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[DeletedUser61]

all of us players created our cities "on the cheap" or somehow got around the system in some way

On the cheap doesn't mean that it was effortless, nor even easy. But it DOES mean that FUTURE players will have to pay more and/or expend more effort to achieve the same results. Your benefit, therefore, is that you have obtained goods and services while they were cheaper than they are now.

dump all that & start again if you want to enjoy the game again!

Nobody said anything about dumping anything. But an instance of the game only has a limited capacity. If you want to haul a ton of goods, you need FOUR 1/4 ton pickups. Very much to the point, playing multiple instances of the game allows you to experiment with multiple strategies.

I feel that rank & score DO show the depth of a player's experience with this game.

You certainly have to be competent to get to the median score, but anybody who is in the top quartile understands the game.

I'd go even further and suggest that chasing rank PREVENTS you from exploring all of the nooks and crannies in the game. There are any number of interesting little side trails that will most likely be dead ends, but they're still interesting.

It was the players fault. But it was done out of ignorance. There is blame on both sides there.

Naivety perhaps, but certainly not ignorance. You can't achieve a high score unless you're playing skillfully, nor unless you have a considerable knowledge of the game. The REAL question come AFTER you understand the game, "How much time are you willing to spend on the hamster wheel, just to run up your score?"

What is their incentive? Their battles are easier, their scout times and negotiations are cheaper and take less time.

Exactly so. And you also have the satisfaction of getting the job done EFFICIENTLY. Anybody can build a project for four times what it's worth, but if you want to stay in business you have to get the job done COST EFFECTIVLY.

The Devs ~AT NO POINT~ said you MUST do this.

This goes back to the fundamental nature of an on-line game wherein we keep running up the developer's tailpipe.

If I wanted to play a game where the rules are well understood, and never change, I'd go play Chess, NOT an on-line game that's being updated twice a month.

 

[Thistleknot]

Ok. There is a lot going on in this thread. I am going to attempt pull this all together with my opinions. Please forgive me if it meanders a bit.

We all agree this is a city-builder game. (Hooray for one thing we can all agree on!) I think we can all agree that there are three core aspects to the city builder: Research, Building/Resource Management, and Exploration/Combat. The first two are not really in contention here. The Exploration/Combat part is what everyone is up in arms about.

Currently the research tree is about 28% combat oriented (56 of 202 technologies). These include barracks and armory upgrades, unit upgrades, and squad size upgrades. This makes combat an important aspect of the game. I like where the new combat system is going, but I think it has been implemented poorly. The change has be drastic and has negatively impacted most of the players. I believe that those before Age 4 have been hit the hardest as far as game play. I think that the complete combat system should have been released all at once instead of in stages. Since we only have a portion of the combat system that is negatively impacting the players, very few people can see that positives that could be coming our way. I am hopeful that when this is rolled out completely that the combat system will once again be fun and challenging. I am sure that it will need some tweaking though.

There were restraints built into the game that restricted exploration. There was the cost and time it took to scout. At one point as I was trying to get to an actively trading player, I actually could not scout because the cost was more than my main hall bank could hold. The fights got more challenging as you went farther out. The costs of negotiating went up. However the developers have decided that those restraints were not tight enough. Whatever the reason, I do not see it as the players exploited the game. I could be wrong, but there has to be more to than that. I know that the general consensus from the devs has been the players have gone too far. I have yet to see a good explanation as to what "gone too far" really means.

One thing that seems to be the core issue here is the ability to make choices. That is one of the things that is attractive to any game. Those choices seem to be dwindling with the last couple of updates (the orc negiation fee and the partial combat system upgrade). There are always choices in this game. Which building do I build and how many? What troops do I need? What is my next tech to research? Should I do this quest or that one or neither? Should I fight a combat or negotiate it? How far should I explore? Should I spend money on this game? I disagree that the players were irresponsible with the choices they made. Again the focus here is on exploration. There is always the desire in a game like this to build bigger and better. The structure of the game suggests exploring and expanding. The need for KP, for relics, for space to upgrade to larger buildings, and for provinces to get expansions are all part of the game. It was suggested that the players have ignored some aspects of the game to simply explore beyond what is necessary. In my experience with the game, I have balanced my research, building, resources, and exploration. I have kept them at the same pace based on the needs of my city. I simply need more space to finish upgrading some buildings and to possibly put in some of the wonders that I have researched. I have 294 provinces conquered and need another 200 to get the expansions that I need to fill out my city map. But that is my choice in how to play. I could simply buy diamonds and purchase the expansions, but I have chosen not to.

As far as the chests in the research tree go, my understanding is that these were put in to encourage people to explore. The reason was that the devs wanted to ensure that the players would have adequate space to better utilize the tournaments. If that is the case, then the chests are not a stopping point, but rather a checkpoint. You should have gotten this far by now to ensure you are keeping pace with the technologies that you are researching. Therefore exploring beyond the requirements of the chests should be expected.

Edit: I forgot one thing about the chests. They could actually be a negative to players that bought expansions. I may be presumptuous, but I would think that if you bought a lot of expansions, you probably did not do a lot of exploration. Now suddenly you would have had to do a bunch of exploring before you could continue to do research.

I hope this brings a new perspective to both sides of the argument. I am frustrated with the way the changes have been done. I am sad that so many people have chosen to leave. I am hopeful that this will continue to be an exciting game.