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Adjust spire set goods output

Adjust spire set goods output


  • Total voters
    61
  • Poll closed .

Kekune

Well-Known Member
the things I would be in favor of changing would require a different suggestion thread, such as changing the link bonus in the Endless Scrolls from more scrolls to either Ink or Velvet
You have one city in this name which makes sentient goods. You are boosted in obsidian. You think the set should make YOUR boost +1 or boost +2, but don't think that should be true for everyone? Really?
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Well-Known Member
You have one city in this name which makes sentient goods. You are boosted in obsidian. You think the set should make YOUR boost +1 or boost +2, but don't think that should be true for everyone? Really?

I think it could be changed to one of those two because they still fit the theme of it being a Library.
 

Ashrem

Well-Known Member
Crazy, Ash, Kek, & Atagus,

"Why not either add more pieces that could change the production to the desired one, or just
have more sets rotate within the prizes for the Spire." - was 1 of my quotes...
Because asking the developers to turn a set of five buildings into a set of seven buildings that all fit together is a much bigger ask than asking them to set one or two of the buildings to Boost+1 (a category of buildings which already exists and is known to work) instead of scrolls. And it immediately fixes the influx of scrolls problem, instead of slowly balancing it over several months as people get new buildings and decide to tear down the old ones.
 

Kekune

Well-Known Member
the real problem here is not the glut
of scrolls...

Plain and simple, its the glut of the same set offered for too long in a weekly draw event.
This is true. But the horse is out of the barn. People have these buildings, and they're wrecking the economy. CrazyWizard explained the challenges of correcting that with other building types.

I suppose we could suggest taking them away, but then there's this problem:
They might have paid diamonds or played longer in Spire than normal had they not wanted the MoonstoneLibrary set. I don't see punishing them the logical choice.
I agree players shouldn't be punished. Changing the output type seems like the most logical, practical method to resolve the imbalance without taking anything away from anybody. Everyone gets to keep their buildings, and gets useful goods. Most people will actually come out ahead.
 
Last edited:

samidodamage

Buddy Fan Club member

BrinDarby

Well-Known Member
@CrazyWizard , is correct, only takes 1 connection for max scrolls....

I have more than 5 pieces for AirTraders, yet my build conforms to the spirit of the rules
and get max benefit from all 8 pieces, but while building them I realized a core problem
with how the sets react..... this also magnifies the problem with EndlessScroll ....

@Xelenia , please read the following ...

As stated in the set pieces.... "must touch x# of other set pieces"...
what it should say is "must touch x# of other pieces ( 1 must be the main set piece ).
The reason I say this is if all you use is (1) mana plant and (4) Endless Scrolls ...
ALL of the Endless scrolls get the max bonus, and only 9 squares are used.
Who needs the MoonstoneLib main piece @ 4x4 in this case.....

While this change does allow some daisy-chaining of set pieces, it prevents
players from ultra abusing the sets by only using the small pieces such as
using (4) endless Scrolls and (1) gumtree or mana plant ... and getting an
insane output for 0 workers and sucha a small # of squares used.

I do see the issue of only getting 2-3 pieces then getting no bonuses, so
I really understand why any 1 specific piece is not necessary... but for those
players that have multiples , they can really abuse how set pieces work.

Because of this 1 fact.... yes asap chg it to boost+1, but clever ppl will
then just abuse whatever goods you give them.... the solution might
be a bigger problem than the original problem described in this thread.
BrinD
 

Pheryll

Well-Known Member
As stated in the set pieces.... "must touch x# of other set pieces"...
what it should say is "must touch x# of other pieces ( 1 must be the main set piece ).

That does not solve the problem as a whole. Look at my Kirit set. 10 divine seeds shrines and 6 mana shrines surround a 5x3 main piece. Each of the shrines has a density of producing at least as much divine seeds/mana as the best non-set building. They all benefit from 2 links giving them a 2.5 multiplier. So those 16 squares are effectively 40 squares of the best mana/divine seed production that a non-set building can give, plus the 5x3 main piece gives its own benefit. Simply requiring set buildings to touch a designated main piece (which may be arbitrarily assigned as some of the older sets had all pieces have as many connections as the number of unique pieces -1) does not remove the possibility of abuse.

Also sometimes the abuser is the main piece. For example, the frost carved Christmas tree only needs two links to optimize mana production. A set with four trees with 3 small buildings in between proves the highest mana density distributed through a set.
 
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Glimmerite

New Member
Scrolls have been massively (over) represented in trades for years. What boggles my mind is that this game continues to promote this one resource when the worlds I trade in are short, continuously, on silk and crystal.

Off the topic but still related: what is going on with the lack of silk/crystal producers? The ones I know produce massively more T2 than I do, even in the same chapter!, as they know they can get whatever they want with their goods. But I'm sure even they see Scrolls piling up and sitting in corners, not moving. Are those who start and then leave the game as brand new cities disproportionately of Silk/Crystal boosts? What caused the market to flood with Scrolls even before these sets showed up?

The "newer" sets don't solve any problem (I love my library sets, don't get me wrong), but they certainly contribute to the inevitable. Stockpiling goods is fine... until you can't get the goods you need because the market is flooded with goods you can't use. Why aren't there alternatives to the sets in rotation which feature Silk and/or Crystal?

Challenging gameplay is one thing. Handing us a shovel and thinking we are fine with that is something else entirely.
 

Xelenia

Ex-Team Member
@Xelenia , please read the following ...

As stated in the set pieces.... "must touch x# of other set pieces"...
what it should say is "must touch x# of other pieces ( 1 must be the main set piece ).
The reason I say this is if all you use is (1) mana plant and (4) Endless Scrolls ...
ALL of the Endless scrolls get the max bonus, and only 9 squares are used.
Who needs the MoonstoneLib main piece @ 4x4 in this case.....

While this change does allow some daisy-chaining of set pieces, it prevents
players from ultra abusing the sets by only using the small pieces such as
using (4) endless Scrolls and (1) gumtree or mana plant ... and getting an
insane output for 0 workers and sucha a small # of squares used.

I do see the issue of only getting 2-3 pieces then getting no bonuses, so
I really understand why any 1 specific piece is not necessary... but for those
players that have multiples , they can really abuse how set pieces work.

Because of this 1 fact.... yes asap chg it to boost+1, but clever ppl will
then just abuse whatever goods you give them.... the solution might
be a bigger problem than the original problem described in this thread.
BrinD

Good Morning,

I have read the piece you identified above, but I am not sure what exactly I am looking for. As a moderator, I do not have any control what so ever on the development aspects of anything. Is there a concern you will like for me to forward?

Xelie
 

The Fairy

Scroll-Keeper, Buddy Fan Club Member
I am late to the party - but I would be REALLY happy if the library set was changed to give different goods instead of scrolls/dust for everyone! Those boosts are my most common boosts and I have considered dropping some of my cities with those boosts and starting new ones instead just to get new boosts cause it is so hard to trade once I get bigger. My main reason for not doing so is that I would then loose my fire phoenix.
 

The Fairy

Scroll-Keeper, Buddy Fan Club Member
One of the things I love about this game is that it encourages to cooperation e.g. by encouraging trades by giving us different boosts. But when the library set gives the same goods to everyone then it destroys this!
 

nsaplay78

Member
Definitely needs to be changed. Distribution of goods is now way unbalanced penalizing anyone who is unlucky enough to have those goods boosted. Now they have no hope of trading for the other goods because what they make is not in demand by anyone
 

DeletedUser14385

Guest
Very much in favor of the change. When one considers the challenge of balancing team goods production, having a set produce T+1 for many (most?) team members would be a step in supporting fellowships that are unbalanced in goods production, as most fellowships are.
 
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