Battle change

[Lelanya]

No numbers from me, except the troops that are vanishing at an alarming rate. I am never out of balance although I am close on EN2. But it's not there I am having trouble, really, I have mucho resources to compensate.

I am speaking about my Harandar city, and my alt's city here. They are having a lot of trouble fighting; so much so that they are running out of goods as well.

 

[Kawhi is a Raptor]

have had higher losses than normal as well

a number of instances where i would expect to lose 1/2 to 3/4 of a stack and have lost 2 - 3 stacks

 

[SoggyShorts]

No. The changes happened 5 weeks ago and if you read the linked forum discussion
---
No, Leylani. It is a very specific bug fix for a very specific problem that only applies to tournament encounters with more than 5 enem

I would submit that you have misread the beta thread on this. That 5-week old bug is NOT what is being discussed.
When in doubt, assume that the forum mods are wrong and Dony is correct. I've bet on that a few dozen times over the past 5 years and it's never failed.

 

[Heymrdiedier]

I would submit that you have misread the beta thread on this. That 5-week old bug is NOT what is being discussed.
When in doubt, assume that the forum mods are wrong and Dony is correct. I've bet on that a few dozen times over the past 5 years and it's never failed.

I don't think Dony and forum mods are contradicting each other?
Mods saying they implemented a fix for a certain bug 5 weeks ago.

Dony is saying this change has no impact on said bug. So the change has nothing to do with the bug.

It just means the devs fixed the bug in a wrong way, no? Thats how i read it, and that doesn't surprise me

 

[Darielle]

I don't know what changes were made or what happened. I only know that this week, for the first time in I can't remember how long (many months if not year), I lost a fight in province SIX!!!! Give me a break. I checked the troops I selected afterward ... I was so shocked I wanted to see if I'd made a mistake, and I hadn't. Although my fire feeding expired before I realized it, I had a Dwarven Armorer AND a UUU out, along with an ELR. That is utterly laughable. After I fed my phoenix, I was able to fight through to province 28, after which I catered to province 30. This was on the second star, ... not one of the last ones. How it was possible I still don't know, but I'm thinking it must have been a glitch.

 

[Darielle]

By the way, I posted that comment above before I read yours that mentioned province six. What's the deal with province six? Are the "fixers of bugs" in this game nuts?

 

[Lelanya]

Thanks folks!
I surely do know how the difficulty formula is believed to work (keep in mind that @Nightguest said @MinMax Gamer's formula is not precisely accurate). But my cities are rarely out of balance! I am only a wee bit overscouted in my best city, the other 8 are fine. I only may have too many Wonder levels in that same city, or premium expansions, in my two oldest cities, and I am fine there (although it may be a brown bear weekend).

Two of my smaller cities, one in Dwarf and one in Fairy, are in real trouble. And the one in Woodelf is darn close. None of these have Fire Phoenix, mainly because since acquiring a few OP Artifacts, they haven't had room to place one, due to actually puttering through Guest Race productions.

Perhaps there is a re-scaling occurring in relation to the 4 star troop introduction. It seems ridiculous that I have to store GRT buildings to place a Fire Phoenix and forgo research progress in order to tourney effectively.

 

[ajqtrz]

When in doubt, assume that the forum mods are wrong and Dony is correct. I've bet on that a few dozen times over the past 5 years and it's never failed.

Is this sarcasm or are you complimenting Dony? I'm not familiar with that player and thus, it could be either one. I mean some players are very knowledgeable about this game and it's possible they might know something a forum moderator doesn't. After all their forum moderators, not necessarily game moderators.

Sorry for being confused, but it happens.

AJ

 

[Kekune]

Is this sarcasm or are you complimenting Dony? I'm not familiar with that player and thus, it could be either one. I mean some players are very knowledgeable about this game and it's possible they might know something a forum moderator doesn't. After all their forum moderators, not necessarily game moderators.

Sorry for being confused, but it happens.

AJ

Though I wouldn't normally presume to speak for Soggy, as an observer of the beta forum I'm 100% sure he's complimenting Dony, deservedly.

 

[Lelanya]

Dony is "The King of bugs". I am certain Soggy is complimenting his knowledge of Elvenar.

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Dony is one of those data miners who finds out all sorts of stuff by going through the game code and files. And because of that, as soon as something is added to the Beta server, he can almost immediately report all sorts of bugs when they happen. He had details many weeks before chapter 18 was added to Beta, including the new troop upgrades and changes to existing troop skills. It may be one of those changes that is causing this bug.

 

[helya]

There was a bugfix in update 1.128 that slightly changes the values of the attack against a unit with a defense class bonus against the attacker; where the defending unit also suffers from a defense de-buff.

Calculation explanation:

Old calculation: attack is normal, no buff or bonus attMod = 1 + 0 / 100 = 1 defense has a class bonus of 80% and suffers a de-buff of 30% defMod = (1 + 80 / 100) * (1 - 30 / 100) = 1.26 dmg = baseDmg * attMod * (2 - defMod) effective modifier = 0.74

The bias removal calculation (‘2 - defMod’) only works as long as the different def modifiers (bonus or de-buff) are applied alone but stops working when they are more than one. Wanted calculation (double checked with GD): attMod = 1 + 0 / 100 = 1 defMod = (1 - 80 / 100) * (1 + 30 / 100) = 0.26 dmg = baseDmg * attMod * defMod effective modifier = 0.26

This behavior also reflects a little better, that there is no real ‘defense’ value. Calculation is done from attackers perspective.

**Disclaimer I did not create or make any of the above calculations, they were provided to me when the bugfix was implemented. If you ask any questions about them I will simply smile and nod as if they make sense to me. Feel free to ask Nightguest about them, I'm sure he can explain better.

 

[Lelanya]

@helya I completely understand your smile and nod.

 

[Gkyr]

@helya and update 1.128 was when?

 

[SoggyShorts]

@helya and update 1.128 was when?

Live: on April 29th
Beta: on April 09th

 

[Yogi Dave]

**Disclaimer I did not create or make any of the above calculations, they were provided to me when the bugfix was implemented. If you ask any questions about them I will simply smile and nod as if they make sense to me. Feel free to ask Nightguest about them, I'm sure he can explain better

I've read this thread and the one on beta. Normally, I can follow the math, but today it's all geek to me. So, I'm going to quote what Dony who truly is the King of Bugs, wrote to explain what it all means.

"This nerf, bug fix, rebalance, overhaul, call it however you want, will affect mainly average players in first 8 provinces without buffs (aws,buildings,phoenix) because counter units will live longer and do more damage to your units
And second group is high end players where killing counter units will takes them more then double amount of hits compared to before (which will lead to enemy counter units reaching your units and doing damage whereas before they died before doing that)
Obviously huge nerf for manual combat where it will take much more time to finish encounters"

Definition: Counter units are those that are buffed against you.

NOTE: This is not the bug that was 'fixed', but it might be a consequence of the fix. I get confused at this point on bug, bug fix, fixed bug, whatever. Although it's been like this since the latter part of the steel tourney, steel and planks are easier than crystal (even in the new format), so you may not have noticed the affect until this week. …and next week is scrolls.

 

[helya]

@helya and update 1.128 was when?

Live: on April 29th
Beta: on April 09th

What @SoggyShorts said

 

[Gkyr]

Although it's been like this since the latter part of the steel tourney, steel and planks are easier than crystal (even in the new format), so you may not have noticed the affect until this week. …and next week is scrolls.

I think that explains it for me. Thank you. And thank you, @helya .

 

[Darielle]

I've read this thread and the one on beta. Normally, I can follow the math, but today it's all geek to me. So, I'm going to quote what Dony who truly is the King of Bugs, wrote to explain what it all means.

"This nerf, bug fix, rebalance, overhaul, call it however you want, will affect mainly average players in first 8 provinces without buffs (aws,buildings,phoenix) because counter units will live longer and do more damage to your units
And second group is high end players where killing counter units will takes them more then double amount of hits compared to before (which will lead to enemy counter units reaching your units and doing damage whereas before they died before doing that)
Obviously huge nerf for manual combat where it will take much more time to finish encounters"

Definition: Counter units are those that are buffed against you.

NOTE: This is not the bug that was 'fixed', but it might be a consequence of the fix. I get confused at this point on bug, bug fix, fixed bug, whatever. Although it's been like this since the latter part of the steel tourney, steel and planks are easier than crystal (even in the new format), so you may not have noticed the affect until this week. …and next week is scrolls.

Thank you, Yogi. Now I don't have to bother my son (with bachelor degs in math and comp sci) for an explanation. I have to admit, it sucks to lose a province 6 fight for the first time this year and I don't see the reason for it. But at least I understand this part.

 

[Gladiola]

buff and debuff, is that like wax on, wax off?

*upgrades barracks and tries to remember how to do that crane kick thing against which no can do defense*