This is nuts!!

[DeletedUser3823]

All these guides people have put out to try and help to win a battle is wonderful. But you have to be a rocket Scientist to figure them out! Playing a game shouldn't be this hard! I haven't one a battle since they changed everything. AND I MEAN NOT ONE. This is nuts!! Ya shouldn't need a collage degree to figure out a battle. My game has been at a complete stand still for months. Maybe I'll find another game, ,,something fun.

 

[DeletedUser2963]

https://us.forum.elvenar.com/index.php?threads/combat-101.4968/

In less than 200 words, with a pretty picture.

more than 200 words, but you don't actually have to read any of them, because, haha, pretty pictures
https://us.forum.elvenar.com/index.php?threads/mykans-guide-fighting-guide.4205/

And if you really think these are just tooo hard to understand....mouse over troops in game and select the one that has a bonus against most of the troops you are facing.

Of course, none of these will help at all if you are outnumbered by more than 2:1. But that is an entirely different issue.

 

[Mykan]

As a test go into the current tournament (silk) and throw in 5 of your heavy melee units (paladin/treants) auto-fight. If you lose an encounter move to the next.

If you still haven't won a single fight you will be in a position to provide the devs with information so they can improve the battle system. You can post the details in the battle redesign thread. Something we are desperate for people who can't win to provide, otherwise nothing will change.

 

[DeletedUser5254]

As a test go into the current tournament (silk) and throw in 5 of your heavy melee units (paladin/treants) auto-fight. If you lose an encounter move to the next.

If you still haven't won a single fight you will be in a position to provide the devs with information so they can improve the battle system. You can post the details in the battle redesign thread. Something we are desperate for people who can't win to provide, otherwise nothing will change.

i AM so out numbered I can't even start a fight.

 

[DeletedUser3823]

i AM so out numbered I can't even start a fight.

You and 75% of the rest of us are out numbered. Mykan say's we can supply the Dev's with this info about getting our butt's kicked. But I have no clue how to do that, properly anyway. But they should never have messed this part of the game up,,to begin with!

 

[DeletedUser2963]

75%

Where exactly did you get that number?

i AM so out numbered I can't even start a fight.

Mykan say's

You both might want to go back and read that posts again. Mykan's suggestion was in reference to the tournaments.
Round 1 and 2 in the tournaments you are not outnumbered. 0% of all players are outnumbered there.
I have no doubt that there are some players that lose in round 1, but I do not think that is true of the majority of players.

 

[DeletedUser3823]

I apologies if I offended anyone . That was not my intention.

 

[DeletedUser5261]

You and 75% of the rest of us are out numbered. Mykan say's we can supply the Dev's with this info about getting our butt's kicked. But I have no clue how to do that, properly anyway. But they should never have messed this part of the game up,,to begin with!

that is my problem too. How can my 9 swordmen stand up to 45 troops on every one of them. I can only use 5 troops thingies. It is very frustrating. And my one thing you have to accomplish is win a battle. How the heck can I do that and I can't turn it down. I'm ready to give up.

 

[DeletedUser61]

• You need to research a few more Squad Size technologies, as that's what controls the size of YOUR squads.
• The size of the opposing squads is determined by distance (larger), and by the number of advanced scouting chests that you had already opened (smaller) when you scouted their sector.
• You should avoid scouting too far ahead of where you can fight/negotiate.

 

[DeletedUser2870]

I apologies if I offended anyone . That was not my intention.

You didn't. Well, perhaps some Innogames-defenders, but it happens. Those people seem to live outside the real game and just deny all problems.

@Katwijk
Sometimes you CANNOT research more squadsize upgrades yet. Or you have to wait endlessly. The range where battles are actually winnable was decreased by the new system. Many people hit impossible fights pretty early on. It's one of the reasons so many people quit.

 

[DeletedUser5261]

You didn't. Well, perhaps some Innogames-defenders, but it happens. Those people seem to live outside the real game and just deny all problems.

@Katwijk
Sometimes you CANNOT research more squadsize upgrades yet. Or you have to wait endlessly. The range where battles are actually winnable was decreased by the new system. Many people hit impossible fights pretty early on. It's one of the reasons so many people quit.

yea some people don't want to battle but I think its fun. In my alliance the one person has played for a year and never fought anything just did the negotiate thing. I'm ready to look for a new game.

 

[DeletedUser5668]

• You need to research a few more Squad Size technologies, as that's what controls the size of YOUR squads.
• The size of the opposing squads is determined by distance (larger), and by the number of advanced scouting chests that you had already opened (smaller) when you scouted their sector.
• You should avoid scouting too far ahead of where you can fight/negotiate.

Now you tell us not to scout out too far. I've been playing for exactly two weeks & I have been outnumbered for the last ten days. I was negotiating, to get the Expansions but even those have become too expensive. It really is too depressing for words. A game is supposed to be fun & a bit challenging but two to one and sometimes three to one odds are just too much. I've been staying away from the Provinces because I can't win & I can't negotiate. Believe me, I've been researching for Squad Technologies. I've played every day & all I have to fight with are Lt. Melee & Lt. Ranged units. I'm supposed to fight Enchantresses, Orc Generals, Swamp Monsters, Steinlings or Canoneers at 2:1 odds ???

 

[DeletedUser3297]

If you stay within the province count for the next chapter, the scout will reduce the squads faced in provinces, making battles winnable. If you continue to scout outside your advanced scout technology, you will only be able to negotiate.

Tip: mouse-over the chest for your next chapter to get an idea of where you should be to make battles winnable.

Here is an example of how squadsize upgrades work:

Your initial squad size is 6 and increases with every new squad size technology. The increase is 3 times the squad size technology. So if you have researched squad size 1 and 2 your squad size would be 6 + (1 x 3) + (2 x 3) = 15

If you are facing larger squads on the battlefield than you have, then you need to unlock squadsize upgrades in your research tree until you are on equal ground.

 

[DeletedUser4366]

If you stay within the province count for the next chapter, the scout will reduce the squads faced in provinces, making battles winnable. If you continue to scout outside your advanced scout technology, you will only be able to negotiate.

Yep, there's @kayleegrrl defending the "whoa, slow down, don't try to advance/ignore the leaderboard/doesn't matter if you ever get in the top 1,000" attitude that so many people playing online games enjoy. If you read the thread in the Release Notes version 1.18, another great defender of this "strategy" worked it out that it would take somewhere between a minimum of 3 years, to a maximum of 9 years to level up all your buildings and AWs entirely to the 9th age (wood elves).

So remember @scole456. don't be so DATF! (Did advance too fast)

 

[Sir Squirrel]

What are you talking about, she's not defending what they (the dev's) did, she is explaining what the poster has to do to be able to fight now!! @kayleegrrl didn't make the changes to the game the Dev's did, its not her fault.
At least she is giving some advice, not flaming other members because she is upset with how things are now!
P.S. I havnt been able to fight in the provinces since they changed the battle system, I had just started Dwarves, I'm half way through fairies and still wont be able to fight until I get to the end of Orc's. Not happy about it either, but I'm dealing with it.
It took 2 or 3 months to build the new battle system and 2 more to implement it, don't think its going anywhere anytime soon!!

 

[Mykan]

Now you tell us not to scout out too far. I've been playing for exactly two weeks & I have been outnumbered for the last ten days. I was negotiating, to get the Expansions but even those have become too expensive. It really is too depressing for words. A game is supposed to be fun & a bit challenging but two to one and sometimes three to one odds are just too much. I've been staying away from the Provinces because I can't win & I can't negotiate. Believe me, I've been researching for Squad Technologies. I've played every day & all I have to fight with are Lt. Melee & Lt. Ranged units. I'm supposed to fight Enchantresses, Orc Generals, Swamp Monsters, Steinlings or Canoneers at 2:1 odds ???

You have to advance more slowly at the start currently. Several people have been lobbying for improvements specifically in this space. Until such time the advice from @kayleegrrl was correct. If you stop negotiating and let your techs catch-up you will start to win fights and can learn how it works while troops are comparatively cheaper. You will find you can push further ahead then the chests indicate but that is easier during/after era 3 when you have all troop types. Learning combat and using that for tournaments will also help you to accelerate your growth while saving supplies for things you need or particularly hard fights.

 

[DeletedUser2870]

Though I agree @kayleegrrl is only giving advice about the present situation in this case, it's pretty obvious from other posts that she has been defending it, even praising it in other places.
Now don't get me wrong here, there is no reason she shouldn't. If the new system works out for her she's welcome to that opinion. I will not ever agree, but so what?
There's no need to make it different than it is. She's in favor of it, I'm not. She's been defending it, I've been attacking it. Both side will have their own sets of arguments.

@fellonmyownspear does have a point in that it will take forever to get through the game with the new system. I've set up a new world a while after the new system was introduced, because several friends I had invited started and quit within a few weeks. And I'm talking about experienced gamers. I wanted to see what their problem was.
Normally, when you do a game a second time, you can do it better and faster because of what you've learned from the first time around. That sure doesn't work here, only thing that happpens here is you start hitting the roadblocks faster. And that is hugely frustrating for a lot of players.

Edit: it also means there will be many more towns on the map that have reached the 'safezone' where they never will be deleted. People stop because of this, even if they did start playing. Doesn't do any good at all for anyone.

As @Mykan mentioned above: you have to start more slowly. You also have to progress more slowly. No matter how you look at it, that is a strange set-up, because it means that players who do like the game, especially the citybuilding part, and are willing to spend more time on it are getting stymied.

This is actually the only game I've ever come across where it is NOT encouraged to be an active and involved player and where active players (in my eyes quite correctly) feel they are being punished forbeing so active in the game, by makng it impossible to advance in the normal way (by partly fighting) and are condemned to negotiating.

I'd compare it to martial arts training: if you go in just for sport and train 1x a week, you'll eventually gain your brown or black belt, but it may take 10 years. Someone who goes in 3-4x /week and joins competitions regularly will get there faster and be able to do it in 5. It doesn't make sense to tell him he can't graduate until he's waited 10 years because he is 'practicing too often'.

 

[DeletedUser61]

You can make world map portion of the game as challenging as you wish

• Easy - Only scout/acquire the sectors that are required to unlock the Advanced Scouting Chest at the start of the current chapter.
• Just Right - Scout/acquire the sectors that are required to unlock the Advanced Scouting Chest at the start of the next chapter.
• Difficult to Impossible - Scout/acquire as many sectors at you can, until it becomes too difficult and/or too expensive.

 

[DeletedUser2870]

Now you tell us not to scout out too far. I've been playing for exactly two weeks & I have been outnumbered for the last ten days. I was negotiating, to get the Expansions but even those have become too expensive. It really is too depressing for words. A game is supposed to be fun & a bit challenging but two to one and sometimes three to one odds are just too much. I've been staying away from the Provinces because I can't win & I can't negotiate. Believe me, I've been researching for Squad Technologies. I've played every day & all I have to fight with are Lt. Melee & Lt. Ranged units. I'm supposed to fight Enchantresses, Orc Generals, Swamp Monsters, Steinlings or Canoneers at 2:1 odds ???

As you see, there are 2 very obvious camps here, for and against.
Personally, I completely agree with you. I tried a new world so see what would happen with the new system. Inside 4 weeks, I'd quit that world. And for me it was a sideworlds, where I wasn't really playing very intensely. And so have several friends of mine.

I guess they do it on purpose. The only way left to advance quickly is forego the battles, concentrate only on negotiating, then buy premium-expansions (at really outrageous prices) to place more factories to keep up with the demand.
Not the kind of style I like though.

@Katwijk : exactly my point. If you like the game and want to play more, you get stuck, so if you want it to be possible you have to slow down. Did you ever sit for a moment and think of how ridiculous that is?

 

[Sir Squirrel]

I do like how the troops are now good against another troop, so all the troops are in use now, not to thrilled about the slow down though! But like I said before I really don't think its going to go back to way it was either. I am hoping they will give early players a little more room to fight, as its too tough at the beginning as many have said and needs to be made easier so new players won't just quit. Also there needs to be a lot more in game explanation about how the scouts work now, so new players know that scouting to far to fast isn't the best idea. (It's hard when your trying to discover new neighbors to trade with though as well.) New players pretty much have to join a fellowship now, but I think that might be apart of the plan!
I believe that once the Dev's realize that the new players are quitting because it is too hard they will dial it down a notch, but it will take a couple months before they have the data to make that decision, they are not going to take our word for it when they have the log of who signs in and how often.