Chapter 1-5 Adjustments

[Tavina]

I remember the old days when tournament was briefly a technology to be researched, back when tournament difficulty had to do with the amount of the map completed.

Interesting well maybe this new tech tree is all about people starting too many cities too fast so that they can be in the tournament with second and third cities and get into the top 100, personally I can understand having one human and one elf for the experience but having 10 cities All In fellowships is kind of odd I'm not sure what the reason is behind that why people like to do that.

 

[Maeryn]

It sounds like we might be saying the same thing in a different way there's something going on with the coins and supplies it's taking forever to get both of them coordinated to do the research tree as far as Goods I'm okay I think I'm in chapter 3 right now with my human City and I have three upgraded silk factories and for upgraded marble factories so I haven't had trouble with Goods as of yet but trying to get through the research tree is really hard because the supplies are the hardest to come by you have to spend a lot of time in the game to get those supplies doing five and 15 minute

I think I made some coin or supply rains in the MA once crafting was available and most of that issue was taken care of by having maxed out my MA right away by buying diamonds since being human meant the early supply crunch will be felt pretty bad without PoP spells on my workshops. Also, I lucked into an active map area and joined a fellowship in chapter 2 which helped boost my culture and get my MH polished regularly.

 

[Tavina]

I think I made some coin or supply rains in the MA once crafting was available and most of that issue was taken care of by having maxed out my MA right away by buying diamonds since being human meant the early supply crunch will be felt pretty bad without PoP spells on my workshops. Also, I lucked into an active map area and joined a fellowship in chapter 2 which helped boost my culture and get my MH polished regularly.

I see so the tech tree is different for Elf versus human I was wondering about that my main city is elf and so when I started the human everything was different in the tech tree so am I correct on saying that the tech tree is different for humans versus elves?

 

[Enevhar Aldarion]

I see so the tech tree is different for Elf versus human I was wondering about that my main city is elf and so when I started the human everything was different in the tech tree so am I correct on saying that the tech tree is different for humans versus elves?

There have always been some differences between human and elf research in the early chapters.

 

[StarLoad]

Almost to the End of Ch 2 in the new tech tree and I have to agree supplies are a big bottleneck, joining a Good FS that will trade to you goods at a level that prevents you from getting stalled for not having the non-boosted goods seems to be an easy workaround, even tho it should not have to be done.

Ed

 

[Tavina]

Almost to the End of Ch 2 in the new tech tree and I have to agree supplies are a big bottleneck, joining a Good FS that will trade to you goods at a level that prevents you from getting stalled for not having the non-boosted goods seems to be an easy workaround, even tho it should not have to be done.

Ed

I've been thankful and lucky I guess then that my Province map Neighbors have picked up most of my trades I spent a lot of time out of a fellowship, that's not to say that I have not been in fellowships that have helped I have but it is possible to not be in a fellowship and have good Province neighbors to pick up your trades

 

[StarLoad]

I've been thankful and lucky I guess then that my Province map Neighbors have picked up most of my trades I spent a lot of time out of a fellowship, that's not to say that I have not been in fellowships that have helped I have but it is possible to not be in a fellowship and have good Province neighbors to pick up your trades

Lets, just say that where I was dropped on the map and the server I was on was not very advantageous. Even sending personal messages to every neighbor that visited me only solicited 1 reply and it wasn't a positive one, when asking for a trade of 25T1 for 200T1and that city was in chapter 17 or 18 at least. Could not spare a polite request for 200 T1 goods.

Ed

 

[Tavina]

Lets, just say that where I was dropped on the map and the server I was on was not very advantageous. Even sending personal messages to every neighbor that visited me only solicited 1 reply and it wasn't a positive one, when asking for a trade of 25T1 for 200T1and that city was in chapter 17 or 18 at least. Could not spare a polite request for 200 T1 goods.

Ed

If trading is a problem in the game like sounding it is with what you are saying and I experienced it very early on when I first started then maybe elvenar should offer an automatic pickup after so many hours that way you do have a guaranteed trade pick up just a thought. But a little more compassion with players that have so many Goods taking the time to pick up lower level players 100 to 100 placement of goods I do it as much as possible I go ahead and collect those even if I might be running low on something.

 

[Faae]

I started a city on Beta to see this for myself.

I can kind of see having players complete the first chapter before joining a Fellowship. But the further requirement to research Fellowship Adventures, which you can't do immediately after researching Fellowship, seems over the top. I cannot come up with any rationale for it other than slowing down progression.

Blocking beginning players from performing Neighborly Help until it's researched halfway through chapter 1 - unnecessary, IMHO.

The MA unlocks at the end of Chapter I, but crafting isn't available until halfway through chapter III. Again, a slowdown. Players will be limited in the relics they can collect, so they won't be wanting to spend a lot of them on PoP or the NH bonus. EE doesn't become available until after crafting does. Further, without the spire to gain fragments, crafting is ... less than useful.

AWs don't become available until chapter IV. I don't understand this one at all, because the initial AWs are not game-breaking overpowerful. Also, unless quest / event rewards are also tweaked, a player's inventory will be stuffed with Ancient Knowledge instants by the time they reach this point - so they will build their AW and immediately be able to upgrade it to level 2. Silly!

Tournaments, as already mentioned, not available until chapter IV. This is problematic. A player joins a fellowship in chapter II, but can't really contribute to it until this point other than FAs. Tournaments are also huge source of relics, which leads me to wonder if the idea was to put a check on goods production up until this point by restricting access to relics.

And the spire is not only pushed off to chapter V, but now also requires an additional 50 kp to open up rather than becoming available after opening Advance Scouts.

In summation, the goal appears to be to slow down progression through the early game (first four chapters). I suppose the rationale is that it will keep players interested, but I believe they have gone too far with it. I think new players will get frustrated and rage-quit.

Totally Agree!

 

[Tavina]

Almost to the End of Ch 2 in the new tech tree and I have to agree supplies are a big bottleneck, joining a Good FS that will trade to you goods at a level that prevents you from getting stalled for not having the non-boosted goods seems to be an easy workaround, even tho it should not have to be done.

Ed

thanks for responding sorry it took me so long to come back in here, I am at Dwarves now and 5 almost fully upgraded workshops and still hard on the supplies, thinking I might start another WS

 

[Tavina]

Totally Agree!

I found that is was actually a good thing, it allowed me to build up my troops and armories etc. so that when it was time to research tournament and spire I was more than ready with troops and a bit skilled from practicing in provinces for expansions. so I think it is a good thing now.

 

[StarLoad]

thanks for responding sorry it took me so long to come back in here, I am at Dwarves now and 5 almost fully upgraded workshops and still hard on the supplies, thinking I might start another WS

IF, you have space 10 are much better to have.

Ed

 

[Tavina]

IF, you have space 10 are much better to have.

Ed

no space as of yet but your right I need more, but of course its the population balance, I had 8 and took it down to 5 so I could upgrade boosted goods and the remaining workshops.

 

[Maeryn]

My main city is more than halfway through chapter 7, I’m just now starting to get my boost from relics maxed out. I would have preferred to hit this spot relics prior to guest races or early on in chapter 6 so I could move away from needing to do all the provinces each week in tournament.

 

[SoulsSilhouette]

As a very old, sometimes jaded, always playing even when I'm disgruntled, two seconds from rage quitting a BROWSER GAME, veteran of this game...... I will state my opinion.

I don't think the devs are interested in our opinions. I do think they are doing things to make money, one way to do that is to offer good packages to help players along, to have the first chapters be a tutorial so that you are set up better for the later chapters, but there are certain things that they are doing that I don't understand.

I don't like the constant monkeying with the economy.
I don't like 'nerfing'. I'm still salty about the Great Nerfing of the AW's... especially my beloved Crystal Lighthouse, which really helped me when I was very young in the game.

I have not started a new city yet, as I have one in every world, but I am hesitant to start one in beta because I have very limited time.... that being said...

I have read the changes. I have read the discussion. I think everyone makes some valid points. I just want this game to succeed and be around until I'm brown bread.

My only comment on the changes is this... Inno needs to be pro-active and contact EVERY new player on a weekly basis and ACTIVELY ask for feedback. I would hope that they contact EVERY player who drops out to find out WHY. And then when they have that information, I would hope they would act on it. Market research is why some of the best games are still active and out there.

The models of this are games like SMITE, WOW, League of Legends. They have hard-core players who've been playing as long as they've been up and running. They respond to player-based research.

Knowledge is easily acquired in this age,
but using that and applying that to improve your product, is the key to success.

 

[Tauriel Dragonwood]

I've been a fan of Elvenar for many years but struggling through it because I overscouted. So, I decided to start anew with an elven city and a human city, and NOT overscout. Didn’t realize the tech tree changed. I started both cities at the same but my Human city has the new tech tree and my Elven city has the old tech tree. It didn’t matter. I was focused on not overscouting this time and only fighting in Easy/Medium provinces on the World Map.

My Human city is advancing faster than my Elven city, even though Humans can’t unlock
Tournaments until Chapter 4 and the Spire until Chapter 5. Elves can unlock the Spire in Chapter 3.

So why is my Human city advancing faster? I looked and compared the research tree in both cities and found Knowledge Points (KPs) cost much less in my Human city. This helps tremendously because new cities don’t have many KPs to begin with. Paying less KPs to unlock research should help me advance to Chapter 4 quickly to unlock Tournaments, and then Chapter 5 to unlock the Spire.

Here’s an example of what KPs cost to unlock Chapters. My Human city just needs 9 KPs to unlock Chapter 2 and 19 KPs to unlock Chapter 3. My Elven city has to pay 25 KPs to unlock Chapter 2 and 60 KPs to unlock Chapter 3. Big difference. The Elves might think this is unfair but they do get to unlock the Spire in Chapter 3, while the Humans have to wait until Chapter 5.

Wish the game developers lowered the KP cost on the research tree sooner.
Because of this change, I’m going to try and convince my friends to return to Elvenar.

 

[BrinDarby]

(hypothetical random event bldg) Gives :
Supplies(c1/2), T1(c3/4), T2(c5/6), T3(c7/10),
Mana(c11/12), & Seeds(c13/+)

While basically the new tech tree is as fast to CH5
as the old one was to CH3, who's going to go back
and readjust all the over 100 bldgs, that frankly.....
no longer make sence as to what they give & when ??
Not to mention those bldg give stuff 1-2 CHs after
most ppl start needing them ... And , the fact that
those mid CHs 7-10 are starting to take long enuff
so that ppl accrue too many bldgs, all giving T3.

Its not like you can upgrade a CH3 bldg to CH5 and
just get more T1.... (with too few exceptions), and you
can't keep underperforming bldgs (vs ur CH) because
space(land) is such a premium and req's/costs increase.

You also can't just chg everything, and screw over all
those accounts that are grandfathered into the old TechTree.
I do think this should be discussed now, since since techtree
changes have already started.

 

[StarLoad]

(hypothetical random event bldg) Gives :
Supplies(c1/2), T1(c3/4), T2(c5/6), T3(c7/10),
Mana(c11/12), & Seeds(c13/+)
...

Thank you for using complete sentences, but I still don't understand what you are getting at; maybe I need more coffee, but?

Ed

 

[Maeryn]

I've been a fan of Elvenar for many years but struggling through it because I overscouted. So, I decided to start anew with an elven city and a human city, and NOT overscout. Didn’t realize the tech tree changed. I started both cities at the same but my Human city has the new tech tree and my Elven city has the old tech tree. It didn’t matter. I was focused on not overscouting this time and only fighting in Easy/Medium provinces on the World Map.

My Human city is advancing faster than my Elven city, even though Humans can’t unlock
Tournaments until Chapter 4 and the Spire until Chapter 5. Elves can unlock the Spire in Chapter 3.

So why is my Human city advancing faster? I looked and compared the research tree in both cities and found Knowledge Points (KPs) cost much less in my Human city. This helps tremendously because new cities don’t have many KPs to begin with. Paying less KPs to unlock research should help me advance to Chapter 4 quickly to unlock Tournaments, and then Chapter 5 to unlock the Spire.

Here’s an example of what KPs cost to unlock Chapters. My Human city just needs 9 KPs to unlock Chapter 2 and 19 KPs to unlock Chapter 3. My Elven city has to pay 25 KPs to unlock Chapter 2 and 60 KPs to unlock Chapter 3. Big difference. The Elves might think this is unfair but they do get to unlock the Spire in Chapter 3, while the Humans have to wait until Chapter 5.

Wish the game developers lowered the KP cost on the research tree sooner.
Because of this change, I’m going to try and convince my friends to return to Elvenar.

Congrats, on liking the new tech tree make sure you get everything upgraded it’s easy to fall behind with upgrades since until midway through chapter 4 you don’t need to produce goods for tournament or spire.

 

[BrinDarby]

but I still don't understand what you are getting at; maybe I need more coffee, but?

Ed... while this is not rocket science, I'll assume this isn't a troll, so...

Using the older eGems pages for daily prizes... buildings would be
listed in the following manner ( examples )
bldg 1 - supp/T1/T2/T3/Mana/Seeds
bldg 2 - Supp/T3/Orcs/Seeds
bldg 3 - Supp/Mana/S1

Duhh, we all know using those terms T1 might be T1, T1+1, T1+2...
and the progressions seem to be in catagories, yet different.
Add to that some bldgs are forever a certain goods, like ohhh
Pilgrim's Woodworks.

Now, Ed .... All of the bldgs that were created before the CH adjs
would have been matched up with chapters and how advancement
works, ie- what is need'd and when, and what is avail and when.
The new Tech tree is shifting the basic necessary CH to play both
tourn/spire to CH5, not CH3. While I'm not making a judgement on
that, I am saying that will effect how any new and future bldgs
will be developed, and how that effects the older ones.

Its impossible to go back and re-do hundreds of bldgs, mainly
because those players with older accts are grandfthered into
the old tech tree, thus you'd need 2 databases of bldgs almost
1 for each type of tech tree a player has.

There already is a glut of T3 out there that ppl talk about, yet
pushing ppl even faster into CH5 means that unless there are more
bldgs from now on, that give "forever" goods , the likelyhood of
most players to have too much T3 will just get worse....

I'm not a fan of the recent "switchable" production event/evolve
bldgs, but as you progress chapters you may not want the next
good, but you do want to upgrade to get more of what you're
already getting.....

All I was trying to explore, Ed , what are/might be the knock-on
effects to older buildings usefullness... when they weren't created
with the new techtree in mind..... thats all... I didn't even take a side
good/bad........ yet.

does that explain it enuff ?