Dreamyn2
Buddy Fan Club member
Thank you, but still doesn’t answer why
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Your Elvenar Team
Feedback Chapter Migration
- Thread starter -Solaris-
- Start date
BrinDarby
Well-Known Member
Astram, I think you miss'd my point a few ways .... So,
"Difficulty" is far different than # of troops used/week ...
Increasing the SS, increases # troops used, therefore also
increases # troops need'd to be replaced... Its not about
harder/easier its cost in loss of troops. This means if everything
else is identical, a player needs more armories and/or better
facilities ( ie- barracks lvls ) to produce enuff to replace what
was used. By doing so, culture/pop/land must be shifted from
something else ( usually production ) to compensate, thus
hurting a caterer in total need'd production.
Fighting, Omg 1* vs 1*, catering those makes almost No sense
especially if you manual fight and conserve troops....
Low power vs low power is a wash, always winnable if you
correctly match up troop types....
I have (2) CH6 cities, and forcing 3-4 xtra SS+'s even on those
will be a problem in training enuff troops per week to replace
the ones I lose in normal fighting....
I'm asking Why the Split, but also Why eliminate player "choice"
even when apply'n a draconian forced upward migration in CHs.
Saying "Well, we're eliminating all optional research ( choice in
playstyles foundation ) in CH 1-6, but not for the rest of the game"
invalidates any choices players have made for Years......
Spire is shited to CH5, Tourn to CH4, MA and other things now
before that shifted...... so why punish current CH5 players by moving
them to CH6 basically, yet CH 1-4 players only to basically CH5.
There is no rational reason necessary for the split. Migration is
making CH5 necessary to play fuctonally, So just migrate players
to CH5, nothing should chg CH/research wise for anyone IN CH5 or above.
I'm not sure you play the game you mod for, and I seem to be repeating
myself with does noone any good. There's not enuff space to rehash
the whole debate on "formulas used" that Inno won't just tell us on.
Too many times, Inno mess's with early CH players in ways that are
totally insane, but because thier devs dont play in those situations, its
no different than watching "Undercover Boss" and the CEO gets a
epiphany about how really thier "corp chg" actually effected frontline
workers negatively, and without being in that situation , that CEO
never realizes thier chg was counterproductive in the real world.
It makes no sence to migrate some ppl to basically CH5, and some
basically to CH6. It makes no sense if SS+(#4,8,13,16((example)) are
optional now and the Devs couldn't just add those into the new tech
tree as still being optional....
You're darn right we, the players, (not me personally), should get a
much better explanation. Inno's MO is to use frustration during
gameplay, to induce diamond/revenue sales and usage. This forced
migration and forced research, just feeds into that MO... Almost all
the chgs in the last 2 years as far as Ive seen, is a constant slide into
frustration/paywalls rather than making Elvenar far better and more
attractive to play, thus getting new revenue from new players, not
bleeding dry your exsisting customers or frustrating them so much
so they just leave or never pay again.......
How many threads contain complaints about the "nerfing" of events
so if ya just do all the tasks, ya still can't get all the artifacts need'd or
the full set.... How many times have Mods said, "but you don't see all
the comments from ppl never on the forum, therefore you can't say
"most" ppl believe this/that"..... Do you really have access to all that
data, I'm guessing Inno only tells the Mods what they want to tell them
so neither you or I reliably can say "well most ppl say this/that". We
both however can approximate "most of the forum posters" or even
a general sentiment by the forum on any certain issue.
I was actually hoping someone like Lelanya or a few others didn't
post the %s of the SS+'s, like they do when we debate Badge reqs
and list for each one..... I could then better Astram show you the
negative impact.
I personally fight the 1st 5 Spire encounters, and the 1st 5 tourn
encounters in each round, and cater everything else. Without adding
land, or changing my online times, if my SS goes from 78 -> 160,
then my weekly loss in troops will be 2x what is is now, how exactly
do I compensate, when I have no space pop/culture/land to do so with ??
When catering costs increase simply due to being CH5 not CH3,
again without those things how do I compensate production ?? I cant.
Elvenar is a player specific city setup, for ALL players.... arbitrary general
changes will force players like me to re-do my whole city, and then I'll
still be worse off in troop/resource production thru no fault of my own.
Is Inno gonna give me 100 teleports for free to do that, uhhhhh No....
why didn't Inno K.I.S.S this whole migration.... everyone to beginning
of CH5, and optional researches are still optional ?? That does the
least amount of harm/confusion/frustration to the most amount of ppl......
what's wrong with that Astram ??
Brin, First off, quit taking lessons from AJ on overly loquacious responses. So I will start by saying up front I will likely miss some of your points and some I will disregard entirely as not being relevant or within my scope to answer.
Here we go ... Brin, let us get the elephant off the table first; you are by no means a representative player in chapters 1-5, and you are the exception to the rule.
1. The majority of players do not park in chapters 3-4 just to play the Spire and tourney, but you did for what several years? This puts you in a position to focus and become super efficient at both in ways a "normal player cannot.
2. Your knowledge of how to legally "exploit" the weakness of the game in chapters 3-4 to your benefit is unquestionable.
3. The majority of players that fight use Auto not manual, and the majority of players in chapters 1-5 cater as they don't have enough troops in breadth or quantity to battle even 1* v 1*.The majority of players and all new players that are in chapters 1-5 will most likely have no clue how to manually fight nor how to correctly assign troops to battle. ( you may dispute any or all of this but I am sure that I am correct and many will accept this as presumed facts).
4. Optional Techs, being auto-completed for chapter 1-5 consists of [Ch1 - Expansion 1] [Ch2 - Expansion 3, SSU 5] [Ch3 - Expansion 6, Expansion 8, Expansion 9] [Ch4 - Expansion 11] [Ch5 - Expansion 16, Expansion 20, SSU15] Based on this only 2 SSU's are what you are complaining about that will adversely affect fighting or catering. Sorry but I don't see how this is a significant harm, and since at most it makes your Squad size larger, and for players in chapters 1-5, this is more of a benefit to an average player, not to the exceptional one like you.
There are less than 10,000 registered forum members, and I doubt more than 500 are active and less than 100 regulars. I do not know how many active players there are and would not be given that information to share anyways, but we here are a clear minority; that is a fact. We are by the nature of our play, the more knowledgeable ones and see all the pluses and minuses of the changes. Many are a benefit to some but a negative to others. The only way to say a change benefits all is literally impossible. The exception to this is usually a game-breaking change like if they made the "Fire Phoenix" available for all even if you had one.
And I will close with these tidbits, INNO does not have to tell us in advance or at all about their game; are they the most open, no but they are far from being completely secretive. It must be clear by now that I just mod the forums in-between COD or WoW sessions. Lastly, Brin I hate making long posts so if you want to reply keep it short and simple.
[EDITED FOR TYPOS]
Here we go ... Brin, let us get the elephant off the table first; you are by no means a representative player in chapters 1-5, and you are the exception to the rule.
1. The majority of players do not park in chapters 3-4 just to play the Spire and tourney, but you did for what several years? This puts you in a position to focus and become super efficient at both in ways a "normal player cannot.
2. Your knowledge of how to legally "exploit" the weakness of the game in chapters 3-4 to your benefit is unquestionable.
3. The majority of players that fight use Auto not manual, and the majority of players in chapters 1-5 cater as they don't have enough troops in breadth or quantity to battle even 1* v 1*.The majority of players and all new players that are in chapters 1-5 will most likely have no clue how to manually fight nor how to correctly assign troops to battle. ( you may dispute any or all of this but I am sure that I am correct and many will accept this as presumed facts).
4. Optional Techs, being auto-completed for chapter 1-5 consists of [Ch1 - Expansion 1] [Ch2 - Expansion 3, SSU 5] [Ch3 - Expansion 6, Expansion 8, Expansion 9] [Ch4 - Expansion 11] [Ch5 - Expansion 16, Expansion 20, SSU15] Based on this only 2 SSU's are what you are complaining about that will adversely affect fighting or catering. Sorry but I don't see how this is a significant harm, and since at most it makes your Squad size larger, and for players in chapters 1-5, this is more of a benefit to an average player, not to the exceptional one like you.
There are less than 10,000 registered forum members, and I doubt more than 500 are active and less than 100 regulars. I do not know how many active players there are and would not be given that information to share anyways, but we here are a clear minority; that is a fact. We are by the nature of our play, the more knowledgeable ones and see all the pluses and minuses of the changes. Many are a benefit to some but a negative to others. The only way to say a change benefits all is literally impossible. The exception to this is usually a game-breaking change like if they made the "Fire Phoenix" available for all even if you had one.
And I will close with these tidbits, INNO does not have to tell us in advance or at all about their game; are they the most open, no but they are far from being completely secretive. It must be clear by now that I just mod the forums in-between COD or WoW sessions. Lastly, Brin I hate making long posts so if you want to reply keep it short and simple.
[EDITED FOR TYPOS]
Last edited:
Deleted User - 850238979
Guest
Am I detecting a little spice here? I tried to read brin's comment but had a stroke when I saw the length so it could be I've missed some context buuuuut...
The game seems to be designed in such a way that "exploiting" opportunities is a must. And I'm not talking about exploiting other players, just that the game has sweet spots that any self-respecting player will make good use of.
no spice just fact, as you well pointed out and I am giving credit where credit is due for his accomplishments as a chapter 3 player, in the past.
Deleted User - 850238979
Guest
Thank you for clarifying, good sir.
Deborah M
Oh Wise One
This is getting ridiculous. It has been a long time, well known fact that chapter 4 was the sweet spot for push accounts, especially the ones that were entire fellowships being used explicitly to feed a main city. While all of those players that I was aware of are gone, I’m thinking plenty of people remember discussions about that. Honestly, if there are still chapter 4 push account fellowships out there, I think it is kind of funny that they will have to regroup after they are migrated 
BrinDarby
Well-Known Member
No, not if you mean it being personal or argumentative.
That surely was not my intention, so Astram if it came
across as that, I'm very sorry.
SS+4 CH2, SS+9 CH3, SS+15 CH5 .... thats 3 not 2, but you
prolly chose the race I'm not, therein lies the difference.
Yet pushing me into CH5, means (2) optional and (2) manditory
SS+'s out of 10. That will more than x2 my SS, with everything
else staying the same. ( troop/resource production )
Even I'm guilty of that due to time restaints, but I'm not a
CH3 Elvenar dude, I'm a Hex board strategy game player
for ohh about 40 years, whenever I can I always manual fight.
Correct, the majority just sees them as
farms, atleastI actively play all 4 worlds I have.... (2) CH6, (2) CH3. There's
far more diam farms out there than you think there are.
I think he learned it from me, hahahahaha.
I have a Racing city, that has none of the goodies my other
cities have. Yet Astram, you think the only perspective I bring
is my 4 yr old main City's..... that premise is incorrect.
So you're not a hardcore Elvenar player. Many other ppl than me
in high chapters have also pointed out that players that eat/sleep/live
Elvenar have far more relateable points and insight, than casual
players do. These players will see things ( truthfull things ) that other
players won't. @Lelanya , @Enevhar Aldarion , @Henroo , heck even
@Darielle are examples of players with intimate knowledge of this
game, Far more than myself, yet @times have said some of the same
things I have. They certainly don't agree with me on everything either.
You take Inno/Devs @ thier word, you have to, you're a Mod... I on the
other hand, take them by thier actions and how it effects the game.
I'm sympathetic to your stance of what you Can and Cannot say here.
I still think you miss'd my point, but ohh well.....
BrinDarby
Well-Known Member
@Deborah M ,
all my cities are in different worlds, not push accts at all.
all my cities are in different worlds, not push accts at all.
Lelanya
Scroll-Keeper, Keys to the Gems
I am trying to fight tournament with my small city here and there, but -
I just got slammed by a now former mage on EN1, for wasting time on too many cities. This little drama cost me 3 weeks of work on this issue.
Now. I cannot collect data to prove or disprove any points, I am not MinMax Gamer by any means, my brain sort of locks up over this kind of thing. How it works for me is I go out and do the same things over and over multiple times and compare my overall experience.
That said, I also suspect that the difficulty of encounters ramps up if a player pushes through research, and gets relief the longer it's left fallow. And now I've left my wee test city fallow for a stretch, *sigh*. If I am correct, tthen my fights should be getting easier now.
I just got slammed by a now former mage on EN1, for wasting time on too many cities. This little drama cost me 3 weeks of work on this issue.
Now. I cannot collect data to prove or disprove any points, I am not MinMax Gamer by any means, my brain sort of locks up over this kind of thing. How it works for me is I go out and do the same things over and over multiple times and compare my overall experience.
That said, I also suspect that the difficulty of encounters ramps up if a player pushes through research, and gets relief the longer it's left fallow. And now I've left my wee test city fallow for a stretch, *sigh*. If I am correct, tthen my fights should be getting easier now.
Deborah M
Oh Wise One
I was not talking about you. I was talking about one well known use for parked chapter 4 cities. Actually, thinking about it now, I’m really surprised you don’t see the positive side from the perception of not liking push cities. Haven’t you spoken out against pushing multiple times? I’m thinking that is something we agree on. The ones like I described were really disheartening to me.
BrinDarby
Well-Known Member
Yes
Sprite1313
Well-Known Member
My cities finally got migrated this morning, after my earliest login. My biggest complaint is that they auto-switched my MA production from CCs to Inspiring Meditation. I’m glad I logged in not long after it happened, or I would have lost even more CCs.
Alram
Flippers just flip
How many CCs did you lose?
crackie
Chef, Scroll-Keeper, Buddy's #1 Fan
It would be nice if the system gave players a message after they got moved to notify them of what happened versus expecting them to remember an announcement from almost a month ago. What if players don’t remember or never saw the announcement because you have early chapter malaise? When your city gets moved on the map, they give you an alert message. I can’t believe they scoot people up entire chapters without notifications and expect them to know what is going on with the game, esp if they aren’t forum regulars. Oh wait, I can believe it.
Silver Lady
Well-Known Member
Well all my cities (all S&D or higher) got the new Tech Tree last night. And all the MMs that were still in the production queue in the MA got changed to IMs. And the order of the list of enchantments has changed putting CC smack in the middle, why?
Enevhar Aldarion
Oh Wise One
Well all my cities (all S&D or higher) got the new Tech Tree last night. And all the MMs that were still in the production queue in the MA got changed to IMs. And the order of the list of enchantments has changed putting CC smack in the middle, why?
Because that is the order they are researched on the new tech tree, so the order was changed in the MA to match.