DeletedUser7370
Guest
Pot meet kettle. Here let me pass out the mirrors and the polish.
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Your Elvenar Team
Should winning FA prizes be a competition?
- Thread starter SoggyShorts
- Start date
SoggyShorts
Mathematician par Excellence
Ah yes, the signature move for the total failure.
"My arguments are weak and my notions are dumb, so I'll just say I was trolling."
Nice try.
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Ashrem
Oh Wise One
It's not often people admit to being trolls.
Just like last time. "Everyone disagrees with me so I'll start throwing around personal insults and leave." You might try to figure out how many time anyone else in the conversation used words about you like:
"overbearing egomaniacs"
"petulant little children"
"drivel that oozes from you"
"the other rude and obnoxious people"
"petulant little children"
"drivel that oozes from you"
"the other rude and obnoxious people"
You might want to ask yourself why it isn't okay for people to disagree with you.
DeletedUser1016
Guest
OMG! Nothing is getting accomplished here trying to sway Breann. SoggyShorts, Ashrem, TedGrau, TheUnbeliever, etc....sorry, but you guys are just wasting your breath, Breann has no desire to comprehend anything beyond her/his own opinion. Lots of space and time going round and round getting nothing resolved, why do you guys bother?????
.... In reality it doesn't matter what any of us think, it's all going to shake out to what ends up being the ultimate result the game developers decide. Just like the tournaments, which was met with similar resistance, both when it was World Map-based and again when they revised it and it became a Fellowship-based tournament, this new Fellowship Adventure is very similar to the tournament in that regard. I feel, this too, it will take the same course as the tournaments did, anyone interested in gaining ranking points and getting them will more then likely be pay-to-play gamers, getting the top spots on a daily basis and earning the extra ranking points, and the rest of us who realized it's just too costly will play just to get the other prizes [KP, relics, spells, runes, broken shards, etc]. When it comes to getting ranking points from the tournament, it is a competition, where there are only 100 places to gain them. I think the same will happen with the FA - I can see many Fellowships only putting enough effort [especially if the prizes stay lame as they are for the top 50 players - yuk!] to do the easiest path and getting the three [3] stage awards and settling for those. We place around #60, but I wouldn't bother even concerning myself with placing in the next event because no matter how organized we are, we will never place high enough to be worth the effort or cost. The top spots will always be reserved for the top Fellowships be it that they spend more cash or they are more aggressive players...the top spots will be theirs. So the rest of us have to settle for the three [3] stage rewards - actually they are more then adequate and are worth the shortest path to them.
.... In reality it doesn't matter what any of us think, it's all going to shake out to what ends up being the ultimate result the game developers decide. Just like the tournaments, which was met with similar resistance, both when it was World Map-based and again when they revised it and it became a Fellowship-based tournament, this new Fellowship Adventure is very similar to the tournament in that regard. I feel, this too, it will take the same course as the tournaments did, anyone interested in gaining ranking points and getting them will more then likely be pay-to-play gamers, getting the top spots on a daily basis and earning the extra ranking points, and the rest of us who realized it's just too costly will play just to get the other prizes [KP, relics, spells, runes, broken shards, etc]. When it comes to getting ranking points from the tournament, it is a competition, where there are only 100 places to gain them. I think the same will happen with the FA - I can see many Fellowships only putting enough effort [especially if the prizes stay lame as they are for the top 50 players - yuk!] to do the easiest path and getting the three [3] stage awards and settling for those. We place around #60, but I wouldn't bother even concerning myself with placing in the next event because no matter how organized we are, we will never place high enough to be worth the effort or cost. The top spots will always be reserved for the top Fellowships be it that they spend more cash or they are more aggressive players...the top spots will be theirs. So the rest of us have to settle for the three [3] stage rewards - actually they are more then adequate and are worth the shortest path to them.
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DeletedUser7370
Guest
Because we like a certain amount of competition. We like to have a competition of wit. We like to show off just how smart we are. Because we might actually be "overbearing egomaniacs", but we keep going because this time we are right. In my case I have seen this death spiral before in games for over 20 years.
I am using "we" very liberally. I can only speak for myself, but if the others sign on then I guess they agree that they are part of that "we".
Ashrem
Oh Wise One
My philosophy about debates is that they are not about changing the opinion of your opponent, but about convincing the observer that your position is superior. It's important that everyone who reads the thread gets all of the available information so that they can make in informed choice. The facts are indisputable, the opinions are all equally relevant.
SoggyShorts
Mathematician par Excellence
@osideglen
It's like when you meet a flat-earther, or anti-vaxer; You really shouldn't bother using logic, reasoning, or any other method to educate them, but there's always that tiny bit of hope that you can turn an idiot into a something more. But mostly as @Ashrem said, there are more people involved than us. Anyone who reads this thread should get as much information as we can give.
You're probably right about how the FA will go though- once inno does something it's nearly impossible to have them switch gears. It's too bad really, the FA could be so much more. If nothing changes, I'll be advising my FS to rush through the fastest paths and be done with it in a couple days. Doing double or triple the work for a 2h boost? lol no thanks.
It's like when you meet a flat-earther, or anti-vaxer; You really shouldn't bother using logic, reasoning, or any other method to educate them, but there's always that tiny bit of hope that you can turn an idiot into a something more. But mostly as @Ashrem said, there are more people involved than us. Anyone who reads this thread should get as much information as we can give.
You're probably right about how the FA will go though- once inno does something it's nearly impossible to have them switch gears. It's too bad really, the FA could be so much more. If nothing changes, I'll be advising my FS to rush through the fastest paths and be done with it in a couple days. Doing double or triple the work for a 2h boost? lol no thanks.
Ashrem
Oh Wise One
Agreed. Our only choice is to not compete and be left out of that aspect of the event.
DeletedUser1016
Guest
Ha,ha..ha!!! You are so right, there's more to this forum then just one or two opinions...but it's just so frustrating to keep "beating a dead horse".
EDIT:
Had to add this - it's too good.....ha!Sadly, as a wise man once said, "every time you try and make something idiot proof, God goes and builds a better idiot."
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DeletedUser2824
Guest
Risen Malchiah
Well-Known Member
The only winning move is not to play.
How about a nice game of chess?
The Unbeliever
Well-Known Member
Sadly, as a wise man once said, "every time you try and make something idiot proof, God goes and builds a better idiot."
I can't remember who originally suggested it (my apologies), but I just don't get why Inno can't take the approach of basing the 'extra' prize buildings off of a FS score cap?
Even if the ceiling is set stupidly high, like 5-6k+ pts for just the first reward, it would still readily encourage FS's to get more pro-active and work together as a cohesive team. (and isn't that the whole point of FA's anyways?!
)And for the 'uber competitive players who enjoy roflstomping everyone else in the game, they still get the enjoyment of 'being the best', since those FS's will inevitably still come out well on top, gain even more rewards under this kind of graded scoring system, and the event will still not simply be a kindergarden level "every kid gets a shiny trophy just for showing up!" styled system.
On the other hand, if Inno were to go with something like this, I dare say that 99% of players in fellowships would be extremely happy, as hard work & team play would give EVERYONE a chance to win some cool swag.
A good number of FS's would probably still miss out on even the Lv1 reward, (especially if the 1st goalpost is set at something like 6k pts), but importantly, it's not a "why bother, only the top 1% will ever have a chance to get stuff." kind of 'kick-in-the-gut' that the current system is.
Anyone who thinks such a system is "bad" or "uncompetitive" is really just proving themselves to be a true bully imho.
Shellizzie
Active Member
This has all been a very interesting read. Quite a mix of likes and dislikes and complaining and arguing.
You guys all realize this is a game right?
Our FS is not one of the top 10 fellowships, at the time of the FA we were ranked 44, but we still ranked 12th in the Fellowship Adventure. And we had people who were out of town (Myself the AM included for part of it ) and a couple of inactive players who had not been replaced yet. The majority of our members have not bought diamonds while a few of us splurge when the deal is good.
How did we get such a high ranking? Teamwork. We all worked together to get as high as we could. A few of us were able to build 6-8 tier one factories but most just worked with what they had. It did not matter how many we had. We all produced badges constantly and worked together to go as high as we could. There were a couple of mishaps, of course, but we moved past them and continued on. We had chat and messages constantly going. We paid attention to what was needed next and worked to get it. In the end, it was all about how we worked together as a team.
And honestly, we are a pretty competitive group so it was tons of fun! If you don't like to compete then there is nothing saying you have to.
The ONLY way to get high in the rankings is to work together.
It does not matter what the rank of the fellowship is, if they don't work together they will not rank well.
You guys all realize this is a game right?
Our FS is not one of the top 10 fellowships, at the time of the FA we were ranked 44, but we still ranked 12th in the Fellowship Adventure. And we had people who were out of town (Myself the AM included for part of it ) and a couple of inactive players who had not been replaced yet. The majority of our members have not bought diamonds while a few of us splurge when the deal is good.
How did we get such a high ranking? Teamwork. We all worked together to get as high as we could. A few of us were able to build 6-8 tier one factories but most just worked with what they had. It did not matter how many we had. We all produced badges constantly and worked together to go as high as we could. There were a couple of mishaps, of course, but we moved past them and continued on. We had chat and messages constantly going. We paid attention to what was needed next and worked to get it. In the end, it was all about how we worked together as a team.
And honestly, we are a pretty competitive group so it was tons of fun! If you don't like to compete then there is nothing saying you have to.
The ONLY way to get high in the rankings is to work together.
It does not matter what the rank of the fellowship is, if they don't work together they will not rank well.
SoggyShorts
Mathematician par Excellence
There's 2 reasons you got such a high ranking actually
1. Teamwork.
2. Only 11 fellowships did more work than you.
Since you've read the thread, you should know that it's #2 that we are taking issue with.
Ashrem
Oh Wise One
While our fellowship is top 25, and we organized spreadsheets and and assigned tasks and one player put in 75 workshops and 18 new level one manufactories and took a day off work and earned hundreds of badges (Turning out 150 dwarven ale every ten minutes for most of a day, among other things.) And we got around 10k points and that was barely enough to break the top 50 on our world.
So good for you. I'm pleased that you did well. While parts of the event were enjoyable, we lost two players and feel like the prizing portion sucked giant rocks.
Risen Malchiah
Well-Known Member
It couldn't be. I see all the little people walking around my city. I am clearly their god and can build or destroy their houses at a whim.
SoggyShorts
Mathematician par Excellence
@Shellizzie
Ashrem brings up a great example of why the FS brings something new(and for us unwanted) to the game.
Effort and teamwork are no longer enough.
His FS did far more work than mine, but My FS beat his by almost 20 ranks. Why should my rewards be greater than his? Just because we are on different servers?
Ashrem brings up a great example of why the FS brings something new(and for us unwanted) to the game.
Effort and teamwork are no longer enough.
His FS did far more work than mine, but My FS beat his by almost 20 ranks. Why should my rewards be greater than his? Just because we are on different servers?
Shellizzie
Active Member
@SoggyShorts
I guess for us it was wanted and enjoyed. We were wanting another challenge that we could work together on.
I understand the frustration in the discrepancies. Not sure anything can be done to make it a seemingly more level playing field though. The only way to do it were if the prizes were point based, but then someone would complain about that too.
I guess for us it was wanted and enjoyed. We were wanting another challenge that we could work together on.
I understand the frustration in the discrepancies. Not sure anything can be done to make it a seemingly more level playing field though. The only way to do it were if the prizes were point based, but then someone would complain about that too.
SoggyShorts
Mathematician par Excellence
That's exactly how I think it should be. Works great in tournaments so I see no reason it couldn't work in the FA.
Like the @The Unbeliever said:
I just don't get why Inno can't take the approach of basing the 'extra' prize buildings off of a FS score cap?
Even if the ceiling is set stupidly high, like 5-6k+ pts for just the first reward, it would still readily encourage FS's to get more pro-active and work together as a cohesive team. (and isn't that the whole point of FA's anyways?!
And for the 'uber competitive players who enjoy roflstomping everyone else in the game, they still get the enjoyment of 'being the best', since those FS's will inevitably still come out well on top, gain even more rewards under this kind of graded scoring system, and the event will still not simply be a kindergarden level "every kid gets a shiny trophy just for showing up!" styled system.
On the other hand, if Inno were to go with something like this, I dare say that 99% of players in fellowships would be extremely happy, as hard work & team play would give EVERYONE a chance to win some cool swag.
A good number of FS's would probably still miss out on even the Lv1 reward, (especially if the 1st goalpost is set at something like 6k pts), but importantly, it's not a "why bother, only the top 1% will ever have a chance to get stuff." kind of 'kick-in-the-gut' that the current system is.
DeletedUser1016
Guest
Sounds like you did really well and all of your FS members worked really hard; and I would imagine "sacrificed" lots of time, resources and maybe even some buildings to rank #12 while only being #44 on your server. Question is what did you get for it beyond what we got, where we focused on the quickest and easiest way to get all three [3] stage awards? I would imagine you all got a 5hr instant"? Really no disrespect here, but would you do it again for another, say 8hr instant, I doubt being #44 on your server that you can get any of the top three [3] prizes?
Ultimately we ranked #60-ish somewhere and we are #13 on our server. We bailed on the idea of trying for the top prizes once all three positions were clearly dominated by our top, world fellowships, they had all completed most of all the stages in the first day. So we continued dumping badges into the pit and, surprisingly, almost ranked in the top 50!!! Now after playing once, we could easily rank in the top 50, but why? Just doesn't make sense to waste goods on the red path and "Pay" millions of good for an "Instant"?
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