DeletedUser19723
Guest
Thanks for your two posts. They are definitely appreciated and helpful.
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Your Elvenar Team
Thanks for your two posts. They are definitely appreciated and helpful.
DeletedUser12171
Guest
quest amounts are usually only cursory. don't worry about it. if you produce enough of your boosted (~40 squares of factory space each, according to Mykan's guide), you'll be more than able to trade for them in sufficient quantities
mucksterme
Oh Wise One
One other general note. If you are having trouble getting your trades accepted.
1Join an FS
2 Make sure you are posting fair trades -- 2 or 3 star
3 If you are posting fair trades and not getting what you need. Then you have look at finding a new FS. You may not be in a bad FS, but if your FS is all newer players they just may not be able to help you. When you are new it is good to be in an FS with a group of active players who are farther advanced than you.
And a note on joining an FS. I've seen FS' that were groups of mainly neighbors. It is a natural occurrence but not necessarily the most advantageous situation.
You want an FS where most of the members are away from your neighborhood. That expands your trading base.
Not everyone is as lucky as I was to get placed in a good area.
1Join an FS
2 Make sure you are posting fair trades -- 2 or 3 star
3 If you are posting fair trades and not getting what you need. Then you have look at finding a new FS. You may not be in a bad FS, but if your FS is all newer players they just may not be able to help you. When you are new it is good to be in an FS with a group of active players who are farther advanced than you.
And a note on joining an FS. I've seen FS' that were groups of mainly neighbors. It is a natural occurrence but not necessarily the most advantageous situation.
You want an FS where most of the members are away from your neighborhood. That expands your trading base.
Not everyone is as lucky as I was to get placed in a good area.
Mykan
Oh Wise One
These 2 points are so important. Not seen a trade doesn't mean no trades are happening, posting your own trades is such a good way to get goods and fast (within 24hrs).
The spread out fellowship also gives you the equivalent of a lot more than 24 trading partners. For example I have a fellowship that is weak on a certain resource but myself (and others) have some strong neighbours with that resource. Our ability to access our neighbourhoods lets us trade goods into the fellowship that aren't there from production alone. Think of it if everyone has only 10 good trading people in their part of the world and you have 20 people in your fellowship it is more like having 200 active trading partners rather than just 20. If you are all neighbours then you might only have the equivalent of 30-50 trading partners, depending on how clustered you all are.
Enevhar Aldarion
Oh Wise One
But good areas can turn into deserts. I can look at all my map neighbors today and count anywhere from 15-20 who were regular at visiting and trading, but have now quit playing. This count does not include the ones who quit playing and have since been replaced with another player by the game. If I did not still have another 15-20 good, active map neighbors, I would have long ago used the game's feature to be moved to a new map location. And I am on the 1st US server, which is the most active of all the US servers, at least as far as I know.
DeletedUser16147
Guest
I will never be able to figure out why people have a problem with cross tier trades. It's all a matter of economics/supply and demand. If I have a goat (tier1) and you have a sheep (tier 1) and we trade one for one, that's fine. If I have 15 goats (tier 1) and you have a pickup truck (tier 3) and you really need my goats and I really need your truck, what is wrong with making the trade? By the "no cross tier trades" logic, I should only be able to trade goats for sheep. If you don't want to trade cross tier, then don't. But don't rag on those who do. If I am desperate for scrolls, and you have them I'll be happy to give you what you want for those scrolls.
SoggyShorts
Mathematician par Excellence
@Newfoundluck
Imagine that the mayor is bad at math and posts a sign saying 15 goats for 1 truck is fair, so newer residents are trading their goats for trucks at 15:1.
This ruins them financially and it takes a long time to get out of the poor house because it turns out that trucks can be made in 3 hours, and it takes a whole day to make 15 goats!
Smart farmers will stop trading away their goats and be annoyed when they go to the market and have a hard time finding good deals because of the 100s of truckers shouting "GET YER F150 HERE, JUST 15 GOATS, GREAT DEAL!"
Imagine that the mayor is bad at math and posts a sign saying 15 goats for 1 truck is fair, so newer residents are trading their goats for trucks at 15:1.
This ruins them financially and it takes a long time to get out of the poor house because it turns out that trucks can be made in 3 hours, and it takes a whole day to make 15 goats!
Smart farmers will stop trading away their goats and be annoyed when they go to the market and have a hard time finding good deals because of the 100s of truckers shouting "GET YER F150 HERE, JUST 15 GOATS, GREAT DEAL!"
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DeletedUser16147
Guest
Imagine that the mayor is bad at math and posts a sign saying 15 goats for 1 truck is fair, so newer residents are trading their goats for trucks at 15:1.
This ruins them financially and it takes a long time to get out of the poor house because it turns out that trucks can be made in 3 hours, and it takes a whole day to make 15 goats!
Smart farmers will stop trading away their goats and be annoyed when they go to the market and have a hard time finding good deals because of the 100s of truckers shouting "GET YER F150 HERE, JUST 15 GOATS, GREAT DEAL!"
I don't know what country you are from, but this would only be true in a socialist country where the government controls prices. In a capitalist country, the market drives the economy and as I said before, supply and demand dictate what can be sold for what. Read about "The Invisible Hand" in "Wealth of Nations" by Adam Scott.
Using your market scenario, if 100s of truckers were selling trucks, the price of trucks would decline (less goats) as there would be an over abundance of trucks in the market.
SoggyShorts
Mathematician par Excellence
@Newfoundluck
You prove my point. There are 100s of truckers selling trucks and the vast majority are not buying them because the price is wrong.
That's Adam Scott in action.
However, inno the dictator has set the fair price at 16:1 for T1:T3 so players who either ignorant of the real value or trying to prey on others who are ignorant continue to follow the guideline.
Remember, this isn't the real world, and every player is capable of both goats and trucks.
The simple fact is that trading at 16:1 is not sustainable for anyone on the wrong end of that trade, so yes, you will catch the occasional sucker, but for the rest of us who know it's a terrible deal, it's simply annoying to wade through 100s of bad trades to try to find fair ones.
You prove my point. There are 100s of truckers selling trucks and the vast majority are not buying them because the price is wrong.
That's Adam Scott in action.
However, inno the dictator has set the fair price at 16:1 for T1:T3 so players who either ignorant of the real value or trying to prey on others who are ignorant continue to follow the guideline.
Remember, this isn't the real world, and every player is capable of both goats and trucks.
The simple fact is that trading at 16:1 is not sustainable for anyone on the wrong end of that trade, so yes, you will catch the occasional sucker, but for the rest of us who know it's a terrible deal, it's simply annoying to wade through 100s of bad trades to try to find fair ones.
DeletedUser16147
Guest
@SoggyShorts
Just because INNO states what a fair trade is doesn't mean that you have to accept. That is my point. You can trade for whatever you feel is fair. And one player's idea of fair may not be the same as another player's. If being annoyed is your only issue then I'm sorry about that. Also, to be honest, I never see "100's" of trades in my trade window as long as I filter by what I am selling.
Just because INNO states what a fair trade is doesn't mean that you have to accept. That is my point. You can trade for whatever you feel is fair. And one player's idea of fair may not be the same as another player's. If being annoyed is your only issue then I'm sorry about that. Also, to be honest, I never see "100's" of trades in my trade window as long as I filter by what I am selling.
shimmerfly
Well-Known Member
But to be "fair" it appears one would be taking advantage of new players or possibly being greedy. If you can get what you need with a fair 2 or 3 star trade within the tiers why not? It works.
Not pointing fingers here, just curious...
mucksterme
Oh Wise One
SoggyShorts
Mathematician par Excellence
As a test the other day I went through my trader that had 67 pages of trades and took every single trade that wasn't cross-tier or sentient and was left with 60 pages.
You came to this thread with the statement that you don't understand why people have a problem with cross-tier.
The answers are:
1. They clutter the trader and applying a dozen filters is time-consuming to the point where many of us don't bother and just trade within our FS.
2. They prey upon those who don't use the forums (99.98% according to inno) and who don't have a good FS to teach them about these things.
3. The proven to be inaccurate 16:4:1 ratio leads to conflict with other players who are upset when you don't take trades that the game says are fair.
DeletedUser16147
Guest
@SoggyShorts
Ok. We must be playing different games because I just went to my trader and without filtering, I had 6 pages. How you could have 67 is beyond me. But whatever. I've made my point. If you don't agree with me, that's fine. But I will continue to accept cross tier trades that I feel are fair for me. Also, my fellowship, of which I am the highest ranked play, has absolutely no problem with cross tier trades.
So for others here who have been chastised for cross tier trades, know that there are many many of us who are perfectly happy and willing to trade with you and you aren't doing anything wrong.
Happy gaming.
Ok. We must be playing different games because I just went to my trader and without filtering, I had 6 pages. How you could have 67 is beyond me. But whatever. I've made my point. If you don't agree with me, that's fine. But I will continue to accept cross tier trades that I feel are fair for me. Also, my fellowship, of which I am the highest ranked play, has absolutely no problem with cross tier trades.
So for others here who have been chastised for cross tier trades, know that there are many many of us who are perfectly happy and willing to trade with you and you aren't doing anything wrong.
Happy gaming.
DeletedUser16147
Guest
What's really sad is people like you who feel that the person with a different opinion than yours is wrong.
SoggyShorts
Mathematician par Excellence
That makes it so much worse. You are the highest ranked member on your team, someone your fellowship looks up to and you are happily ripping them off?
Or are you only posting/taking upstream trades, as in your planks for their gems?
If you are doing cross-tier trades for your fellows, you are either a hero or a villain.
Mykan
Oh Wise One
@Newfoundluck you would actually find the contention of cross-tier trades would drop a lot if the game simply had a filter for people in respect to them. I will also accept cross-tier trades on occasion (giving up my T1 for a higher tier). The trouble is economics is at play but people still flood the trader supplying cross-tier when the demand is far smaller than the supply. Its like turning up to a local market that sells a variety of food and goods, all you want is some food but you have to search the entire market with 100's of stalls to find the 1 shop selling the food and this is the only market that provides food so you have no alternate option.
The economics is distorted in the game, in a real world scenario the over supply would stop or prices adjust (which does happen a little). But because people can overproduce everything they can afford to place 50 of their 60 trades as cross-tier and let them sit for weeks, months, years (yes I have witnessed years).
Give people the ability to find what they want more easily and they will do it with a lot less grumbling.
Like Soggy I also often have 60+ pages of trades. Once you hit sentient goods the filtering issue compounds and it adds each chapter for each sentient tier. So you end up with several major categories people are looking for:
The economics is distorted in the game, in a real world scenario the over supply would stop or prices adjust (which does happen a little). But because people can overproduce everything they can afford to place 50 of their 60 trades as cross-tier and let them sit for weeks, months, years (yes I have witnessed years).
Give people the ability to find what they want more easily and they will do it with a lot less grumbling.
Like Soggy I also often have 60+ pages of trades. Once you hit sentient goods the filtering issue compounds and it adds each chapter for each sentient tier. So you end up with several major categories people are looking for:
- Normal goods
- Same tier trade
- Cross tier trade
- Sentient goods
- Same tier trade
- Cross tier trade
juniperknome
Well-Known Member
over produce tier 1 and trade up somebody will pick the trades. trading down is a problem especially ten pages a day around me
mucksterme
Oh Wise One
My post did not say you are wrong to have your opinion
What I commented on was your stated inability to understand other's opinion
Literacy is fun
Well, obviously if Soggy's world/server/neighborhood does not conform to yours, his opinion is worthless.
Soggy has been playing this game for like a dozen years and is in chapter thirty five or something.
But certainly your year of experience climbing to chapter 7 and managing to sit atop your lowly FS makes you more of an expert on this game than he is
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