Dreaming about an expiring negotiation boost building

[Iyapo1]

I don't know why you would want an expiring building that only benefits negotiators tho,

There are four expiring building that only benifit fighters. There is not a single expiring building that benefits only negotiators.

As far as i see it, this game was never intended so you choose for fighting OR negotiation

Directly from the wiki:

"Negotiate or fight over powerful Relics to boost your production.

You can either become a skilled and well-known trader, refine your producing art or lead your troops to victory in 3D-animated battles, the decision is up to you."

 

[SoggyShorts]

lead your troops to victory in 3D-animated battles

Really?

 

[Iyapo1]

A chess board is technically 3d

 

[Deleted User - 849192770]

3D-ish-animated battles,

there you go

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

Spoiler: More off topic math

nope, it's just you failing to understand the concept.
View attachment 9457
That's my current damage.
If you say that placing 2 ELR buildings will add 100% damage you are wrong.
Context matters.

The truth:
View attachment 9458
Adding 2 ELR will increase THIS number, NOT "my damage" by 100%.

A VERY different thing than "double" which is absolutely what people think when you say a 100% increase without context.

Well, you describe it your fuzzy/soggy way, if it works for you. The way I look at it, and calculate it, the numbers shown by Inno work out correctly for me. And in other threads, I will continue to show it the way I see it, and you can argue or not, as you see fit. But in the meantime, it is Inno's inconsistencies in formulas and descriptions that need to be fixed.

 

[SoggyShorts]

Well, you describe it your fuzzy/soggy way, if it works for you. The way I look at it, and calculate it, the numbers shown by Inno work out correctly for me. And in other threads, I will continue to show it the way I see it, and you can argue or not, as you see fit. But in the meantime, it is Inno's inconsistencies in formulas and descriptions that need to be fixed.

LoL indeed, you keep doing you and I'll keep correcting it when I see it to give a more accurate real-world perspective instead of a misleading one.

 

[ajqtrz]

In that case you haven't fought far enough.
I am often in battles where a +240% attack bonus is NOT enough.

It all depends on how strong your enemy is, and the further you get in the tournament the stronger your enemy becomes.
Also 1 shooting critical enemies becomes more and more important as losses grow beyond imagination.

You might be right. When I did that I took first place and did all the provinces I could. Ran out of provinces but got lucky as everybody else either stopped or ran out at the same time. Since then I've opened more provinces so maybe I'll try again one of these days and see how far I can get. I usually do 25-30 x 5 and average about 6700 per week so at least I'm doing something.

It seems to me the question is: with all the bonuses (from whatever source or method) can you match at least the percentage the enemies are ahead of you? Do they max at 300% of your standard squad size and can you, with the right stuff applied, get your effective strength to at least even and then be smarter than the AI?. So if the enemies are 240% of my squad size is it possible with AW's, Fire Phonix, ELR's MMM's DA's and everything else to come even close to a "fair fight?" If so, can you then use your skills in fighting (which are generally better than the AI's" to win each fight?

In any case, the subject is if we ought to request a similar treatment for catering. At least that's how I'm viewing it. I think a parallel set of buildings would make the game more interesting and help the "cater only" crowd (I cater the Spire entirely), able to keep up more with the "fight only," crowd which has all those thing listed above.

AJ

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

You might be right. When I did that I took first place and did all the provinces I could. Ran out of provinces but got lucky as everybody else either stopped or ran out at the same time. Since then I've opened more provinces so maybe I'll try again one of these days and see how far I can get. I usually do 25-30 x 5 and average about 6700 per week so at least I'm doing something.


AJ

according to elvenstats your best place was nr 9. and your best score 14850 in the old format and only once, before that your best score outside steel was 4050 with an average a little above 1000 points.

• you cannot compare old and new style tournaments. they are completely different. old style we did 90+ and the only limit was provinces not difficulty.
• you should not lie about getting first to make a point when data is open and aviable.
• throwing in months of resources to get a 1 off result can't create any meaningfull comparison

Guess whatever you say you should be ignored, to be caught on point 2 is pretty bad.
Taking a result out of context as well.

And since it's you somehow I feel this was done on purpose.

 

[Iyapo1]

. I think a parallel set of buildings would make the game more interesting and help the "cater only" crowd (I cater the Spire entirely), able to keep up more with the "fight only," crowd which has all those thing listed above.

Most players are not pure fighting or pure catering. Most players are a hybrid so most players would benifit from a building that lowers negotiation costs. Just like most players benifit from the expiring military buildings.
I am running a pure catering build so the military buildings are utterly useless to me. Some one running a pure fighting city would find such a building to be equally useless. But again, that is not most players.
I think most players fight more than they cater so instead of a parallel set...could we have 1?

according to elvenstats your best place was

Where can you find a players top tournament rank info on elvenstats?

 

[ajqtrz]

@lyapo1 On the tournaments tab it shows your server then, to the right, the individual rankings.

AJ

 

[Iyapo1]

I play on mobile, no tabs...but I found it! I did not know that info was there.

@CrazyWizard I hit top 100...once. Thx for pointing this data out!

 

[ajqtrz]

according to elvenstats your best place was nr 9. and your best score 14850 in the old format and only once, before that your best score outside steel was 4050 with an average a little above 1000 points.

• you cannot compare old and new style tournaments. they are completely different. old style we did 90+ and the only limit was provinces not difficulty.
• you should not lie about getting first to make a point when data is open and aviable.
• throwing in months of resources to get a 1 off result can't create any meaningfull comparison

Guess whatever you say you should be ignored, to be caught on point 2 is pretty bad.
Taking a result out of context as well.

And since it's you somehow I feel this was done on purpose.

To accuse of a lie one must know that the person speaking knew the statement to be untrue. Do you know that? How?

To accuse of a lie one must have all the data. Does elvenstats display far enough back to insure the statement was not true? Did you do the full investigation and look back past what elvenstats.com shows?

To accuse of a lie is a serious accusation. Please do you homework before you make such a statement. There are people in my neighborhood who can confirm that I borrowed millions of goods from them to make this achievement and they may even remember I did so. Next time please do a more complete investigation. In journalism you look for 2 independent sources to confirm the truth of a statement. You have one, and that one flawed because it just doesn't go back far enough. In journalism, one making a statement such as what you have made, upon finding they did not have sufficient reasons for making the statement, would retract it and offer an apology. How about being a good journalist? Seems a reasonable request to me.

And I agree with you that perhaps the comparison was not a good one to make between the old and new system, but from what I've heard the new costs less goods. So if that is true, wouldn't it have been harder to achiever 1st and do all the provinces I could under the older system? And if that's true, wouldn't the introduction of the buildings suggested have a larger impact and make it easier under the new system?

AJ

 

[Iyapo1]

from what I've heard the new costs less goods.

Only if you dont cross the invisable line somewhere past tent 15. If you put a toe across that line(wherever it falls) the shady characters rob the caravan and take all your stuff.

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

To accuse of a lie one must know that the person speaking knew the statement to be untrue. Do you know that? How?

To accuse of a lie one must have all the data. Does elvenstats display far enough back to insure the statement was not true? Did you do the full investigation and look back past what elvenstats.com shows?

To accuse of a lie is a serious accusation. Please do you homework before you make such a statement. There are people in my neighborhood who can confirm that I borrowed millions of goods from them to make this achievement and they may even remember I did so. Next time please do a more complete investigation. In journalism you look for 2 independent sources to confirm the truth of a statement. You have one, and that one flawed because it just doesn't go back far enough. In journalism, one making a statement such as what you have made, upon finding they did not have sufficient reasons for making the statement, would retract it and offer an apology. How about being a good journalist? Seems a reasonable request to me.

And I agree with you that perhaps the comparison was not a good one to make between the old and new system, but from what I've heard the new costs less goods. So if that is true, wouldn't it have been harder to achiever 1st and do all the provinces I could under the older system? And if that's true, wouldn't the introduction of the buildings suggested have a larger impact and make it easier under the new system?

AJ

Yes elvenstat shows far enough to be sure that you could not be first in the current format.

Also yes it shows also enough for any other claim,
Januari 2018 score 69000 points , average score low.
Unless you now are going to claim you got first place maxing all provinces and being at a representative point in game (not the first week a server opened) when you just started the game right?
So yeah I have done my homework that you're talking out of your @$$.

You also backtrack, "you have heared" but you do not know?
But you just made a statement like it's the truth? and you do not know?

You like to stir the pot in many topics but you completely missed any conversation about the change in tournament formula, even while you're a tournament player?

Does that makes sense?

Or does it fall into a pattern we see in most topics you post?
Stirring the pot, being controversial, just to be controversial trying to pull out other players hairs?

hmmm....
Why was it that you made a post about when people are allowed to block you?
Why do people actively block you?

No one blocked me (yet) on any of the forums I am active. I am followed a decent lot.
Why should that be?

 

[Socrates28]

The problem with pets is you can get multiples.

Then put the base building in the MA to be crafted like other base evolving buildings and the upgrades in an event and everyone gets ONE no matter how many upgrades they get.

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

Then put the base building in the MA to be crafted like other base evolving buildings and the upgrades in an event and everyone gets ONE no matter how many upgrades they get.

But wha about those that fund the game? thay always get 4 of them for a lot of money now nothing?
There is a reason you can get more than 1 baseplate during an event. some of the big sponsors count on it.

 

[ajqtrz]

Yes elvenstat shows far enough to be sure that you could not be first in the current format.

Also yes it shows also enough for any other claim,
Januari 2018 score 69000 points , average score low.
Unless you now are going to claim you got first place maxing all provinces and being at a representative point in game (not the first week a server opened) when you just started the game right?
So yeah I have done my homework that you're talking out of your @$$.

You also backtrack, "you have heared" but you do not know?
But you just made a statement like it's the truth? and you do not know?

Did I say first in the current format? I don't believe I did.

I'm not sure what you are saying when yous peak of a score of 69,000 and "any other claim." and "a representative point in the game." I'm not sure because by defining what you think I meant "representative point in the game" you are implying I claimed to have won first at "a representative point in the game" whatever that means, exactly. If I claim my car is blue and you come along and re-define what blue is, naturally you could claim I'm lying. Adding caveats and definitional restrictions to what I mean by "won first place" -- like implying that I am saying I won first under the new format, and implying that I am claiming I won first at "a representative point in the game." (again, whatever that might mean), is creating problems unnecessarily.

And as for the statement that I have heard the new format costs less goods, are you saying I didn't hear that? The statement is not a claim that format costs are less under the new tournament format but that I heard they were. As one poster said, "only up to province 15." Now I've heard that the new tournament format is cheaper in goods up to province 15." Is it true? I don't know, but I'm not claiming it to be true.

You really should, I think, consider the actual claim made: "I have heard" rather than assign the indirect quote implied to my making that claim. The one making the claim was the one who I heard (don't remember who) and, in general, the form "I have heard" invites a discussion of the truthfulness of the implied quote rather than the reader taking the quote as a claim by the one saying they heard. Yes, it does imply the one saying "I have heard" is predisposed to believing the claim, but it also offers the caveat that they only heard the claim and implies the, quite reasonable, position that the claim might be false.

In addition, the subject here is not my personality or habits, but if, by adding some buildings we can improve the game. Let's stick to that and try to avoid any further personal attacks. It's okay to be disliked but let's leave the personal animosity out of the forum. I suspect if that had been done in the past there would be fewer problems for all of us and we'd get a lot farther discussing important things rather than my rhetorical approach to discussion.

Thanks,

AJ

 

[Deleted User - 1178646]

Did I say first in the current format? I don't believe I did.

AJ

Lol you can't win this one dude no matter what.

If we talk about climate change, I say there is and issue you say it ain't.
You never told us you were talking about today, and in 1864 there was no climate change issue.

cmon dude, if you make a claim, don't use 1864 as an excuse.

You heared about a statement, but are your eyes glued together?
Cant you see and make your own judgement when you get 6000 points in the tournaments?
Are you really that.....

Also why make a statement as if you experienced it if it's mere hearsay.
You have backtracked everything with only excuses why it ain't your fault. and blame someone else.

Be a man, take responsibility.

 

[The Unbeliever]

How to make the Spire + Tournament playable on a weekly basis:
1. REMOVE ANCIENT WONDERS FROM THE COST FORUMLAE!!

...as someone who likes to take time and just casually play through chapters while upgrading AW's, etc..., this alone is THE no.1 reason I am so massively boned in my main city on K-world.
It has a total of 54 AW levels and I am in the early stages of Tree Huggers (Ch.9)
My E-world city has only 15 AW levels and is in the early stages of Orks & Gobbos. (Ch.8)
The difference in both fighting AND negotiating especially, is pants on head stupid... My K-world city in the Spire by the 5th fething encounter alone is already over 1000 troops per slot, vs. my E-world city that almost half of that!

My K-world city, due to the additional AW levels and their effects, can barely manage to crawl to the end of Lv2 weekly, and only does about 1700-1800 tourny pts.
I am no longer 'gaining' resources/prizes from the spire + tourny, as I as forced to automatically spend everything i make in a single week, just to break even in troops + goods.

REMOVE ANCIENT WONDERS FROM THE FORUMULA!!!


2. For negotiations that involve 6 - 8+ options, just give us 4 turns to make them viable!


Done.
Spire + Tourny mostly fixed, and mid-game players are no longer bent over a barrel unfairly due to the instant massive demand on Orks/Mana/Seeds resources.

 

[Iyapo1]

@The Unbeliever I think you are blaming your wonder levels unfairly.

If you are being bloodied by 1700-1800 tournament points per week you must be farming KP. The new tournament was specifically designed to harm you if you farm KP.