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    Your Elvenar Team

Spire squad size calc - we need your data!

  • Thread starter Deleted User - 3932582
  • Start date
Enevhar Aldarion

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
@MinMax Gamer with the expansion sale popping up today for everyone, I am thinking you will have a lot of helpers with more expansions placed for the next Spire on Sunday. I have intentionally not done anything on the list of things that may influence squad size, in case this came up before Sunday, and now that it has, I bought two more expansions. So we will see what those on their own do to my numbers.
 

Deleted User - 3932582

Guest
Enevhar Aldarion said:
@MinMax Gamer with the expansion sale popping up today for everyone, I am thinking you will have a lot of helpers with more expansions placed for the next Spire on Sunday. I have intentionally not done anything on the list of things that may influence squad size, in case this came up before Sunday, and now that it has, I bought two more expansions. So we will see what those on their own do to my numbers.
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That would be helpful, even though I can imagine most people would have some AW upgrades mucking things up a bit. I, unfortunately, am going to miss on the expansion as I dumped all my remaining diamonds into Magic Residences a few days ago (seeing how much price jumps up in chapter 16).
 
Enevhar Aldarion

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
MinMax Gamer said:
Another week, another Spire, another bump ;)
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And you are still just looking for the same numbers?

Chapter/Main Hall level/Completed provinces/AW levels/Squad Size/Number of city expansions/Spire squad size 1st floor 1st fight/enemy Spire squad size 1st floor 1st fight?

I was also wondering if anyone's numbers were off because they listed their current chapter, but they had not actually completed the Advanced Scouts research yet, making them count to the game as still being in the previous chapter?
 

Deleted User - 3932582

Guest
Enevhar Aldarion said:
Chapter/Main Hall level/Completed provinces/AW levels/Squad Size/Number of city expansions/Spire squad size 1st floor 1st fight/enemy Spire squad size 1st floor 1st fight?
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Yep. We have eliminated completed provinces, but I figured it would be more confusing to change up the format midway.

As for the chapter numbers - it is quite possible, but largely irrelevant for now. For one, I have looked mostly at the end game scenarios so far. And with sufficient number of datapoints we should converge to the right answer regardless of issues with some of the data. I am sure there are more numbers that are off. For one, no one knows when actually freezing of the Spire parameters does happen. I doubt it happens at the exact timing of Spire spawning for hundreds of thousands of players. In all likelihood, they're snapping parameters some time before that, meaning that some of the parameters (mostly AW levels) likely would be inaccurate if we observe them at Spire spawning or after that. I know I had some AWs finishing upgrading around the time Spire starts - those one can fall either way.
 

Deleted User - 4646370

Guest
PaNonymeB said:
15/35/423/172/3699/109 => 2794/1241 [FR3 - 2020-04-05]
7/19/150/26/429/59 => 392/175 [FR4 - 2020-04-05]

Tech status : on FR3 I ended tech tree, but I skipped optional squad size upgrades in chapters 13 and after, and 3 other optional researches in chapter 15.
On FR4 I'm ending chapter 7, I still have to do 4 techs before advanced scouts. I skipped all optional squad size upgrades except the first one (SSU 5 in chapter 2), and also city expansions 22, 27, 28 and 29 (I will research them when I'll get stuck on tech tree in chapter 8.)
Other remarks : on FR3 i have Simia currently upgrading and 3 expansions in inventory. On FR4 I have 2 expansions in inventory.
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15/35/426/175/3699/109 --> 2805/1246 [FR3 - 2020-04-12]
8/19/161/29/498/63 --> 433/193 [FR4 - 2020-04-12]
In my first city, AW uprgrades are 2 of simia (from L7 to L9) and 1 of timewarp to L8.
In my second city, i upgraded this week Golden Abyss to L8, Mountain Halls to L2 and built Dwarven Bulwark.
I also researched 7 techs : the four I had to do in end of Fairies (2 cultural buildings + squad size upgrade 23 + ancient wonders), Advanced Scouts and Portal in Orcs, and optional city expansion 29 in Fairies.
 
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Deleted User - 1599294

Guest
No changes from last week, (no I didn't take advantage of the province sale), spire troops remained the same
End Chp 15 / MH L35 / Compl Prov 484 / AW Levels 160 / SS 3108 =>Spire SS 3069 / 1363 [2020-04-12] 124 expansions
 

Deleted User - 3932582

Guest
Enevhar Aldarion said:
Does that match up to your numbers for what an expansion is worth?
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Not exactly ;) This round of data with extra expansions is very useful, but it didn't simplified things like I hoped. My previous assumption was that increase per expansion would be constant. Well, this is certainly NOT the case. Your datapoint is clean (no other variables changed), even though you've got 2 expansions and not 1 - and it points towards ~20 points per expansion. I have another datapoint from chapter 4 and only 1 expansion added (nothing else changed) - and that one added only 4 points. There is some less clean data that points in the same direction - e.g. @PaNonymeB above (in chapter 7-8) added 4 more expansions and 3 AW levels - and it only added 41 points in total.

There could be at least a couple of explanations for this. One would be that extra expansions add more points the more of them you have already. E.g. adding expansion #126 adds a lot more than adding expansion #36. This might be similar to how regular squad size upgrades work (e.g. any next one adds more to SS than the previous ones).

Another alternative could be that parameter related to expansions multiplies something rather than adds. This may account for smaller increases in smaller cities.
 
Enevhar Aldarion

Enevhar Aldarion

Oh Wise One
MinMax Gamer said:
There could be at least a couple of explanations for this. One would be that extra expansions add more points the more of them you have already. E.g. adding expansion #126 adds a lot more than adding expansion #36. This might be similar to how regular squad size upgrades work (e.g. any next one adds more to SS than the previous ones).

Another alternative could be that parameter related to expansions multiplies something rather than adds. This may account for smaller increases in smaller cities.
Click to expand...

It could also be that premium expansions increase it more than those earned by playing the game. Both of mine were bought with diamonds. And fortunately, with chapter 16 getting here soon, this can be tested because of the free expansion coming from scouting. If I do nothing else the week I put that down, I will be able to see what it is worth in squad size increase. I will not be going fast with the start of the chapter because of waiting for some wishing wells to expire, so I will probably not even complete the Advanced Scouts in the first week to make me officially in chapter 16. If this starts without any extra delay, chapter 16 should start on Apr 21st, so the Spire starting on the 26th will reflect this.
 

Crow Last Elf

Well-Known Member
Sorry, I didn't realize you were still collecting this info. If the first encounter of the second floor is more informative, I will post that.

6/15/144/15/369/57=>253/113 [2020-04-05] first encounter, first floor
6/16/146/16/369/59=> 568/631[2020-04-12] 9th encounter, first floor

For complete tracking, I have completed 19 techs = [1+4+4+5+3(CF, AG,SA)+3(EA, CE24+DSMH)+2(DSS+CE25)] as of [2020-04-12]
 

DeletedUser5371

Guest
what if everyone that could added the free expansion you get from completed provinces at the same time in the first week of chap 16 and tried to have no other activity for that week?
 

qaccy

Well-Known Member
@MinMax Gamer Is it a possibility that one of the variables in the formula acts as a multiplier for everything else? Maybe the chapter the player is in? Higher chapters mean everything counts for more?
 

Deleted User - 3932582

Guest
qaccy said:
@MinMax Gamer Is it a possibility that one of the variables in the formula acts as a multiplier for everything else? Maybe the chapter the player is in? Higher chapters mean everything counts for more?
Click to expand...
I mean, that's pretty much what I said ;)
MinMax Gamer said:
Another alternative could be that parameter related to expansions multiplies something rather than adds. This may account for smaller increases in smaller cities.
Click to expand...
 
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