How is this not "pushing"?

[SoggyShorts]

I think you just gave the perfect justification to all push accounts.

It blows my mind how differently people can view things.
I post a detailed explanation of how even pretty innocent levels of pushing can have a negative impact on the game and the players involved and you see it as justification for doing so.
I'm not saying you are wrong, it's just....not the response I thought it would get.
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Many people in this thread seem to be having trouble separating the obvious pushing problems from the rest.

Is it bad pushing if you make 25 dummy accounts to donate KP to yourself? Yes, That's what started this thread, and also what brought it back.
Is a KP swap pushing? Obviously not, give your head a shake.

Other things that may look like pushing might not be- like KP pools, or giving a smaller FS member some goods so that they can get the next tournament chest for you. Even giving a FS member goods to just help them along isn't cheating as they are on your team, and they are a real person playing a real account (just be careful that they don't become dependant)

 

[DeletedUser5800]

Is it bad pushing if you make 25 dummy accounts to donate KP to yourself? Yes

I agree with that, and I think most people do... where all this other stuff comes in and why it is important is if you fix the thing we most agree on how many other people does it hurt? If I trade goods for Kp that's fair game... but where is the line? The trade market forces a line goods to goods, but there is no regulation in place for making an out of market deal, if I could buy 10 Kp for 10K gems but someone offered me 10Kp for 4K gems on 0 star trade... is that wrong? (probably not, but there is a line somewhere) All these personal moral game ethic questions are fairly relative. So let's ignore all the rest and say there are 2 groups.
1: People that create accounts just to push the main and never down push back to them.
2: Everyone else that does anything else.
I can't see a solution that hurts group 1 without hurting more of group 2... I doubt they can either.
Even if they have IP address donation block in place, how many wives/husbands/children whatever are there compared to group 1?
Couldn't group 1 just create push accounts from an easy to obtain second IP address? Yes they could.
I started out pro fix... I now understand why it's easier to ignore... that's what this thread has done.
Empathy for the Dev's! Yuk.

 

[DeletedUser]

Couldn't group 1 just create push accounts from an easy to obtain second IP address? Yes they could.

From another location, from their work, school, or a library, but they couldn't do their pushing from home, because of the IP block.

Incidentally, if the FCC repeals Net Neutrality rules next month, this all may very well be a moot point.

 

[DeletedUser5800]

From another location, from their work, school, or a library, but they couldn't do their pushing from home, because of the IP block.

There are multiple ways to get more than one public IP address from your house, from upgrading to business and adding devices (obviously not optimal) to shadier ways (which I won't go in to). But if a person really wants to get around it, they can. I'm sure it would have an impact on your average person here... but it wouldn't stop it completely and news would get around on how to side step it. It always does.

 

[Pheryll]

It blows my mind how differently people can view things.
I post a detailed explanation of how even pretty innocent levels of pushing can have a negative impact on the game and the players involved and you see it as justification for doing so.

I do not like the conclusion any more than you. But I am starting to feel the developers see things differently.

Is it bad pushing if you make 25 dummy accounts to donate KP to yourself? Yes, That's what started this thread, and also what brought it back.

And here is where I think the developers depart from the common reasoning. When balance is the only thing looked for, then there is no intrinsically right or wrong behavior. An extreme on one end can be balanced with another extreme. If giving goods in large bulk at 4 to 1 trades can be detrimental to the game, then it might well be positive and beneficial if knowledge points were given back in return. We see things as two wrongs do not make a right, but I am not sure the developers are thinking the same way.

 

[DeletedUser5800]

I've been thinking all day on how they could change something that didn't hurt anyone but could benefit avid non-pushers and what I came up with is if they were to add a lock out option to AWs so that the player had the option once per level to unlock it allowing others to donate or leave it locked so only they could donate. Locked would be default and it could only be unlocked while at 0 KP. While locked it would take 50% less KP to upgrade. So people could leave them locked and do it themselves for half the cost or open it up and do whatever they do now. Thoughts? (Not that it actually matters because they never implement any of this stuff)

 

[DeletedUser]

I've been thinking all day on how they could change something that didn't hurt anyone but could benefit avid non-pushers and what I came up with is if they were to add a lock out option to AWs so that the player had the option once per level to unlock it allowing others to donate or leave it locked so only they could donate. Locked would be default and it could only be unlocked while at 0 KP. While locked it would take 50% less KP to upgrade. So people could leave them locked and do it themselves for half the cost or open it up and do whatever they do now. Thoughts? (Not that it actually matters because they never implement any of this stuff)

Personally, I love this idea. Start that suggestion thread, LD.

 

[SoggyShorts]

I've been thinking all day on how they could change something that didn't hurt anyone but could benefit avid non-pushers and what I came up with is if they were to add a lock out option to AWs so that the player had the option once per level to unlock it allowing others to donate or leave it locked so only they could donate. Locked would be default and it could only be unlocked while at 0 KP. While locked it would take 50% less KP to upgrade. So people could leave them locked and do it themselves for half the cost or open it up and do whatever they do now. Thoughts? (Not that it actually matters because they never implement any of this stuff)

If this were implemented, they might as well perma-lock all AW. It would be extremely foolish to unlock your AW to allow others to donate if it costs double--The only way it would be better for you is if you had push accounts. If this is meant to deter push accounts, why give them the option at all?

 

[DeletedUser5800]

It would be extremely foolish to unlock your AW to allow others to donate if it costs double--The only way it would be better for you is if you had push accounts.

Let's change 'foolish' to 'inefficient' and then put it in the context of the whole conversation... I think many people would unlock it and enjoy all the same things they do now, pushers would either keep pushing or convert, and all of us of the efficient playstyle would lock it happily rather than be tempted to make alts. If you are in a swap maybe you decide it's worth the runes to unlock it, if you want to interact maybe you decide to unlock it. Lots of reasons one might go against our math. It just adds an option that benefits the people that do the exact opposite of pushing, stays the same for everyone else.

 

[Sir Squirrel]

A down fall of this is you couldn't get the rune from being top helper on another players AW. Early in the game that is how I got a few of my runes for AW's I wanted, but that was before broken rune shards were introduced as prizes in tourney's though!

 

[DeletedUser5800]

A down fall of this is you couldn't get the rune from being top helper on another players AW.

If a person were in a swap where everyone unlocked them they could... or if they leveled their alts and built AWs. LOL
But yes there would be a mild trade off and it might create a scenario where people kept theirs locked and sniped runes from unlocked ones which would indeed be a downside.

 

[SoggyShorts]

Let's change 'foolish' to 'inefficient'

Yeah Yeah,

"In my humble opinion, please don't take this the wrong way, but perhaps, just maybe, one might have a slight mathematical advantage over the other, but please don't take this as me pushing my biases on you, feel free to explore your own playstyle, we are all unique snowflakes, and everyone's feelings matter"

Better?

I feel like I need to replace my signature with a disclaimer on these forums lately. It's like I can't tell people that 100 is more than 50 without someone being offended because they like the way 50 looks, and I'm oppressing them with my "higher numbers are higher" elitism.

 

[DeletedUser5800]

Better?

Sure!
...and for the record I agree with you 99% of the time, I joined the forums almost a year ago mostly because of your post! I've quoted you to my FS so many times you're like a weird uncle in our family.
BUT I also get the impression that a lot of people like to be inefficient for various reason and since I like to keep my rank in double digits I also support that.

 

[DeletedUser]

I feel like I need to replace my signature with a disclaimer on these forums lately. It's like I can't tell people that 100 is higher than 50 without someone being offended because they like the way 50 looks, and I'm oppressing them with my "higher numbers are higher" elitism.

"The Earth is flat! Flat, I tell you!"

But really...this thread has been running for five months, and we're repeating ourselves. It's not a thread anymore, it's a franchise, complete with its own SJW.

Its saving grace has been some great lines of dialogue:

I've quoted you to my FS so many times you're like a weird uncle in our family.

You mean, like Fester?

"Coogan or Lloyd? These timelines are so confusing..."

 

[SoggyShorts]

"The Earth is flat! Flat, I tell you!"

I've quoted you to my FS so many times you're like a weird uncle in our family.

 

[DeletedUser]

Well, you know, if the Earth really was flat, cats would have pushed everything off of it by now.

 

[DeletedUser5800]

 

[Sir Squirrel]

I have one member who is purposely going slow to avoid having Orc's in his city, lol. He donates most of his KP's to the KP chain or directly to other members wonders!

 

[DeletedUser3507]

See this on Platinum Leaf Facebook page ..

It's a BIG warning...

 

[DeletedUser5800]

See this on Platinum Leaf Facebook page ..

I wonder who could possibly be doing it? Maybe that person that said they would and then were told not to and said they would do it anyway.... maybe.