak for most players, and they violate the forum rules every time they attack anyone who graciously takes the time out of their day to offer valuable feedback to the company. There is a block feature. You just click on the person's name and click ignore.

For your information BobbyKitty, no one has been pounced or attacked. In case it skipped your notice, you are not a Moderator and you clearly don't know the simple rules that they post up for everyone to read and see.

You can only win if you happen to be in a teeny tiny sweet spot where you have unlocked enough of the tech, but have decided to forgo your expansions because you sit on your hands and don't scout anything.

Untrue. BobbyKitty is prone to over-dramatics. The 'teeny tiny sweet spot' happens to be about 30 provinces or so.. in EVERY chapter so no, quietly literally NOT a teeny tiny area at all.

 

[DeletedUser43]

over-conquered and over-scouted. This puts them into a negative bias for the most part and in that they lose objectivity. Some are too focused on what was and not what is.

Such kind flattering and loving terms they.

no one is bashing players

Delusional much?

What you see here, if you sit and take the time to read into them are the advanced players.

That is flat out false. In fact, there is a thread, started by YOU, that asks the devs to work on the level of fighting difficulty for the beginning players because the battles are way out of line for them. And I provided you pages and pages and pages of players comments of all levels saying how much battles are impossible for them to win.

 

[DeletedUser43]

Lest anyone get confused by the players who are over talking, here is a list of players of all levels who are unhappy about the battle situation.

Karon Donahue · 0:07 I keep on having to negotiate rather than do battle because either I'm not able to have a large enough fighting force, or my units are too weak. It's frustrating. So; for now I don't fight at all, I just build. I just worked through the treasure chest and see that I'll be able to get Golems before long. I hope that changes things.

Catherine Wilson · 0:00 I dont understand how you can say that it is something we can get used to..... its literally impossible even if you took away the random generated terrain which might end up being a bit unfair, or the auto fight system losing more troops than the manual fight......the big elephant in the room no one seems to be able to address is that the enemy squad sizes are 4 TIMES STRONGER with generally much harder squad types already in play. It is impossible and quite frankly it is just so that we spend more resources on negotiating and therefore may end up buying diamonds. Be honest. You made this move so that you can make some more money. Thats fine, but don't make it impossible ! Take the ratio down to 1:2 at least then we might have a chance at fighting. At the moment I have never won a battle since the new system was in place, even when pitting full Paladin troops against light melee units. There are so many that they are impossible to win against. Take the squad sizes down !!!


Helen Bach · 0:46 My troops are getting slaughtered

Sylvia Veronica Mastenbroek · 0:24 i stil cant work the battle system out i stil keep losing, i used to win but now almost get slaughterd ever time i try to do a province.

Cécile LP · 23:39
Translated from French
Frankly, it's a bad decision for the that this change in the fighting. He comes too early and demotivates already the few players motivated and active, in any case this is what I found after conversations with other players of the French community.

Babas Angran · 0:00
Translated from French
Since their update, almost anyone can make of the fighting, the only chance forward and negotiate, really not a good update except for those who was already in a very high level, on a world those who are like me at the level 3, the whole map are inactive, he abandons the fur and extent, we're not ready in advance

Virginia Banks · 28:52 I'm seriously thinking on cutting back on my armories and building up my boosted good manufacturies even more than they are so I can negotiate and trade faster and better. Battles seem very un-winnable. I love the game but it might be time to re-think how I play.

Christophe Massucco · automatically translated.
Stop playing the autistic and pretend that your redesign is a success... you don't have much managed to piss off a large number of players! The changes have been poorly thought: if you had really thought about it, the fact that the ai does not adjust to your new combat system should have to alert you on the fact that trying to erase some imbalances (which could be necessary, I Admit it), you were intrinsically rendered the fighting more complex. What is more, their implementation has been abysmal, the fact is deficient of tests or a not taking into account the results of tests, and planning for the least random (why spread this disaster on 2 months? ). Finally your communication, ignoring real problems and pretending that everything was fine in the best of all possible worlds, is simply stupid... stop to the policy of the ostrich!

Deni Hill · 0:33 Nope, it got too complicated and hard so I stopped fighting.

Michaela Gray · 0:00 Even if I were to understand the enemy, I can't win against troops twice as big as mine and more of them. Wasn't hard to figure out either! Manual or Auto, it does not matter, it's a no win situation and frustrating, not any fun. Takes hours to build a troop and it's gone trying to win just 1 Encounter, that's just not fair. Changing the rules to our disadvantage in the middle of a game is very bad taste to say it politely. How about coming up with something positive,so we can all enjoy playing again???

Neil Murphy · 0:00 its impossible too win ive tried everything

Paul Holtman · 4:05 i have top level troops across the board, human, used to be at least battle in tournaments if i took the time, thru tour province spot 8 thru 8 rounds, now i cant even get past round 5, and i have top level troops.

Simone Giraldo · 0:00 i can't understand why so many like here. Still battle are not possible, and today i found a new strong enemy (a goblin) is put as a defender of a province against my soldiers, and note i'm 15 province less than requested to unlock next level.

Colin Freeth · 11:28 why have you spoilt the game by making the battle system so hard. you have taken the enjoyment out of the game. Is was fairly well balanced before, now its just a waste of time.

Gilles Hemon · 0:04 The fighting became really too hard and even in my case impossible,, I think I quit the game as auitres colleagues elsewhere if you don't do anything at this level!!

Ivy R Hiller · 2:48 I always won more playing in auto & now I don't win at all since the changes.....Plus my white surrender flag doesn't work.

Kathleen MacDonald Lake · 3:32 I've stopped training my troops. No way I can win. Wish I could sell back everything related to fighting. It was fun but not anymore.

Jamie Lafferty Richey · 0:00 The changes are I am now unable to win a battle and I am getting my aspirin handed to me!

Berna Figueredo · 2:16 The tournament battles are impossible to win

Amy Wench · 20:56 After the new battle system change it's become highly uneven. I destroyed all my armories and now just negotiate everything!

Rhonda Schmeltz · 0:00 its too hard!!!!!

Rosangela Rodriguez · 0:00 you have ruined the game, fix the battle system

Elisabeth Dalver · 0:00 It's a bummer it is impossible to win a single game

Heather Holley · 6:42 I cant not win a battle at all since the changes...and this is the same for basically everyone in my fellowship. Why did you make this so hard!! I love the game but this is seriously discouraging! Also, when I go to my fight screen I dont have any menus that show what units are better/worse then the other units like you are showing.

Ian Wuolle · 0:00 and if i absolutely have to watch videos or go to the forums and spend hours researching how to.... the game is not worth playing, design it so people can figure it out with regular gameplay or dont bother changing it.

Clifford Kinnett · 15:27 With the new battle system I cannot win any battles. If this setup remains unchanged I will lose interest and quit playing.

Luisa Simoes Keenan · 6:42 All I am hearing is ........ I lost trying all unites on the same battle , so it is not a question of different fighters .. come on ...

Mark Taylor · 0:00 You want to 'fix' the Battle system? Have the casualties count in a 'round 2' (or more, if needed). This way people can actually whittle-down their opponent. Otherwise, its not really a battle system at all. I can't remember the last time I won a battle, before OR after the changes. I'm never going to build that training ground - just another useless building taking up valuable space.

Case Casey · 0:00 can't win any battles at all.... game sux now

Paula Sandlin · 0:00 THE FIGHTING IS TOO HARD NOW! It would be great if you could adjust this!