For the next week or so I'll be plowing through the recipes that Folks have found to be useful, and doing a side by side comparison. The naming convention will be a simple reference to the Post in this Thread, plus the Author's Name and the Date of Creation.Best General Mayhem Recipe
4 Mana Shell,
4 Flying Iris,
4 Ear Truffle
4 Cottoncloud Bud
Exactly as posted, except for the Standard Recipe Format | As close as we can get with an Optimized Recipe |
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I have two recipes for Trader's Basic Plea - increase Tier 1 production:
54% nut, 23% iris, 23% leaf
(for example: 7 nut, 3 iris, 3 leaf)
OR
8% shells, 24% eggs, 36% blossoms, 32% buds
(for example: 2 Shells, 6 Eggs, 9 Blossoms, 8 Buds)
and one for Magical Tax Increase - increase coin production:
52% nut, 48% iris
(for example: 13 Beetlenut, 12 Iris)
There's probably a typo. This is a T3 Recipe. | |
For monster's mayhem this week, you can try something like this with non-diamond ingredients:
5 part beetlenut
5 part nightshade blossom
5 part bitterhair leaf
4 part mocking tongues
2 part eye sprouts
6429 wp used, 91.7% success chance, 50.2% monster mayhem trigger for me.
The mix will probably work if less or more ingredients are mixed in roughly similar proportion, but I can't say for sure
The potion success rate can be made higher, but then the monster mayhem trigger will be lower.
I'm still trying to figure out ingredient interaction, and I'm not sure if people with different numbers of diplomas and available effects per ingredient are going to get widely different results, or can still use some kind of template. Hopefully there will be some commonality
I've just used five ingredients to obtain a (nearly) 100% Trader's Basic Plea effect for (almost) 11 hours:
View attachment 14741
This is a wonderful recipe. The model shows slightly better results than you got, but the IMPORANT concept is that NO OTHER EFFECT shows up at all .... until you get that 8th Diploma and then Settlement Goods will knock everything into a cocked hat. | I cheated a bit and allowed six Ingredients, and only 6 Diplomas, which gave me a 4 more percentage points, but both of my Ingredients, 23 and 24 get clobbered as soon as Diploma 7 is activated, while Caterpillar Lime hangs in there for an extra chapter. |
I tried to come up with the ultimate recipe for military boosts ignoring diamond cost so here's my version:
View attachment 15065
My Cauldron model is within 1 Witch Point of what you're seeing in the Brewery, so the model seems to be OK. You're showing lower Percent Success Rates, but that's merely because I'm using Diploma level 12 while you're probably using Diploma level 20 where the Sqrt(N/25) space simply has more folks who deserve a slice of the pie. | But then I ran an Optimization to see if we still had some wiggle room. I designated 03_SB as my target, and constrained the three Military Strength Effects to be >= 0.25 and no solution was available using GRG Nonlinear. So I backed off 5% and got a pretty nice solution that saves 25% on Witch Points for an additional 50 Diamonds. Not bad at all as it will be accessible to more players. |
This is one of the three sorts (as indicated in Blue) that my model automatically generates. This green bordered sort, in Amount Order, is the one you'll usually see in the documentation, and you can plug it directly into the Brew Kettle. | An Effect/Diploma sort is provided mostly for completeness. I've emphasized HOW MANY Witch Points the user is saving by using the Check Box. If the User want's to avoid spending Diamonds altogether, they can Include a zero constraint, or they can remove that effect from the list of inputs that the Solver is allowed to manipulate. |
I'll take a close look at your recipe tomorrow. For now, I LIKE Karvest's approach quite a lot, but he's so fascinated with avoiding Diamonds that it's pretty much the core of his program, which is just a black box by design. The choppiness of the Witch Points progression forces him to use an Evolutionary Solver, which can take several minutes to find a solution, and it only runs on Excel. My program is a Vanilla Google Sheet, which anybody can access and easily share and it uses the GRG Nonlinear Solver, and takes 15 seconds at the most.@Katwick I just have couple of points. How is it any better/different to Karvest version? It just seems the same to me, just presented differently and you can't choose which diamond ingredients you get, they are set by the game.
Also, at the level you're playing, it is subject to personal preferences. For example, I'm happy to sacrifice variance to get higher probability but at the end it's just playing with 2% difference, it doesn't make a big difference. Have a look at this recipe:
View attachment 15196
I'll take a close look at your recipe tomorrow. For now, I LIKE Karvest's approach quite a lot, but he's so fascinated with avoiding Diamonds that it's pretty much the core of his program, which is just a black box by design. The choppiness of the Witch Points progression forces him to use an Evolutionary Solver, which can take several minutes to find a solution, and it only runs on Excel. My program is a Vanilla Google Sheet, which anybody can access and easily share and it uses the GRG Nonlinear Solver, and takes 15 seconds at the most.
I've also run several recipes through your application, and it's pretty dependent on step-by-step user participation, following the suggestions of the application, which is OK but doesn't say much about Why. I prefer to have the bones showing, so that folks have an opportunity to develop their intuition, and avoid most of the Gotchas.
Plus, nobody else is collecting a Recipe Library. This data is driven by a LIBRARY, not an equation.
You do realize that there's 20 diplomas, 20 different effects and it's possible to get up to 5 different effects per brew. That's a lot of recipes to include in your library.
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I don't know which World you're in, so I didn't try to guess which Herbs will be needing Diamonds this week. But the recipe comes out to 9437 Witch Points. | In Khelonaar this week, as indicated by the Short Date and the conditionally formatted Gold Bars, 07_ST requires Diamonds while the other two battle buffs require Witch Points. So I optimized for 07_ST. |
And if you like me (and probably like most other players) don't want to spend diamonds then there are 495 different combinations of which 8 ingredients that are available each week. So you can multiply your number of recipes with 495.You do realise that there's 20 diplomas, 20 different effects and it's possible to get up to 5 different effects per brew. That's a lot of recipes to include in your library.
Effect | Rate | Dpl | # | WPs | $$ | ? | Title/Link |
01_C_ | 50.3% | 10 | 25 | high | 0 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #5c - David 2023B03 |
01_C_ | 91.1% | 10 | 25 | high | 0 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #5c - Katwick 2023C24 |
03_SB | 21.0% | 12 | 25 | 2994 | 200 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #77a - Katwick 2023C26 |
03_SB | 22.6% | 12 | 25 | high | 0 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #77f - Silly Bubbles 2023C26 |
03_SB | 29.4% | 12 | 25 | 3916 | 150 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #77a - Silly Bubbles 2023C12 |
04_T1 | 0.0% | 10 | 13 | 2925 | 0 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #5a - David 2023B03 |
04_T1 | 44.7% | 7 | 5 | 305 | 0 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #33a - Moho 2023B09 |
04_T1 | 49.2% | 10 | 25 | high | 0 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #5b - David 2023B03 |
04_T1 | 84.8% | 10 | 25 | high | 0 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #5b - Katwick 2023C24 |
07_ST | 22.1% | 12 | 25 | 3755 | 250 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #77f - Katwick 2023C27 |
07_ST | 55.9% | 12 | 13 | 1669 | 0 | TRUE | Cauldron Recipes #5a - Katwick 2023C24 |
I put the optimized recipe (upper right one) in (using diamonds) and got the result of 33.6% From where does the 59.47% come? Is that based upon the number of trophies? I mean since each trophy gives you another chance, (I have 5) does that mean I have the overall chance of 59.47% of getting the 03_SB effect?For the next week or so I'll be plowing through the recipes that Folks have found to be useful, and doing a side by side comparison. The naming convention will be a simple reference to the Post in this Thread, plus the Author's Name and the Date of Creation.
Once we have a useful bunch of Recipes, and folks have gotten interested again, I'll formally release a Beta Version of my Google Sheet. For now the stuff that I'm accumulating is Viewable (and downloadable), in the directory at Cauldrons 102 Beta 2023C23, including a PreBeta Release of my Google Sheet, if you'd like to follow along.
Exactly as posted, except for the Standard Recipe Format As close as we can get with an Optimized Recipe View attachment 15154 View attachment 15155 View attachment 15157 View attachment 15156
I'm only in Chapter 11, so I can't test and didn't include the Diplomas for Chapters 13-20, but if an endgame player is willing to do some rigorous testing, it will only take a couple of days to plug in the endgame chapters.
That recipe was brewed at Diploma Level 10. If you're in a later chapter then additional Effects will be stealing some of the common space, and any particular Effect will therefore be squeezed tighter to fit into the Sqrt(N/25) space, where N is the total number of Cables. At Sqrt(16/25) = 4/5 = 80% the Bridge Troll is likely your main competitor, with minor Effects soaking up the rest of the space.I put the optimized recipe (upper right one) in (using diamonds) and got the result of 33.6% From where does the 59.47% come? Is that based upon the number of trophies? I mean since each trophy gives you another chance, (I have 5) does that mean I have the overall chance of 59.47% of getting the 03_SB effect?
AJ
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Cable should be Ingredient or Herb. My history is showing. Don't ask me about Spanning Trees unless you have the time for a lengthy discussion.Among the questions I have, some of them revealing how little I understand, are these:
1) What's a "cable?" If it's a critical concept to understanding recipes, can you help me understand it?
2) How do you improve your diploma's. I think this has to do with the chapters and research done (I'm on chapter 19 and thus would have 18+ diplomas -- which are the effects I can seek.
3) How do you get more goblets? (I think of them as small trophies, but goblets will do). I average about 7500-8000 tournament points and top the Spire but I see (or at least I think I see) you can have a dozen or more. So what do I need to do?
AJ
ps. These questions are probably answered elsewhere. Just point me to the relevant thread if you'd rather.